It was 25-30k going from BONESTOCK to fully modified. We have taken a really nicely modified Evo and bumped it to this build level for just under 20k.

Aaron

 

Thanks for the hard numbers. It is always good to have solid input from a top shop who does these kinds of builds on a regular basis and most importantly doesn't cut corners.

***on a side note the comment in the previous post 'they must have no idea' was complete sarcasm if it wasn't apparent. I just removed it to avoid confusion***

 

Well for one the stock ecu is plenty capable of 800+hp, i mean MAP made over 1000hp on stock ecu. And you were right the suspension prices you mentioned were way high. you can just get the STM spec D2 coilovers for $1500 which are perfectly good for the street and strip. and the turbo blanket and other heat things is user preference as they are not needed but helpful. Sorry if my post came off as a little harsh but,most of your stuff you posted is actually right. I guess postings on forums from work isnt too healthy

 

It's the little parts that end up running your build price way up. You start throwing in billet cranks, motor mounts, an fittings, braided lines, **** adds up and keeps going. It's how my build is. Upwards of 30k. And it was modded before. Keep in mind ur never done with the build. There's always something else that will need attention after the next task is finished. My next big ticket item, CBRE wheel bearing kit. $1600+ right there, easy money. I'm already expecting to snap some axles and maybe a t-case this year.

 

I am looking to build 700WHP car and going to add everything once I am done. Lets see how much it comes to. I think you can hit 30K pretty easy for 800WHP.

 

Have you ever ridden in/driven a stock ecu car with that kind of power? They drive really well when you have the throttle pegged and thats about it. Think of it this way, the stock ecu only ever really runs on MAF. The 'speed density' conversions are just converting the signal making the ecu think that it is still on MAF with the same amount of data points (which isn't sufficient at these levels). They are not designed to run true speed density like a standalone. This works fairly well for moderate power modifications, and not well for high power builds.

Oddly enough I had this argument with one of my RL friends who was in the middle of a 700whp build last summer (he thought he wanted to stick with stock ECU), and got into this conversation with Jordan and me at MAP in person (small world right). MAP did make the power on a stock ecu, but talk to Jordan (their tuner), he would never recommend stock ECU tuning for 600-700whp+. The drivability difference between stock ECU and even base line AEM units is night and day. The funny thing is my friend stuck w/ the stock ECU (even after the conversation with Jordan and myself) got a few hundred miles on the build last year and now his car is at MAP getting tuned on an AEM.

Also, think of it this way - when you have 25k+ dumped into a motor/supporting mods, do you really want to run on a system that is based on tricking the ECU on a system that is designed for the STOCK motor only, when you can buy something like a PRO-EFI (that you can use for any of your future projects) that will protect your motor when stupid **** happens - i.e. making on the fly map changes, ethanol content changes in real time, timing retard based on knock, cutting the engine when oil pressure drops, etc etc etc. as well as giving you much finer tuning with 4d maps with 5 level boost control (via knob) based on current ethanol content.

At the end of the day it's personal preference, but when you can buy an AEM V1 for $500-600 and just plug it in and go I don't see any reason to use a stock ECU (when you are talking about this level of build)

 

Well said. There are great options. I prefer aem because of its support.

 

Just buy my already built 894whp Evo for $30K.

 

I'd sell mine for the right $$$ but $30k definitely isn't it . Best of luck on your sale!

 

I had my fun with the car, I just want something else now.

Mainly something with >4 cylinders.

 

100% wrong and bs info. the stock ecu runs fine on any amount of power build. you clearly experienced bad tuning on the stock ecu to say that kind of garbage about it.

i have 6766 cars that drive smoother then stock on stock ecu + speed density.

 

The simple matter is this - the stock ecu cars will not drive as well at these levels as stand alone. The amount of fine tuning is severely limited. Even someone who has no experience on tuning can look at the differences in the amount of data points used and tell you that you are wrong. If the stock ECU did everything, there would be no market for standalones on our platform.

I would put large amounts of money on the fact that you can't make a stock ecu 800whp+ car run as well on the stock ecu (evo VIII/IX) than it will on a fully tuned PRO-EFI or AEM for that matter...and I'm not talking about idle and 100% throttle. The stuff inbetween is where the flaws start coming out in stock ECU tuning.

Your stock ecu tunes are very good as proven by results, but go drive a real road course at 9/10-10/10ths and let me know how your mid corner throttle characteristics fair compared to properly tuned stand alone. (on a high-horsepower build)

 

again 100% wrong. i can make the stock ecu run way smoother then any standalone and if not smoother, then the same identically.

your information is extremely wrong and you should stop posting. you're making yourself look foolish.

let me ask you this. is there something magical a standalone can do when running in open loop that a stock cant?

standalones defy physics? at the end of the day the driveability comes down to RPM control, and AFR. as i said, if the tuner knows what hes doing the car drives like butter on the stock ecu no matter what setup you throw on the car.

 

It has nothing to do with defying physics. You are trying to say that there is no difference in computing power between a commodore 64 and a modern computer....The new stand alones compute faster, can make changes faster, and have massively more data points which equates to better engine control and overall tune. Not to mention a vast array of engine protection measures.

Obviously AEM/halltech/motec/proefi/autronic have flawed business plans because the stock ECU can do everything that their units offer

SD on stock ECU is a flawed system that can be made to work very well - again as proven by your tunes. BUT you are tricking the ECU which is still operating as if it is on MAF...

edit*** In any event - done arguing about this - anxiously awaiting gt35r or larger tscomp tuned track (road racing) car results

 

what does the fact that its not a true speed density have to do with anything? The entire reason people go speed density is to remove the restriction from the intake tract. If you can do that, then mission accomplished.

Yes the other standalones have better hardware. faster processing, more memory, and so forth. also have better options to play with that most wont use, but they are there.

boost comp on AEM is nice. i tune all the EMS's and im well aware of their features. being able to watch live tracing, or tune the car without having the car turn off and so forth..

none of that helps driveability. believe it or not, but it doesn't. the stock ecu has enough power to drive just fine on these cars. the faster hardware isn't going to give it the upper hand like you think it will.

Have the best tuner you can find tune you on AEM, then ill retune you on stock ecu and prove it to you.

there are two 6766 cars i did that were on AEM, that i put on stock ecu and they were 100% impressed with how much better the driveability was, and one was from your tuner.