There's a lot of us "simple minded" people around that's very happy with the AP. Maybe ignorance is bliss, or maybe it's just a case of it works without problems - so we don't have to spend our days tweaking.

It's got to be a magical tune that makes 400 whp with just a tune and intake. I'm sure you are leaving out quite a bit of other hardware.

 

Buschur tune $575, AP $595, wheres the savings? https://secure.buschurracing.com/cat...oducts_id=1205

Plus with AP I can go back to stock without have to mail in my ECU.

 

good stab at buschur but you unfortunately ruined your credibility with your last statement.

 

David wants to sell you a tune. He has a vested interest in you seeing things his way. If you're comparing AP OTS maps to a mail-in (stock) tune from just about anyone, there's really not going to be a big difference between them.

Take a look at the staged maps that Cobb offers for the AP. If you see yourself working within those guidelines, then you can get considerable mileage out of the AP.

If you value convenience over extracting every last bit of performance out of your vehicle, the AP will also be a good fit.

If you're planning on throwing a lot of different parts that don't fit into the Cobb staged map guidelines, or insist on extracting every last tenth of a HP out of your car (hell the AP might still work depending on when you do it), I might then suggest that you start looking for a good tuner in your area and buy a Tactrix cable.

 

Don't care.

 

Unfortunately David Buschur ruined his integrity long time ago with his jabs at Vishnu. Now Cobb is on his bad guy list.

 

I had a custom dyno tune from David, and my map wasn't locked in any way. I doubt his mail in tune locks the ECU, though I guess I don't really know.

Most of the mail-in-one-size-fit-all tunes are going to be pretty damn similar, simply due to the safety component. There's only so much mojo they can do without any logging whatsoever, without blowing some random car up.

Taking jabs at Vishnu ruined his credibility? What sort of credibility did Vishnu have? If you don't like BR, so be it, but out of all the things David has done to **** people off, taking jabs at VISHNU has *GOT* to be one of the most minimal of his numerous sins and transgressions upon this Earth.

Next your going to say JROD's dislike of Z-chip make him un-credible or something.

 

AP = A $600 paper weight.

Once you buy it you still need to get tuned OTS maps are not my thing as every car is different.

Open source is the way to go Tephra mods, awesome logging and much much more to come for you X guys im sure. Sure your gonna try to defend your $600 purchase

 

DB is trying to help you guys out. Cobb's not a bad guy they make a great product unfortunately for your platform it's an inferior product

Edit: Who is Vishnu You mean like the Xede

 

So what is best?

 

ECUFlash (Tuning Software)

EVOSCAN (Datalogger)

 

Honestly it really comes down to personal preference, how involved you want to get, and what you plan to do with your car. I think mrMTB phrased it very well.

I've personally always been a big supporter of ECUFlash in the Evo 8/9 and is what I always ran (with all the Tephra hacks), but I can at least see the merits of the AccessPort. I've spent quite a bit of time talking with the guys up at Cobb and I will say they really know their stuff (as do many other shops on this forum). One of the biggest advantages to the AP that I see right now is their work with the SST tables.

 

David: I will take a check for 1000 dollars for a laptop and tactrix cable (and wideband, as many tuners require that for open source). And then I'll have to pay for the tune on top of all that.

Or I can have my 400 dollar AP.

Which is better? Open source for sure. Which is more cost effective for a stock or nearly stock (staged along COBB's OTS maps) car? The AP by a long shot.

Unless you happen to already own a laptop running Windows and don't need a wideband. Then you just need a tactrix cable (170 last I looked) and to pay for the tune (probably 100+ if you're getting an "ots" email map). Then you also have to carry your laptop around with you if you want to change maps. And the tuner is going to charge you extra each map you get. My AP has 10+ maps on it that it came with, some I can't use because they are stage 2 or 93 octane. But if ever the need came, my device is right in my center console and I can plug it it and change the tune super easily.

I went on vacation, changed my map to economy mode for the freeway driving, got off the freeway, changed it to 93 (91 was my old map) because I was at a place filling up with 93 octane. Then we stopped at the hotel which was valet only and I put the car in valet mode. Picked it up the next day and switched it back. All with a device that fits in my pocket.

My point is simply that your statement on "less money" is completely incorrect. You are assuming people already have a laptop all ready to go. Sure it's going to be a better tune and better option, especially for crazy custom mods... But for the average Joe who doesn't have tons of dollars to spend, the AP is a great option.

I wish it had been available when I got tuned by Al with my Evo, would've saved me 500 wasted dollars and a WHOLE lot of wasted time. I don't plan on modding any of my cars past TBE for a very long time, there's no point in dealing with the hassle of an open source tune.

 

My biggest upside to the AP is that you can sell it afterwards and make some of your money back. Not so much with a protune...

 

Some slight rebuttles here:

Nothing can save you from picking a bad tuner, or someone who doesn't care about their product.

As mentioned in the other thread, Cobb definitely stepped their game up since the CT9A, but if nothing else their horrible performance and support there left me with a very bad taste in my mouth.