best way to lower and maintain ride quality?
Jan 6, 2011, 12:41 PM
#31
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i will look into this Kracka. Ever since i talked to you when i was "supposed" to get stationed in Funky Town, I have followed your advice on the threads you comment on. You have never steered me wrong
This was awesome input to this thread, and on the nose of what i was looking for. Thanks for your input, as i didn't know that every time you adjust height you needed an alignment. I do NOT want to drop like crazy, just enough to even out the front wheel gap.
I am one that religiously shuns the ebay crap and the sort. I am not broke, and like to save up and get the good stuff the first time. I have never heard of kw's, ast's or olhins. I am going to jump on the google train right now and see if i can find these. Thanks for your input.
Coilovers are simply a shock with a threaded body so you can adjust ride height and use standardized coilover springs. There is nothing really different beyond that, it's just height adjustable vs. a standard shock and spring that's fixed height.
Coilovers aren't always damping adjustable, but usually are. Although you can go "softer" and "stiffer" it's important to consider that the spring rate you are using means there is a sweet spot....too soft for a certain spring rate will ride like poo and so will too stiff. You have a little bit of range to play with, but cranking them all the way stiff or soft is not the way it should be done.
Also, damping is usually not a simple stiff vs. soft thing in reality....better dampers have more complex valving characteristics that make them handle well while still soaking up bumps nicely. On the other hand, some coilovers with say 30 clicks of adjustment may sound nice on paper, but really all 30 clicks suck because they're just poorly designed.
It's often claimed that everything is better "matched" in a coilover vs. a lowering spring with stock shock, but that may not always be the case. One brand that's fairly popular in the budget segment uses the same exact damper insert for the EVO, Subaru Impreza, and Subaru Legacy. A big reason why they're in the budget segment....
Coilovers in general are firmer than lowering springs as they're usually designed with the track in mind, however too much of a drop can really impact ride quality with either coilovers or springs. The big drop affects cars on just springs more than coilovers because coilovers uaually have a shortened shock body to allow for the drop. Suspension travel is fairly limited on these cars, so don't go too crazy.
Also, everytime you adjust ride height on a coilover you need an alignment, so don't expect to do it every weekend.
- Andrew
Coilovers aren't always damping adjustable, but usually are. Although you can go "softer" and "stiffer" it's important to consider that the spring rate you are using means there is a sweet spot....too soft for a certain spring rate will ride like poo and so will too stiff. You have a little bit of range to play with, but cranking them all the way stiff or soft is not the way it should be done.
Also, damping is usually not a simple stiff vs. soft thing in reality....better dampers have more complex valving characteristics that make them handle well while still soaking up bumps nicely. On the other hand, some coilovers with say 30 clicks of adjustment may sound nice on paper, but really all 30 clicks suck because they're just poorly designed.
It's often claimed that everything is better "matched" in a coilover vs. a lowering spring with stock shock, but that may not always be the case. One brand that's fairly popular in the budget segment uses the same exact damper insert for the EVO, Subaru Impreza, and Subaru Legacy. A big reason why they're in the budget segment....
Coilovers in general are firmer than lowering springs as they're usually designed with the track in mind, however too much of a drop can really impact ride quality with either coilovers or springs. The big drop affects cars on just springs more than coilovers because coilovers uaually have a shortened shock body to allow for the drop. Suspension travel is fairly limited on these cars, so don't go too crazy.
Also, everytime you adjust ride height on a coilover you need an alignment, so don't expect to do it every weekend.
- Andrew
actually, an advantage of KWs over some of the other COs is that they are coated and use polyurethane spring pearches making them resistant during to the salt during the winter. Mine literally like new once I washed them off last spring.
Not sure about the other manufacturers in this regard. The Ohlins might also be similar material.
Ride comfort between the KWs with custom spring rates and Ohlins was very close (another poster has them on his car) over the same roads (differences could be down to different tires/wheels etc).
Swift springs are noticably softer and have a tendency to bottom. If I went with them I would get MR Bilsteins and revalve them. The original swift offerings was a down grade in terms of handling.
BTW (andrew is probably too nice to say this), I have ridden on stance, BC, and Megans and they are not in the same league as KWs, ASTs, Olhins.
do it right the first time and save up until you can afford the good stuff.
Not sure about the other manufacturers in this regard. The Ohlins might also be similar material.
Ride comfort between the KWs with custom spring rates and Ohlins was very close (another poster has them on his car) over the same roads (differences could be down to different tires/wheels etc).
Swift springs are noticably softer and have a tendency to bottom. If I went with them I would get MR Bilsteins and revalve them. The original swift offerings was a down grade in terms of handling.
BTW (andrew is probably too nice to say this), I have ridden on stance, BC, and Megans and they are not in the same league as KWs, ASTs, Olhins.
do it right the first time and save up until you can afford the good stuff.
Jan 6, 2011, 01:08 PM
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Ok so i have been reading up on this a lot, and all companies claim that they maintain a good ride quality, but what is the best way to lower enough to take out the front wheel gap and still maintain stock ride quality (or better)?
coilovers?
springs?
springs and shocks?
Also i just want to lower enough to get rid of the monster truck gap on the front, so what should i lower the front? and also what should i lower to back to keep it even?
thanks a bunch!
coilovers?
springs?
springs and shocks?
Also i just want to lower enough to get rid of the monster truck gap on the front, so what should i lower the front? and also what should i lower to back to keep it even?
thanks a bunch!
Jan 6, 2011, 01:42 PM
#34
Jan 6, 2011, 01:42 PM
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I really enjoy my H&Rs for daily driving and weekend fun. For a coilover, they're pretty comfortable and communicate the road nicely. They use Bilstein internals, so you know they're going to be good quality and even though they're non-adjustable, I'd take them over the budget brands anyday. Ran BC's before and none of the 30-32 settings they had were as nice as how the H&Rs come.
Jan 6, 2011, 05:47 PM
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Had BC Racing coils on my last ride and they are rubbish. Reasonable price but for a bit more i would hav opted for KWs or Ohlins. Not worth it if ur car sees winter, and if your not fussy about ride height. I had to do ano alignment every year.in the end i should have stayed w my tanabe nf210s on stock shocks. I would recommend the eibach pro kits, never heard bad things about them. Has anyone driven w them w winter wheels? If so how is the drop?
Jan 13, 2011, 09:47 AM
#43
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There is some good info in here and some really bad info
First and foremost, you have to be alot more specific as to what you're trying to accomplish? Lower rideheight only? Any track days planned? If so, how often, and what other mods will you be planning to accomodate such events (tires, etc?)
You have to be really careful who you listen to, because most people don't have much basis for comparison. So you end up with alot of "I have x and it's great" - where that really tells you nothing.
Second, what is your budget? A customer just looking at $300 springs isn't looking at $2000 coilovers, and vice versa.
As for snow, etc, it does snow in NC - or can. Not often, but should be a consideration on some level. It also rains. A spring isn't immune to problems due to climate, and neither are coilovers. Some are better than others, but all require some basic level of cleaning and inspections to ensure it's holding up...same goes for all other parts of the car fwiw.
The more upfront you are with your actual needs and wants, the easier it is to recommend something that will be ideal for your situation
First and foremost, you have to be alot more specific as to what you're trying to accomplish? Lower rideheight only? Any track days planned? If so, how often, and what other mods will you be planning to accomodate such events (tires, etc?)
You have to be really careful who you listen to, because most people don't have much basis for comparison. So you end up with alot of "I have x and it's great" - where that really tells you nothing.
Second, what is your budget? A customer just looking at $300 springs isn't looking at $2000 coilovers, and vice versa.
As for snow, etc, it does snow in NC - or can. Not often, but should be a consideration on some level. It also rains. A spring isn't immune to problems due to climate, and neither are coilovers. Some are better than others, but all require some basic level of cleaning and inspections to ensure it's holding up...same goes for all other parts of the car fwiw.
The more upfront you are with your actual needs and wants, the easier it is to recommend something that will be ideal for your situation
Last edited by Z1 Performance; Jan 13, 2011 at 09:50 AM.
Jan 13, 2011, 04:06 PM
#44
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using the above post as a guide.. daily driver, not going to the track, can snow alot some winters and not much others (either way-can't go low due to road conditions and snow), rpf1 wheels, robispec rear sway bar, don't want to spend over a thousand dollars, just want it for looks, but don't want to sacrifice performance, and if I can get a performance improvement that would be even better....
swift spec r is my plan.... sound like an okay match?
swift spec r is my plan.... sound like an okay match?
Jan 13, 2011, 07:55 PM
#45
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There is some good info in here and some really bad info
First and foremost, you have to be alot more specific as to what you're trying to accomplish? Lower rideheight only? Any track days planned? If so, how often, and what other mods will you be planning to accomodate such events (tires, etc?)
You have to be really careful who you listen to, because most people don't have much basis for comparison. So you end up with alot of "I have x and it's great" - where that really tells you nothing.
Second, what is your budget? A customer just looking at $300 springs isn't looking at $2000 coilovers, and vice versa.
As for snow, etc, it does snow in NC - or can. Not often, but should be a consideration on some level. It also rains. A spring isn't immune to problems due to climate, and neither are coilovers. Some are better than others, but all require some basic level of cleaning and inspections to ensure it's holding up...same goes for all other parts of the car fwiw.
The more upfront you are with your actual needs and wants, the easier it is to recommend something that will be ideal for your situation
First and foremost, you have to be alot more specific as to what you're trying to accomplish? Lower rideheight only? Any track days planned? If so, how often, and what other mods will you be planning to accomodate such events (tires, etc?)
You have to be really careful who you listen to, because most people don't have much basis for comparison. So you end up with alot of "I have x and it's great" - where that really tells you nothing.
Second, what is your budget? A customer just looking at $300 springs isn't looking at $2000 coilovers, and vice versa.
As for snow, etc, it does snow in NC - or can. Not often, but should be a consideration on some level. It also rains. A spring isn't immune to problems due to climate, and neither are coilovers. Some are better than others, but all require some basic level of cleaning and inspections to ensure it's holding up...same goes for all other parts of the car fwiw.
The more upfront you are with your actual needs and wants, the easier it is to recommend something that will be ideal for your situation
I want to lower enough just to take out the horrendous front wheel gap, but no way shape or form slam it down.
It has snowed more here in the last month than in the last 6 years combined, they hardly even have trucks to put sand down.
The car is garaged nightly. Washed weekly.
Looking at Cobb or swift springs, or coil overs no more than 2g's. With that cap in mind i don't mind spending cash for quality, just need to know what direction to go in.