I have the emanage with the support tool and ignition harness. I also have a wide band o2 meter and datalogger. I tuned the A/F mix no problem, but now how do I tune the timing? How do I know how many degrees to advance it and where?

Thanks for the help.

 

tune it on the dyno and modify your torque curve

 

Yes you need a dyno for that. You can take out some timing at certain points to avoid the ECU pulling timing (which it will do much more aggresively) and you can add timing in certain places also but I would take it to an experienced tuner before you start messing with it.

 

I have a wideband o2 meter and a datalogger. I run only 94 octane. The car is not pulling timing at all, so I wanted to advance the timing a bit more. Can I advance the timing until the ECU starts pulling it back, and just back off a bit from there?

Also, I am not running boost control because it is illegal in the Autocross class I run in, so I am only at about 1.2 bar at redline. I would think there would be some room to advance timing since I am not running high boost and I also only use 94 octane.

 

I am adding up to 4 degrees in the mid range (2500-5000 rpm) and pretty much stock up top. I see 20-21 degrees of timing at WOT, running 20 psi on 93 octane. I wouldn't advance timing on top at all, unless you're really seeing a deficiency. Additional timing + boost=bad. Typically you end up retarding timing as boost goes up.

The Evo seems to respond well to adding timing in the mid range. I would add a little at a time (+1's) and log a lot. If you are using a Pocketlogger you can send me some logs and I'll take a look at them if you want. I'm by no means an expert, but I've been logging my cars and playing with boost vs. timing for a few years now.

 

Have any of you playing with the DIS ignition on the Evo (sharing basically the same setup on the Lancer where my concern lies), encountered any electrical gremlins? Which harness style does the Evo use? Is it the M3-a same as the Lancer?

 

Not sure if anyone is aware of this but you cannot play with ignition timing on the EVO with the e-manage. Not that it doesn't change, but the changes are very inconsitant and erratic. I dialed my car in and ran a 116mph at the DSM shootout. I went back on our dyno for some other changes and I was playing with timing and ran into major inconsistancies on the dyno with power and I noticed the same thing at the track if I played with timing. Even if you try to change timing in one are of the ignition map it will sometimes pull or add timing across the whole range, this could either hurt power or do engine damage. I called Greddy and talked with them a few times and they finally told me that the ignition harness is not compatible with the EVO8.

Martin

 

Thanks for that update. Heard the exact same thing from another source about the e-Manage's short comings regarding that, slow processor time, etc.

 

Martin, what firmware version are you using? Greddy has a CT9A 'fix' in the latest revision (1.36). I don't know the details of the fix, nor have I played with it much (timing) but I think this may have been rectified?

 

I used 1.36 and have had no problems with using the timing function on a few EVO's. I usually only retard timing slightly at certain points.

 

Dan,

Where you on a dyno when tuning or on the road. You can really only see the problem when on a dyno or going to the track. HP runs will vary from 10-20+ hp and trap speeds will be all over the place. You pulled timing in certain areas? The EVO computer already gives conservative timing, more so than the DSM ECU's. By logging timing and running the car on the dyno we really noticed an improvement by adding a few degrees around peak torque. The stock ECU gives very little timing in that area once you start making more horsepower, as little as 4-6 degrees total advance. At higher RPM's we're seeing about 16 degrees advance which is fine. With over 450 dyno pulls and datalogging, I've seen that with more and more power (the ECU recieves higher MAF readings) the ECU pulls timing and it was hard to make much more torque. I'd see nice horsepower increases but torque would not come up like I'd like it to because of this low timing. By throwing in larger injectors and reducing the MAF reading with the S-AFC the ECU thinks the motor is getting less air (less horsepower) and thus advances the timing. I gained about 20ft-lbs of torque by doing this. So either way, adding timing or reducing the MAF signal will advance timing. Where you have to be carefull is when you have really big injectors because you usually have to reduce the MAF signal so much at the high RPM's the timing is increased. It'a a good idea to start logging timing at that point before doing any major timing changes in the upper RPM zones. There is a lot more to ignition tuning but I hope I was able to shed some light.

Martin

 

I was tuning it on the dyno and was not logging but was looking at the timing advance. We actually saw a little more advance than that with the stock injectors. I found I could keep ECU from yanking back timing by taking out a degree or two at boost ramp up. I tried advancing it a bit at peak torque as well but it did not like that and pulled it back again.

 

Any problems running ignition harness,like burning coils.Has greddy resolved this.

 

I have been running the ignition harness since the end of July. I upgraded firmware to v1.36 in September. I have had zero issues with it, including leaving the car on (but not running) for 45 minutes accidentally which is supposed to be the cause of the coils burning. There are rumors that the firmware upgrade fixed the coil burning problem, and there is also supposed to be a new ignition harness from Greddy that addresses it. Don't know if either of these fix the problem, but the problem seems to be sporadic at best. HTH.

 

Thanks