ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

I just got back from my second trip to TPG tuning to get my car tuned after putting in my 4g64 block 2.4L in my 2003 evo . Basically got all bolt ons....

Hard pipes, AMS intercooler
Speed Density Intake
3" catless exhaust
GSC s2 cams
stock turbo
Walbro 255 and FIC 1050's
MBC set around 27psi

First time I went to TPG it started tuning from way down at like 240whp/240wtq on their mustang dyno and made it all the way up to 335/405 but had about 13 counts of knock. So I drove 2.5 hours back home, replaced my knock sensor, and was sure that would fix it, double checked my timing and it was set on factory timing, but not adjusted for the fact it was a 4g64 block with an evo 8 head, using a 4g63 belt.

Went back to tpg, with the new knock sensor and dyno'd again, Jason said he couldn't put as much timing advance on as he liked to and it wasn't making the power it should. So I tried adjusting my cam gears to how they should be with the 4g64 block (which is still a mystery because theres 20 different answers on here), I advanced the intake 3.5 deg, and retarded exhaust 3.5 deg. That made a difference right away, after tuning it finished finally at 330/360, but kept picking up knock at 5500, I couldn't carry the power up top.

My peak HP was at like 5200 rpm, instead of up top. So this knock is holding me back big time right now.... anybody have any suggestions?!? Pretty sure it was good 93 octane, new knock sensor in it, timing set to where it should be . . .

My best guess is that I need to degree wheel it and dial the cams in perfectly, but would that cause like 7-8 counts of knock right around 5500?

Anybody know what could be causing this?!?

Thanks

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

bump for help

ExViTermini

iTrader: (25)

The timing isn't that difficult. And yours is still incorrect. Both cams need to be retarded half a tooth. The 6mm taller deck height causes the belt to pull(advance) the cams half a tooth.

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

thank you! I will try retarding them both and seeing if that makes a difference, do you think this would effect my timing enough that I need it retuned? Or should I wait to go back to the tuner to retard them both?

Thanks

LetsGetThisDone

iTrader: (1)

Peak power may stay at 5,200. You are out of turbo.

What is knock voltage when its getting knock?

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

Well, I fixed my timing, keep in mind the intake was advanced 3.5deg and exhaust was retarded 3.5 deg, I made it so they're both retarded 3.5 deg now and did some logs. It drove perfectly fine at low rpms...

In a 3rd gear pull I picked up a ton of knock (8-12 counts) between 5400 and 6600 rpms, and no knock before or after this range! I understand that that I probably don't have enough turbo to get much more power than this, but I would like to know why this is knocking so I don't waste more time and money at the tuner when I replace the turbo!

Could it be because it isn't tuned for these cam gear settings? I think at most it has 7* of timing advance at high rpm....

Ahh this knock is a nightmare

ExViTermini

iTrader: (25)

Plot of knock voltage will tell some tales. And the ignition curve as well.

05EV08

iTrader: (3)

You adjusted your timing gear and expect to fix the problem when you were just tuned +3.5 on one of the gears? You must go get it retuned. I highly suggest not hitting any boost until tuned again for the change. Both intake and cam gears should be retarted 3.5 like posted above.

Please do not blow up your motor.

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

I'm not hitting boost or WOT for now, I know it's not running right. I'm wondering of it's something that my tuner could possibly just make small changes to and email me the new maps.... He offered to do this before.

Shouldn't it just affect ignition timing? Or would other parameters be affected as well?

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

bumpity bump!

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

here is also a small plot from virtual dyno with knock sum and knock voltage.

Knock voltage is red, and knocksum is purple.

Aby@MIL.SPEC

iTrader: (161)

31 psi on the stock turbo on 93octane....hmm, theres your problem.

your making so much backpressure, its not even funny.

backpressure brings the onset of knock sooner, especially on pump 91/93 octane

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

Sorry, forgot to mention that the map sensor isn't scaled correctly, boost is actually around 27psi peak

05EV08

iTrader: (3)

Sounds like you need a new tuner.

ptm5070

iTrader: (3)

It seems that way, but the problems have been my fault, my tuner has been nothing but great to me, retuned me for free. It had a bad knock sensor first, and then the mechanical timing was off, which was my responsibility. I will definately go back to them for a retune when I know my car is mechanically perfect.