First test day in our Targa Evo IX
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From: North Andover, MA
First test day in our Targa Evo IX
We did our first test day in our Targa Evo IX yesterday at Sears Point. Figured I'd post our blog entry for those who have been following along on the build. You can find it here.
Man, what a bite. You always want that first day out to be solid but when you do as much to a car as you have done with this it's hard to hit close to the mark right out of the box.
Good luck getting the car closer on the next run out. Keep us up to date and try and get some in car camera action on the next outing!
Good luck getting the car closer on the next run out. Keep us up to date and try and get some in car camera action on the next outing!
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Having been through a lot of this I would check a couple of things:
1. Check your rear trailing arm bushings. The stock spoke-type rubber bushings fail after one or two track days and must be replaced on every evo I have ever seen with more than 5000 miles, even if it isn't tracked. Use the solid bushings, available from WORKS. When these break, it produces exactly what you describe, with the car moving around a lot and the inability to get a good 'set'.
2. Your nose may be lowered too much, inducing understeer. I have customized my spindles to allow lowering the car without inducing understeer. I can make up another set for you.
3. You need more spring in the car to hold the nose up, then must adjust the rear to suit. Unfortunately, single adjustable Ohlins probably can't handle more than a 500lb spring, so you will have to revalve or get something else. I have a set of used DMS-50s that are perfect and can handle an 800 lb progressive springs that rides better than stock!
1. Check your rear trailing arm bushings. The stock spoke-type rubber bushings fail after one or two track days and must be replaced on every evo I have ever seen with more than 5000 miles, even if it isn't tracked. Use the solid bushings, available from WORKS. When these break, it produces exactly what you describe, with the car moving around a lot and the inability to get a good 'set'.
2. Your nose may be lowered too much, inducing understeer. I have customized my spindles to allow lowering the car without inducing understeer. I can make up another set for you.
3. You need more spring in the car to hold the nose up, then must adjust the rear to suit. Unfortunately, single adjustable Ohlins probably can't handle more than a 500lb spring, so you will have to revalve or get something else. I have a set of used DMS-50s that are perfect and can handle an 800 lb progressive springs that rides better than stock!
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It's the nature of racing, right? I try not to get too down about stuff like that as you have to expect to have good days and bad days.
I actually think most of our handling imbalance was caused by bad choice of ride heights/rake. We'll be changing spring rates and ride heights and will test again very soon.
I actually think most of our handling imbalance was caused by bad choice of ride heights/rake. We'll be changing spring rates and ride heights and will test again very soon.
Man, what a bite. You always want that first day out to be solid but when you do as much to a car as you have done with this it's hard to hit close to the mark right out of the box.
Good luck getting the car closer on the next run out. Keep us up to date and try and get some in car camera action on the next outing!
Good luck getting the car closer on the next run out. Keep us up to date and try and get some in car camera action on the next outing!
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From: North Andover, MA
Thread Starter
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From: North Andover, MA
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From: North Andover, MA
Dave --
Thanks for the note. We're running poly bushings all the way around, and also have the Whiteline bits to address the front roll center. Would love to talk to you more about what you did with the spindles.
You are right on the lowering -- Pete at WORKS shared a bit of what you all have learned with putting too much rake into the car. We think we caused some problems there as we had over 1.5" total rake for the test. That will be fixed immediately.
As for springs, since the car is running at Targa I can't go too stiff without risking breaking the car or being spit off the road. I'll have to keep the rate within the range the Ohlins can handle. DAs aren't an option, as there is a possibility that the external reservoir would be ripped off the car during the rally. The DMS set-up is tempting.
Would love to compare notes at some point, as our car is also really, really heavy and won't be able to be lightened dramatically for Targa. I know you guys had to deal with some pretty serious weight so would like to know more about how you dealt with it.
Thanks for the note. We're running poly bushings all the way around, and also have the Whiteline bits to address the front roll center. Would love to talk to you more about what you did with the spindles.
You are right on the lowering -- Pete at WORKS shared a bit of what you all have learned with putting too much rake into the car. We think we caused some problems there as we had over 1.5" total rake for the test. That will be fixed immediately.
As for springs, since the car is running at Targa I can't go too stiff without risking breaking the car or being spit off the road. I'll have to keep the rate within the range the Ohlins can handle. DAs aren't an option, as there is a possibility that the external reservoir would be ripped off the car during the rally. The DMS set-up is tempting.
Would love to compare notes at some point, as our car is also really, really heavy and won't be able to be lightened dramatically for Targa. I know you guys had to deal with some pretty serious weight so would like to know more about how you dealt with it.
Having been through a lot of this I would check a couple of things:
1. Check your rear trailing arm bushings. The stock spoke-type rubber bushings fail after one or two track days and must be replaced on every evo I have ever seen with more than 5000 miles, even if it isn't tracked. Use the solid bushings, available from WORKS. When these break, it produces exactly what you describe, with the car moving around a lot and the inability to get a good 'set'.
2. Your nose may be lowered too much, inducing understeer. I have customized my spindles to allow lowering the car without inducing understeer. I can make up another set for you.
3. You need more spring in the car to hold the nose up, then must adjust the rear to suit. Unfortunately, single adjustable Ohlins probably can't handle more than a 500lb spring, so you will have to revalve or get something else. I have a set of used DMS-50s that are perfect and can handle an 800 lb progressive springs that rides better than stock!
1. Check your rear trailing arm bushings. The stock spoke-type rubber bushings fail after one or two track days and must be replaced on every evo I have ever seen with more than 5000 miles, even if it isn't tracked. Use the solid bushings, available from WORKS. When these break, it produces exactly what you describe, with the car moving around a lot and the inability to get a good 'set'.
2. Your nose may be lowered too much, inducing understeer. I have customized my spindles to allow lowering the car without inducing understeer. I can make up another set for you.
3. You need more spring in the car to hold the nose up, then must adjust the rear to suit. Unfortunately, single adjustable Ohlins probably can't handle more than a 500lb spring, so you will have to revalve or get something else. I have a set of used DMS-50s that are perfect and can handle an 800 lb progressive springs that rides better than stock!
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We're lowering the car _slightly_, and the spring rates are stiff, but not roadrace stiff like the USTCC car.
No offense, but we engineered the car that won the event overall 3 times in a row and we engineered a sister car that lead the modern division both years it ran. We know what works on those roads, we just don't know what works with this car yet.
No offense, but we engineered the car that won the event overall 3 times in a row and we engineered a sister car that lead the modern division both years it ran. We know what works on those roads, we just don't know what works with this car yet.
We're lowering the car _slightly_, and the spring rates are stiff, but not roadrace stiff like the USTCC car.
No offense, but we engineered the car that won the event overall 3 times in a row and we engineered a sister car that lead the modern division both years it ran. We know what works on those roads, we just don't know what works with this car yet.
No offense, but we engineered the car that won the event overall 3 times in a row and we engineered a sister car that lead the modern division both years it ran. We know what works on those roads, we just don't know what works with this car yet.
Good luck getting it all sorted out.
