Wheres Mitsu? and Subaru
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Joined: May 2009
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From: Hampton, Va
Wheres Mitsu? and Subaru
So im currently watchin rally norway and i know this issue was probably brought up in the beginning of the WRC 09 season but what happened to make subaru pull out and where are all of the mitsu's at?
it would also be nice to see an american WRC racer in the top 10
You are dreaming. lol
Mitsu has not been in WRC for years. They tried to get back in a few years ago but could not swing the cost.
I honestly believe its the looming switch to Super-2000 rules in 2011 that is pushing manufacturers out.
Mitsu has not been in WRC for years. They tried to get back in a few years ago but could not swing the cost.
I honestly believe its the looming switch to Super-2000 rules in 2011 that is pushing manufacturers out.
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From: Hampton, Va
this is probably another reason why the EVO X isnt the new god of the rally world because they're straying from those roots.
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From: Back Woods Upstate NY
The evo's were always one step behind the regs in the WRC, one of the reasons they were so impressive when they won. The last Mitsu WRC car was the Lancer WRC 05, which was as far from the Evo9 as any rally Evo has ever been from its stock brethren. subaru pulled out for a variety of reasons. the economy of course but another reason might be found by tracking their rate of success over the last few years. The car couldn't compete on Tarmac with the fords or citroens. On top of that the results have been dismal over the last 3 years or so overall, half the time due to Solberg pushing too hard to make up for DNFs at other events and stay in the point chase and the other half from mechanical failures. Just look at how much better Hirvonnen is driving a ford than he was at subaru. some of that is experience but alot of it is the car.
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From: Hampton, Va
interesting, i havent watch Hirv race with Subaru, just recently been watching WRC frequently thanks to HDTheater and it wasnt what i expected; Citroen is really dominating the leaderbords with a few fords in between. this may be a newb question but are the citroens and fords AWD? i know the production Focus RS is FWD. i guess the only light for Subaru and Mitsu is Rally America which travis pastrana, ken block, ACP etc.. have been really bringing rally out to the less knowledgable american masses.
interesting, i havent watch Hirv race with Subaru, just recently been watching WRC frequently thanks to HDTheater and it wasnt what i expected; Citroen is really dominating the leaderbords with a few fords in between. this may be a newb question but are the citroens and fords AWD? i know the production Focus RS is FWD. i guess the only light for Subaru and Mitsu is Rally America which travis pastrana, ken block, ACP etc.. have been really bringing rally out to the less knowledgable american masses.
There are still a lot of Mitsubishi's and Subaru's that race at wrc events. The group N class is full of them.
First place with 20 sec penalty 16th overall.... of course with an Evo.Also there are many Evo X runs in the EU and world rally stages ...
example the last WRC event rally Catalunya
they start to come around 2 minutes 35 sec and after.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ixjc...eature=related
look how this video starts 2009 recently
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJmuZ...ayer_embedded#
Last edited by Robevo RS; Oct 12, 2009 at 01:09 PM.
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From: Back Woods Upstate NY
Evos and subies are definately well represented, just not in the full out WRC group. In group N, PWRC and such they do very well. they also are well represented in the IRC, as well as the regional series and national series that run all over the world. There is a reason that most competitors in the world choose one or the other of these 2 brands, the cars are good out of the box, you don't have to buy a special racing version to have a good rally car like you do with some other brands like Peugoet, Citroen, Ford or fiat. so don't get down on either the Evo or the subies, just don't expect to see them in the top class for WRC. The list of makes to pull out in the last decade is telling in regards to how the FIA is doing with the sport
They are: Mitsu, Subie, Suzuki, Peugoet, Skoda, Toyota (well they kinda got kicked out for being cheating bastards), Seat, Hyundai. Citroen left for a year as well before coming back.
They are: Mitsu, Subie, Suzuki, Peugoet, Skoda, Toyota (well they kinda got kicked out for being cheating bastards), Seat, Hyundai. Citroen left for a year as well before coming back.
Evos and subies are definately well represented, just not in the full out WRC group. In group N, PWRC and such they do very well. they also are well represented in the IRC, as well as the regional series and national series that run all over the world. There is a reason that most competitors in the world choose one or the other of these 2 brands, the cars are good out of the box, you don't have to buy a special racing version to have a good rally car like you do with some other brands like Peugoet, Citroen, Ford or fiat. so don't get down on either the Evo or the subies, just don't expect to see them in the top class for WRC. The list of makes to pull out in the last decade is telling in regards to how the FIA is doing with the sport
They are: Mitsu, Subie, Suzuki, Peugoet, Skoda, Toyota (well they kinda got kicked out for being cheating bastards), Seat, Hyundai. Citroen left for a year as well before coming back.
They are: Mitsu, Subie, Suzuki, Peugoet, Skoda, Toyota (well they kinda got kicked out for being cheating bastards), Seat, Hyundai. Citroen left for a year as well before coming back.
:lol :
Hirovenen was not good his first year or so in a ford either, he was a number two driver until only a few years ago. Look at Atkinson, he was not very good when he started, but was finishing well after a few years with Subaru. Its mostly about the driver, as in most Motorsports.
There were allof of reasons subaru's werent as competetive on Tarmac, barely any of it had to do with the car. First, until recently, Subaru was the only manufacturer to run on Pirelli's, all others ran on Michelin, the latter of which made a much better dry tarmac tire.
The other main reason, were the drivers. Other teams have drivers who are considered Tarmac specialists, Subaru did not have any drivers who were as comfortable on tarmac. Most, if not all of Solbergs tarmac wins were in the rain, where the Pirelli was better than the Michelin.
There were gremlins in the 06/7/8 cars, and that was likely one small reason for subaru to pull out. But look at it this way. Super-2000 is taking over as THE WRC class in 2011. They have a homoligated, Transverse transmission which they are all required to use. Was Subaru going to develop a car to use this transmission? For super-2000 you must also run a car with at least 2500 sold to the public, so they brought back homoligation of full cars, like Group A was. Was subaru going to build an AWD, Transverse engine vehicle just to run in this new class? Absolutely not.
The FIA did add in a rule where you could develop your own transmission, using stock 5 speed gear ratios instead of using their homoligated tranny. But, with an NA 2 litre turning 8500 rpm's, they are nowhere close to ideal and would be a huge disadvantage.
Why would any manufacturer develop a WRC car if the class is dead in 2 years? Or continue developing a new car? (Subaru)
The FIA is killing international motorsports. I hope to God Ari Vatanen gets elected President of the FIA, maybe he can bring F1 and WRC back to its original Glory.
But, thats just my perspective... lol
There were allof of reasons subaru's werent as competetive on Tarmac, barely any of it had to do with the car. First, until recently, Subaru was the only manufacturer to run on Pirelli's, all others ran on Michelin, the latter of which made a much better dry tarmac tire.
The other main reason, were the drivers. Other teams have drivers who are considered Tarmac specialists, Subaru did not have any drivers who were as comfortable on tarmac. Most, if not all of Solbergs tarmac wins were in the rain, where the Pirelli was better than the Michelin.
There were gremlins in the 06/7/8 cars, and that was likely one small reason for subaru to pull out. But look at it this way. Super-2000 is taking over as THE WRC class in 2011. They have a homoligated, Transverse transmission which they are all required to use. Was Subaru going to develop a car to use this transmission? For super-2000 you must also run a car with at least 2500 sold to the public, so they brought back homoligation of full cars, like Group A was. Was subaru going to build an AWD, Transverse engine vehicle just to run in this new class? Absolutely not.
The FIA did add in a rule where you could develop your own transmission, using stock 5 speed gear ratios instead of using their homoligated tranny. But, with an NA 2 litre turning 8500 rpm's, they are nowhere close to ideal and would be a huge disadvantage.
Why would any manufacturer develop a WRC car if the class is dead in 2 years? Or continue developing a new car? (Subaru)
The FIA is killing international motorsports. I hope to God Ari Vatanen gets elected President of the FIA, maybe he can bring F1 and WRC back to its original Glory.
But, thats just my perspective... lol
Last edited by RaNGVR-4; Oct 12, 2009 at 03:10 PM.
Hirovenen was not good his first year or so in a ford either, he was a number two driver until only a few years ago. Look at Atkinson, he was not very good when he started, but was finishing well after a few years with Subaru. Its mostly about the driver, as in most Motorsports.
There were allof of reasons subaru's werent as competetive on Tarmac, barely any of it had to do with the car. First, until recently, Subaru was the only manufacturer to run on Pirelli's, all others ran on Michelin, the latter of which made a much better dry tarmac tire.
The other main reason, were the drivers. Other teams have drivers who are considered Tarmac specialists, Subaru did not have any drivers who were as comfortable on tarmac. Most, if not all of Solbergs tarmac wins were in the rain, where the Pirelli was better than the Michelin.
There were gremlins in the 06/7/8 cars, and that was likely one small reason for subaru to pull out. But look at it this way. Super-2000 is taking over as THE WRC class in 2011. They have a homoligated, Transverse transmission which they are all required to use. Was Subaru going to develop a car to use this transmission? For super-2000 you must also run a car with at least 2500 sold to the public, so they brought back homoligation of full cars, like Group A was. Was subaru going to build an AWD, Transverse engine vehicle just to run in this new class? Absolutely not.
The FIA did add in a rule where you could develop your own transmission, using stock 5 speed gear ratios instead of using their homoligated tranny. But, with an NA 2 litre turning 8500 rpm's, they are nowhere close to ideal and would be a huge disadvantage.
Why would any manufacturer develop a WRC car if the class is dead in 2 years? Or continue developing a new car? (Subaru)
The FIA is killing international motorsports. I hope to God Ari Vatanen gets elected President of the FIA, maybe he can bring F1 and WRC back to its original Glory.
But, thats just my persective... lol
There were allof of reasons subaru's werent as competetive on Tarmac, barely any of it had to do with the car. First, until recently, Subaru was the only manufacturer to run on Pirelli's, all others ran on Michelin, the latter of which made a much better dry tarmac tire.
The other main reason, were the drivers. Other teams have drivers who are considered Tarmac specialists, Subaru did not have any drivers who were as comfortable on tarmac. Most, if not all of Solbergs tarmac wins were in the rain, where the Pirelli was better than the Michelin.
There were gremlins in the 06/7/8 cars, and that was likely one small reason for subaru to pull out. But look at it this way. Super-2000 is taking over as THE WRC class in 2011. They have a homoligated, Transverse transmission which they are all required to use. Was Subaru going to develop a car to use this transmission? For super-2000 you must also run a car with at least 2500 sold to the public, so they brought back homoligation of full cars, like Group A was. Was subaru going to build an AWD, Transverse engine vehicle just to run in this new class? Absolutely not.
The FIA did add in a rule where you could develop your own transmission, using stock 5 speed gear ratios instead of using their homoligated tranny. But, with an NA 2 litre turning 8500 rpm's, they are nowhere close to ideal and would be a huge disadvantage.
Why would any manufacturer develop a WRC car if the class is dead in 2 years? Or continue developing a new car? (Subaru)
The FIA is killing international motorsports. I hope to God Ari Vatanen gets elected President of the FIA, maybe he can bring F1 and WRC back to its original Glory.
But, thats just my persective... lol
"The FIA is killing international motorsports. I hope to God Ari Vatanen gets elected President of the FIA, maybe he can bring F1 and WRC back to its original Glory. "
i would vote with you on that.
dead on.
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From: Hampton, Va
Wow i guess i've only seen Group B races i forgot about other classes, with regards to the FIA i hope to god that they dont turn WRC into an international kind of NASCAR i actually like having the manufactuers compete with each other. i'd hate to see cookie cutter cars with fake light stickers.