Your Thoughts on Front Bumper Canards...
Dec 28, 2010, 06:20 AM
#46
.....The ideal track suspension setup will be different for everyone, because of the type of components on the car, tires, driver skill, track & track conditions, etc. You should speak with other Evo drivers at the track and ask which components have been successful for them and which were a waste of money.
If you haven’t done so already, you should have added front & rear strut braces and replaced the front and rear anti-sway bars with stiffer versions. Change out all your suspension bushings, motor mounts, add a bump steer kit, etc. for better responsiveness and “feel” of the car. Do a professional track alignment and corner balancing on your car... something along the lines of: -3.0F / -2.0R.
After a lot of research, my choice were the KW ClubSport’s with 10K front and 12K rear spring rates. (These spring rates are not ultra stiff, but still not recommended for inexperienced drivers.) I keep the adjustable rear bar set to full soft in the wet, and either medium or full stiff in the dry. I like my car to rotate easily and quickly in the corners, so mine is on full stiff when conditions are warm and dry. This has worked out beautifully for me.....
Sounds like you may not know Nathan 
He has his car well set up already and is a track record holder at multiple tracks in various NASA TT classes.
I think he's just looking at adding aero to an already spectacular package. . .
Nathan - email me if you want to discuss spring rates outside of the forums.
If you haven’t done so already, you should have added front & rear strut braces and replaced the front and rear anti-sway bars with stiffer versions. Change out all your suspension bushings, motor mounts, add a bump steer kit, etc. for better responsiveness and “feel” of the car. Do a professional track alignment and corner balancing on your car... something along the lines of: -3.0F / -2.0R.
After a lot of research, my choice were the KW ClubSport’s with 10K front and 12K rear spring rates. (These spring rates are not ultra stiff, but still not recommended for inexperienced drivers.) I keep the adjustable rear bar set to full soft in the wet, and either medium or full stiff in the dry. I like my car to rotate easily and quickly in the corners, so mine is on full stiff when conditions are warm and dry. This has worked out beautifully for me.....
Sounds like you may not know Nathan He has his car well set up already and is a track record holder at multiple tracks in various NASA TT classes. I think he's just looking at adding aero to an already spectacular package. . .
Nathan - email me if you want to discuss spring rates outside of the forums.
But like EVOlutionary said, I've got the car setup how I like it finally and it rotates correctly. But that's with all stock aero. And now I'm seriously considering an aero package.
As ya can probably guess, I'm more than a bit concerned about taking a step backwards and throwing off the balance of the car with aero. It's been extremely planted with everything I've done and I don't want a twitchy car that I don't feel comfortable driving on the edge (aka flat out
)As with the NASA TT program, you're restricted at how many mods you can do. For example, I ran stock swaybars the last 2 years, no bump/steer, no roll-center, stock aero, etc. I'm on my 4th suspension and getting ready to order #5. Each setup has been better than the last and I expect really good feel/results from the next!
I'd talk to more Evo's at the track, but aside from EVOlutionary, I really don't see anyone with Aero packages or as much tracktime under their belt as me. Or at least anyone running times up by me around the 8.7 power level (I'm below that too).
Last edited by boomn29; Dec 28, 2010 at 06:23 AM.
Dec 28, 2010, 07:20 AM
#47
Evolving Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (39)
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Allentown, PA USA
Posts: 242
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nathan,
Sorry to have notched down my last post, but I'm not familiar with a lot of the guys here on the forum. I do believe we've PM'd at some point over the years, 'cause you sound familiar.
My results with the aero have been positive. I'll give you my experience:
First I went with the APR front splitter, but there was insufficient rigidity and lots of flex. So I had a custom aluminum splitter/undertray fabbed w/4 splitter braces. That has worked out great. The rear wing is awesome in fast corners, if you have the tires for it. I went with 285 Kumho's on 18x10 rims. Lots of grip. What you lose in the straights with the rear wing, you gain back in the corners, and you can always adjust the AOA to the track. I made up for the slight loss in the straights with a little extra power in the engine and did 1:21 at Summit Point (W.VA)... and I know it still has more.
Sounds like you really got your car together and just tweaking at this point.
BTW, about me, I've only done a few TT, but lots of on track experience. I'm on my 5th track car and a NASA, PCA & BMW HPDE Instructor. Working on getting my next track car as we speak... hopefully fully prepared by Spring.
Sorry to have notched down my last post, but I'm not familiar with a lot of the guys here on the forum. I do believe we've PM'd at some point over the years, 'cause you sound familiar.
My results with the aero have been positive. I'll give you my experience:
First I went with the APR front splitter, but there was insufficient rigidity and lots of flex. So I had a custom aluminum splitter/undertray fabbed w/4 splitter braces. That has worked out great. The rear wing is awesome in fast corners, if you have the tires for it. I went with 285 Kumho's on 18x10 rims. Lots of grip. What you lose in the straights with the rear wing, you gain back in the corners, and you can always adjust the AOA to the track. I made up for the slight loss in the straights with a little extra power in the engine and did 1:21 at Summit Point (W.VA)... and I know it still has more.
Sounds like you really got your car together and just tweaking at this point.
BTW, about me, I've only done a few TT, but lots of on track experience. I'm on my 5th track car and a NASA, PCA & BMW HPDE Instructor. Working on getting my next track car as we speak... hopefully fully prepared by Spring.
Dec 28, 2010, 07:37 AM
#48
Nathan,
With the addition of the Kognition wing at Autoclub we experienced additional rear passenger tire wear going through the banking. We also rotated the camber adjustment bolt due to the extreme force! We are going to mildly increase our rear spring level to compensate for the additional downforce created. Our goal for next year is added front downforce as we are running the rear wing at a very mild angle. We have a splitter that extends 4" forward of the front bumper, approx 3.75" off the ground, stopping at the centerline of the front axles. It is completely flat and made of reenforced alumalite. Before addition the Kognition wing, the car was a little unstable at higher speeds with the OEM VII wing set at maximum angle of attack, but really not that bad. It is much more balanced now though.
Dan
With the addition of the Kognition wing at Autoclub we experienced additional rear passenger tire wear going through the banking. We also rotated the camber adjustment bolt due to the extreme force! We are going to mildly increase our rear spring level to compensate for the additional downforce created. Our goal for next year is added front downforce as we are running the rear wing at a very mild angle. We have a splitter that extends 4" forward of the front bumper, approx 3.75" off the ground, stopping at the centerline of the front axles. It is completely flat and made of reenforced alumalite. Before addition the Kognition wing, the car was a little unstable at higher speeds with the OEM VII wing set at maximum angle of attack, but really not that bad. It is much more balanced now though.
Dan
Dec 28, 2010, 07:49 AM
#49
I just ordered a carbon fiber rear wing for my Evo 8, that I use at the track.
The front already has a carbon fiber front splitter under the stock bumper.
With the new rear wing making more down force in the rear, I want to balance the car by giving a little more front down force with side mounted bumper canards.
I like the Voltex model, but I'm told they require modification to fit on a stock front bumper. Twin canards would be ideal, but single canards would be fine, so long as they do their job on the track.
What experience do you guys have with these, and which would you recommend?
Thanks.
The front already has a carbon fiber front splitter under the stock bumper.
With the new rear wing making more down force in the rear, I want to balance the car by giving a little more front down force with side mounted bumper canards.
I like the Voltex model, but I'm told they require modification to fit on a stock front bumper. Twin canards would be ideal, but single canards would be fine, so long as they do their job on the track.
What experience do you guys have with these, and which would you recommend?
Thanks.
Jan 1, 2011, 06:45 AM
#50
Evolving Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Rockford, IL
Posts: 123
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Given the extremely high price for the Voltex canards, has any one here been successful in fabricating some of these out of alternate maerial for their own use? The idea has me thinking about attemting to do so.....
Jan 1, 2011, 07:32 AM
#51
I havent seen anyone do it, not the Voltex style at least. Im not even sure why it costs so much for four little peaces lol. I had real Voltex canards on my IX that were trimmed to fit my bumper. If you do decide to make your own, make thread of the fabrication. Im curious to see how it turns out. Make sure you do research on the way they function so you get the best of performance from your idea.
Jan 3, 2011, 08:32 PM
#53
Evolved Member
iTrader: (62)
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Redmond - Lake Tapps ,WA
Posts: 3,336
Likes: 0
Received 6 Likes
on
6 Posts
Yeah I've thought about building new canards for my car now that I know more about how they work. The Voltex parts I've seen were surprisingly rough and not that cosmetic for the price they cost. My current ones are aluminum, I'll probably do carbon on the next go around.
Oct 31, 2012, 07:56 AM
#54
Newbie
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Orange County
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We've had some good success making our own aluminum dive planes, very easy to do when you have a TIG welder and you have the car in the shop. We added these the day before our last event and I believe they are responsible for a good amount of the front grip that we added to our setup.
BTW guys the EVO has a lot of body similarities to the E30 M3. Lots of good info in this thread. Now lets discuss:
http://www.speedhunters.com/2012/06/...-is-the-force/
Oct 31, 2012, 08:46 AM
#55
That's actually a really good idea, I have so much caster I had to shave a good bit of the bumper away, resulting in the front tires being exposed, which this would resolve.
The sucker Evo though, OMFG finally. Now he just needs fans in there and it'll be called the F1 Evo
The sucker Evo though, OMFG finally. Now he just needs fans in there and it'll be called the F1 Evo
Oct 31, 2012, 09:35 AM
#56
Newbie
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Orange County
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've played with the idea of "excessive" fans in the license plate area to cool differential and transmission coolers on my car but the main effect seemed to be that my transmission was too cold and my alternator was struggling lol.
I guess I need a snowmobile motor in the trunk to power some real sucker fans...
Oct 31, 2012, 07:13 PM
#57
Installed an APR splitter & got the chance to try it out & ruin it on my first track day w/it installed
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1 at the Fontana Roval (got my attention
The additional wires were an attempt to make it live 1 more stint which didnt work & ended up removing the whole splitter to run the 3rd stint less the splitter
Needless to say, a stock APR splitter is nothing more than a dress up piece. It needed mounting backers behind the struts as well as additional struts just to give it a chance of surviving
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1 at the Fontana Roval (got my attention
The additional wires were an attempt to make it live 1 more stint which didnt work & ended up removing the whole splitter to run the 3rd stint less the splitter
Needless to say, a stock APR splitter is nothing more than a dress up piece. It needed mounting backers behind the struts as well as additional struts just to give it a chance of surviving
Oct 31, 2012, 07:48 PM
#58
Installed an APR splitter & got the chance to try it out & ruin it on my first track day w/it installed
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1 at the Fontana Roval (got my attention
The additional wires were an attempt to make it live 1 more stint which didnt work & ended up removing the whole splitter to run the 3rd stint less the splitter
Needless to say, a stock APR splitter is nothing more than a dress up piece. It needed mounting backers behind the struts as well as additional struts just to give it a chance of surviving
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1 at the Fontana Roval (got my attention
The additional wires were an attempt to make it live 1 more stint which didnt work & ended up removing the whole splitter to run the 3rd stint less the splitter
Needless to say, a stock APR splitter is nothing more than a dress up piece. It needed mounting backers behind the struts as well as additional struts just to give it a chance of surviving
Nov 1, 2012, 12:15 AM
#59
Newbie
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Orange County
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Installed an APR splitter & got the chance to try it out & ruin it on my first track day w/it installed
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1
Now I only fasten supports to rigid structures on the car like the front bumper support beam or frame rails.
Nov 1, 2012, 05:27 AM
#60
Installed an APR splitter & got the chance to try it out & ruin it on my first track day w/it installed
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1 at the Fontana Roval (got my attention
The additional wires were an attempt to make it live 1 more stint which didnt work & ended up removing the whole splitter to run the 3rd stint less the splitter
Needless to say, a stock APR splitter is nothing more than a dress up piece. It needed mounting backers behind the struts as well as additional struts just to give it a chance of surviving
I performed the standard install using both supplied struts & bolting the tray to the underside of the bumper cover.
Well 8 laps into my first stint it broke loose causing vibration at 135mph entering turn 1 at the Fontana Roval (got my attention
The additional wires were an attempt to make it live 1 more stint which didnt work & ended up removing the whole splitter to run the 3rd stint less the splitter
Needless to say, a stock APR splitter is nothing more than a dress up piece. It needed mounting backers behind the struts as well as additional struts just to give it a chance of surviving