weneversleep

First of all, a little background. I'm an instructor with various track orgs (PCA, BMWCCA, etc.), so I'm not a track newbie. Tracked cars like the S2000 and E36 M3 before I discovered the Evo, and realized that the Evo was what I was looking for all along.

I currently have an Evo X MR, and I just acquired a very mint Evo IX MR SE, low miles, never been modded.

Note that I am not a big "modder". I like to do just enough to my cars to make them fun on the track (brakes, suspension, etc.), but keeping reliability is very important. I'm not going to fool with making big power, because that usually just creates problems. Plus, these cars have plenty of power as they are.

So, with all of that, here's the question: which would you take on track? Pros and cons. I'm just having trouble deciding.

Pros/cons to tracking the X, in no particular order:
1. Lose warranty on high-$ parts like that TC-SST transmission
2. Overheating problems with the TC-SST
3. AYC creates neutral to slight oversteer handling feel, which is very fun
4. Slightly bigger stock brakes (larger rotors)
5. Weight: 300 lbs heavier than the IX
6. TC-SST will be a ton of fun on the track
7. Would need to do suspension work to lower high CG (prob do with the Vorshlag guys did with AST coilovers)
8. Reliability concerns with the 4B11 engine (just because it's new & unproven)

Pros/cons to tracking the IX, in no particular order:
1. Low-mile, unmodded IX cars hold their value, which will be killed if I start tracking it
2. Reliability of the MR 6-speed transmission when tracked
3. 300 lbs lighter than the X (big pro!)
4. Proven reliable 4G63 engine
5. Proven track platform, lots of people have years of experience with the older Evo

One last thing: I don't want this to turn into a general IX vs. X debate. I want to specifically compare and contrast the IX and X as to their suitability for a road course track car.

boomn29

iTrader: (47)

For the X:
- The extra weight. This is the first thing that comes to mind; but it does carry it's weight well.
- Room for larger tires. You can fit 10 - 10.5" rims and 275's with no problems.
- AYC definitely has it's pluses.
- 4B11 proving to be very reliable as well. Look at AMS TA-X and Gates X.
- SST trans has it's power limits and will overheat

For the IX:
- Fitting larger tires. Fitting 265's and up get to be a chore of offsets, rolling and spacers
- Very proven.
- Reliable power is cheap. You can safely extract ~320whp on pump & ~370whp on e85 or 100/104 all on the stock turbo.
- Reliable 5sp trans
- Un-reliable 6sp trans (overheating)
- ~370whp


Costs
- In terms of track consumables they are close. The extra weight of the X should burn through this stuff a bit faster though. Things like tires, brakes, rotors, gas - that get expensive
- Aftermarket upgrades are there for both. The IX is more developed, but doesn't look like you will be pushing into new territory
- Long-term costs...

I currently track a IX. I've street driven a X but never had it on the track.
If I had my choice - I'd personally find something either already setup and ready to rock with suspension, power, etc. Or I'd get something with a salvage title and just thrash it with no regard! My .02.

^^ In terms of straight cost; the older IX model would be cheaper in both those ideas. But it doesn't sounds like you're needing to go the cheap route and newer technology is usually better. Tough call.

DJ Brett B

iTrader: (12)

the 6 speed issues may soon have a fix.... shep will be releasing an aftermarket gearset for the 6 speed:
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...g-6-speed.html

2003lancerevo8

Both cars can be turned into great track cars....

The 4b11 is a proven motor thus far - many people pushing the envelope and making great power.

Ryan Gates won the overall championship in his class with the Evo X, but it was not an MR, and most of his wins were by large margins...

Evo IX
big pro is the 4g63 - the suspension to me in the X would make up more than the 300 lbs weight difference...


Why don't you take both cars to a road course and drive both and feel what your better in.

There is going to be all sorts of opionions on this one.

Good Luck

migs647

iTrader: (19)

I say if you aren't going to try and make big power, throw a cooler on the SST and track that car if you can afford it. With a cooler you should be able to keep the transmission cool enough it won't ever go into limp mode.

I'd rather have a regular IX to track than a IX MR SE. If you had a regular IX I'd say to track that car instead.

weneversleep

That's why I posted the thread. I figured it would be a fun discussion.

sblvro

iTrader: (2)

I would track the X and keep the IXMRSE in my garage. the IXMRSE will keep its value and the X you will enjoy in the tracks. The reverse doesn't always hold true, in terms of value.

xtnct

iTrader: (33)

Not saying it will happen, but consider which car would you rather be willing to have written off. Things happen and insurance no longer covers track events, even DE's unless you buy the special track insurance from a few DE friendly brokers.

You may want to use the car that has a lower value. Both cars are close to each other with a massive amount fun and quickness.

Or, you may want to choose the car that you can easily replace. Finding a mint SE is going to be tough, but the X's are still being sold so replacing that may be easier (but costlier)

goofygrin

iTrader: (5)

The X without a rollcage is the safer car.
There are no good harness bars for the X, so you have to use some other harness mechanism.
The X seat sits too tall for some people (like me) once you put your helmet on.
The X MR seats are pretty slick (ie you slide) for the track (does your IX have leather?).
The X has pretty bad fuel starvation issues, so budget $600-800 for a surge tank.
AYC can sometimes get in the way. I attribute my spin at the last event partially to me (I caused it by lifting), but once I was pointed straight again the car just looped right around and people behind me saw that the tail was wagging the dog.

I think if you put the XMR on the scales and the IX you'll find that there is a lot bigger than 300# weight difference

All that said, I do think that the X is a better track platform because it feels slightly more stable (likely a combination of weight, electronics, suspension design) and you can stuff some monsterous tires under it (285/30/18 just requires a fender roll).

migs647

iTrader: (19)

I don't know if we can say that yet. I've seen many more IX MR SE than I have seen X MR. I only know of 4 2008 X MR in the northwest (i'm sure there are more though). But I know of 20+ IX MR SE. I think in the end the 2008 X MR will be worth more, but it's hard to say at this point.

Either way, I for-see this turning into another IX vs X debate. Lets try and keep the comments strictly track related. (Should last about 4 hours)

migs647

iTrader: (19)

Hrm, I feel the opposite. I feel my X MR seats have much more traction than the IX seats that I put in my VIII.

I also feel the opposite about sitting high. I swear I must have the shortest torso on a 6'1" person ever. I feel like I'm extremely deep in the car and can barely see over the steering wheel. (I guess that's more cabin than seat?). I felt a bit better in my VIII as far as height goes. Kinda weird.

goofygrin

iTrader: (5)

Ya I've got mega-torso

thatmr2guy

iTrader: (5)

If money is an option I would go with a IX, the bottom seams to be falling out as I have seen several cars in the teens. With the risk of 'mowing' the grass the abundance of VIII/ IX parts in the used market may be worth while.

I think looking at the videos that pound for pound both stock cars will be very close with the acceleration and braking of the IX being too much for the heavier and better handling X to match.

If you start breaking the seal of the parts bin i think the handling gap between the two cars diminishes but the weight advantage and breaking advantage increases.

When I was looking at both cars I continually found myself trying to talk myself away from a IX because the X should be that much better. But the fact of the matter was that the X was good at somethings and the IX was good at others and there was no clear hands down winner. So in the end I bought a 28K IX instead of the 34K X.

Good Luck, I dont think you have wrong choice here when you ask yourself what things are important to you.

Loser

iTrader: (9)

I think the performance difference on the track between a stock IX and a X are marginal with each having their strengths and weaknesses. I've tracked my IX a lot, but I've only driven a X on the street and at an autox, so it's not a fair comparison, but I think the IX gives better feedback and so is more rewarding to drive. But being an instructor I think you have enough skill to take both out and drive them at their limits; then decide which one feels better. As for operational costs, any mistress is high maintenance

There were two or three reports where guys have completely broken off the brake rotor from the hub on the X GSR. Even though it's rare, I haven't seen any reports of that happening on a IX or a X MR.

jtk968

iTrader: (1)

goofy, did you get your surge tank?