He also changed front axles i believe

 

I didn't find any evidence of that, but id sure like to know

I'm looking for x arms, caster kit, dive geometry mods, already have a rck.

In my subie life I know you could stretch cv shafts a bit when going from gm6(gc8) to gda/b chassis components .

If we could find a solid width comparison between the two we could determine that most likely.

I imagine running a lot of strut top camber this will change sai but I don't know the sweet spot for that

 

Please say more about dive-geometry mods. I wasn't aware that there was much if anything to be done with a simple strut suspension.

 

Same here I'm looking for it all. With the Subaru the plane in which the lca is traveling is increased just like caster with a simple spacer . More akin to the Evo 4-6 chassis mount though( google Evo 4 lca and a Subaru gm gc gd arm you'll see what I mean ). Spacing the rear lca mount more downward is the net effect, and a bolt with solid spacers would accomplish the same thing. Since the plane and therefore traveling arc of the lca controls the location of te knuckle the effect is accomplished .

Suspension that travels 180* opposite to the bump is desirable and faster. Bumps aren't straight up and down. In the same note braking force will collapse suspension but the more horizontal the travel is the less dive is accomplished. That's what spacing the rear down or front up accomplishes. (Less dive )

Nasioc contained a lot of more in depth material

I should add that its no different than a double a arm suspension because the lower arm controls this stuff in both cases and the upper arm dicates the location of the top of the knuckle. In any event you can dictate the amount of caster during compression, the camber curve so on so forth with the bottom arm. in a strut you only have the bottom arm and the strut to work with. in a double arm suspension you can really tailor the geometry much more finitely.

you can run a stiffer suspension, when you tailor the angle of your suspension arms to the speed and force in which you maintain. This IS ALWAYS a compromise between low and high speed with averages.

{in the past I helped design geometry for full suspension mtn bikes and the more accurately the wheel could travel opposing the bump, the faster the bike would be able to go over it, because the suspension did the work}

its a crazy tangent, but in reality its all connected no pun intended.


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before trying to alter anti dive geometry, I would want as much caster as possible by strut top and perrin or whiteline offset bushing. because the LCA will be traveling more towards your feet than before, eating static caster like a vegetable monster. if you can get the axis of compression in the strut closer to perpendicular to the plane of LCA compression then you wouldn't lose much or any. but im only guessing they're not that way from the factory and adding more "rake" to your LCA will make your steering become more twitchy in compression if that is the case.

 

That seems backwards to me. I would think that you'd want the rear pivot of the lower LCA to be higher than front to create anti-dive. You want a set-up where pushing the front wheels towards the back of the car would lever the chassis upwards. What I am not seeing?

 

edited cause I was wrong no point in mis information

 

Ivica, you are thinking too much. Just track the car. lol. Driver mod. Driver mod. Driver mod trumps everything else. When you think you can't go any faster, still driver mod and seat time will net more gains than any spacer will. Don't over analyze every aspect. Just go drive. More fun and cheaper.

 

Zhong

I agree, but as engineer I explore options.
Having researched, and shared some of the calculations in this thread, in addition to speaking to successful Evo competitors, I concluded that Evo X arms mod in itself has virtually no tangible benefit.

Similarly I explored the sway bars, and concluded that in themselves they are tuning tools, but not the first and most performance advantage tuning tool is driver experience and training: so that is the first and only step I will make.

I'll be class below, or two at the beginning, and doing-time.

 

I'm not following you at all.

You actually get the least vertical movement of the hub for a unit compression of the shock when the shock is vertical (although that might not be what you meant by pivoting in a plane parallel to the ground).

But more than anything else, what you wrote seems to be about motion ratio, instead of anti-dive. Anti-dive is using the fore-aft force coming in to the chassis from the wheel to pry the nose up, just as anti-squat is the same for the rear. The trailing link in the rear of all recent Evos is a clear example of anti-squat. I don't see how to get much if any anti-dive out of a single-lower-arm strut suspension. You could get a little by tilting the "plane" of the lower arm, but not much.

 

i can draw a picture all I want but Im wrong.

 

iowa, I was going off of memory in the suspension department from my Subaru. There was a significant confusion with the name ANTI LIFT KIT. It got me again.

The anti lift kit doesn't give less lift and dive. It promotes it. my bad. So when you said you wanted to learn more, I learned more .

So anyways it sounds like we want more dive and more lift doesn't it?

 

Where is that quote from, please. I'd like to see it in context.

I've never really thought about the effects, if any, of anti-dive/anti-squat on grip. The idea that you want dive and squat is hard for me to wrap my head around. Maybe you do. But I still can't imagine any benefits of more dive would outweigh the negatives of lowering the front roll center.

 

Iowa99 pm me will ya

 

Iowa999

I would not seek extensive information from any one of us enthusiast when it comes making such drastic decisions as modifying the anti-dive nature and more.

I would even take with a grain-of-salt any claim/suggestion/advice/offer by reputable suspension specialist/guru, because its beyond the scope of typical modification and Mitsubishi has without a doubt destined an awesome car- proof is in winning record in Group N and R4 racing where such changes are not permitted.

We (in general, outside few exceptions, perhaps AMS Time Attack Team and similarly capable professionals) don't have enough knowledge or experience to be able to correctly identify real shortcoming and solution to it, of the magnitude such as anti-dive geometry and changes to it effects on everything else.

Personally I am not going to pursue Evo X arms nor larger sway bars, having realized that Evo X arms make virtually no difference to the weight transfer (-20lb by calculations out of 1100lb, its meaningless 2%) especially considering the expense of arms, steering arm extensions, fenders with +30mm additional width, and more such as new Whiteline extended-ball-joint kit for Evo X arms and bushings. Installed price is $2000 pulls Fenders (that require painting) - fenders require to remove the bumper to fit, and all FRP fenders require bodyshop to fit, so if you take into account that fenders are at least $400-500, plus bodyshop charge or at least $500-$1000 for fittings/paint, its throwing money to the wind.

But that is my conclusion, you may have different opinion.
I am only suggesting, based on my own view.

 

Cool. I'm now a gravel and dirt duffer, so I wasn't planning on doing anything for anti-dive, anyway, since there's never enough grip for it to matter. In fact, that's one of the reasons I believe that gravel and dirt cars have struts, instead of double-wishbone, besides the obvious need to keep unspring mass down and wanting maximum travel -- because anti-dive isn't needed. In the rear, the small amount of extra weight to get some anti-squat is good, because there are times when you have a moment of grip, plus we try to turn with power, instead of the front wheels.

But the possibility of angling the front lower LCA for some anti-dive was still of great interest to me. I do daily drive the car, too, plus I drive to events (on paved roads).

As to widening, all I've done is run low-offset wheels and call it a day. Wheel bearings are a consumable, plus only +18 or less 15" wheels will stay off the toe-arm tab on the rear knuckle.

cheers