Going into ABS?
Sep 13, 2018, 11:18 PM
#16
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (1)
You have to be able to quickly reach that threshold though. It definitely takes a lot of practice and training.
Sep 14, 2018, 05:10 AM
#17
EvoM Guru
i used to hit it occasionally on initial braking into a tight turn if i applied too much pedal pressure but it just does a little skip then your fine. it doesnt really work like a motorsport ABS system like Motec etc as its only really designed to work when ur in a full panic and the brakes hard on the firewall and your wheels are completely locked. Its not really designed to regulate minor lockups under normal braking like a motorsport ABS system is. With a Motec system it will be able to be tuned so u can find that absolute limit of threshold and prevent those minor pinches of the brake. factory ABS wont give u that.
I had to remove my ABS completely when i went to slicks as it couldnt figure out wtf was going on when they were cold and u tried to warm them up due to having such little grip it would assume you had locked a wheel and ABS would kick in preventing you from braking hard enough to warm up the tyres n brakes. real weird feeling. Couple other people who race evos down here on slicks had same issue. Its not an issue if ur still on DOT tyres however. my hankook z221s never did it. only slicks.
I had to remove my ABS completely when i went to slicks as it couldnt figure out wtf was going on when they were cold and u tried to warm them up due to having such little grip it would assume you had locked a wheel and ABS would kick in preventing you from braking hard enough to warm up the tyres n brakes. real weird feeling. Couple other people who race evos down here on slicks had same issue. Its not an issue if ur still on DOT tyres however. my hankook z221s never did it. only slicks.
Sep 14, 2018, 11:15 AM
#18
i used to hit it occasionally on initial braking into a tight turn if i applied too much pedal pressure but it just does a little skip then your fine. it doesnt really work like a motorsport ABS system like Motec etc as its only really designed to work when ur in a full panic and the brakes hard on the firewall and your wheels are completely locked. Its not really designed to regulate minor lockups under normal braking like a motorsport ABS system is. With a Motec system it will be able to be tuned so u can find that absolute limit of threshold and prevent those minor pinches of the brake. factory ABS wont give u that.
I had to remove my ABS completely when i went to slicks as it couldnt figure out wtf was going on when they were cold and u tried to warm them up due to having such little grip it would assume you had locked a wheel and ABS would kick in preventing you from braking hard enough to warm up the tyres n brakes. real weird feeling. Couple other people who race evos down here on slicks had same issue. Its not an issue if ur still on DOT tyres however. my hankook z221s never did it. only slicks.
I had to remove my ABS completely when i went to slicks as it couldnt figure out wtf was going on when they were cold and u tried to warm them up due to having such little grip it would assume you had locked a wheel and ABS would kick in preventing you from braking hard enough to warm up the tyres n brakes. real weird feeling. Couple other people who race evos down here on slicks had same issue. Its not an issue if ur still on DOT tyres however. my hankook z221s never did it. only slicks.
Also, I REALLY like the idea of tunable ABS. You could learn the threshold without flat spotting tires. 😂
Sep 14, 2018, 12:10 PM
#19
You guys should get an RS. My years of driving So. Cal tracks, never missed having ABS
Not that im an expert, but you quickly learn threshold braking techniques (never have flat spotted a tire)
Seems like practicing threshold braking w/ABS would cause you to enter a corner w/less speed, so the ABS trigger point is not reached.
But maybe you guys are relying on the ABS activation & incorporate that into the lap?
Side note: Really dislike having ABS on my DD road car (ABS triggers too often for my liking)
Not that im an expert, but you quickly learn threshold braking techniques (never have flat spotted a tire)
Seems like practicing threshold braking w/ABS would cause you to enter a corner w/less speed, so the ABS trigger point is not reached.
But maybe you guys are relying on the ABS activation & incorporate that into the lap?
Side note: Really dislike having ABS on my DD road car (ABS triggers too often for my liking)
Last edited by MinusPrevious; Sep 14, 2018 at 12:31 PM.
Sep 14, 2018, 12:58 PM
#20
You guys should get an RS. My years of driving So. Cal tracks, never missed having ABS
Not that im an expert, but you quickly learn threshold braking techniques (never have flat spotted a tire)
Seems like practicing threshold braking w/ABS would cause you to enter a corner w/less speed, so the ABS trigger point is not reached.
But maybe you guys are relying on the ABS activation & incorporate that into the lap?
Side note: Really dislike having ABS on my DD road car (ABS triggers too often for my liking)
Not that im an expert, but you quickly learn threshold braking techniques (never have flat spotted a tire)
Seems like practicing threshold braking w/ABS would cause you to enter a corner w/less speed, so the ABS trigger point is not reached.
But maybe you guys are relying on the ABS activation & incorporate that into the lap?
Side note: Really dislike having ABS on my DD road car (ABS triggers too often for my liking)
As we mentioned above, none of us are getting into ABS during our track time. So far, not incorporating it.
What kind of surface do you drive on to for ABS to activate so much while daily driving?
I've never had ABS kick in on any of my cars (I have a '12 Civic and '00 Civic), though living in CA helps; the roads are pretty much always optimal.
Sep 14, 2018, 01:16 PM
#21
An RS wasn't avail when I was shopping. I wish, though
What kind of surface do you drive on to for ABS to activate so much while daily driving? I've never had ABS kick in on any of my cars (I have a '12 Civic and '00 Civic), though living in CA helps; the roads are pretty much always optimal.
What kind of surface do you drive on to for ABS to activate so much while daily driving?
I've never had ABS kick in on any of my cars (I have a '12 Civic and '00 Civic), though living in CA helps; the roads are pretty much always optimal.
Point no. 2 = I have coilovers on my daily & drive kinda hard, at times, & i trigger both ABS during hard braking & the stability system while corning
Sep 15, 2018, 07:18 PM
#25
I only asked one their crewmen about it. He just noted that Ken is a late braker & prefers ABS on his EvO. I talked to Ken quite a bit but didnt think about asking him about it (darn it!!). He won his class today & was 2nd quickest overall. There were some super fast cars competing (high WHP / 600 & up)
Sep 15, 2018, 07:56 PM
#26
I only asked one their crewmen about it. He just noted that Ken is a late braker & prefers ABS on his EvO. I talked to Ken quite a bit but didnt think about asking him about it (darn it!!). He won his class today & was 2nd quickest overall. There were some super fast cars competing (high WHP / 600 & up)
. Such a worthy car on the track
Sep 15, 2018, 08:16 PM
#28
Gotta rep the Evo community. 😂 it's My favorite car, so far. I drove the Atom. That thing is a hand full on skinny tires. I only got two runs, but was creeping up on the owner's time. I think I may have been able to catch him. A rewarding car to drive ,no doubt.
Sep 16, 2018, 03:36 AM
#29
I have an RS too, so no ABS, but I’ve tracked and autocrossed with an ABS car too. I like the fact that no ABS is predictable, as I hate the feeling of ABS when it kicks in in motorsports driving (usually on an uneven, rough surface). I feel similarly about stability control and traction control. However, I know that some of the fast guys add it back to the RS, so I assume it’s useful if you are a good enough driver. Honda-guy comes to mind as a local (to this board) example.
One thing I like in particular about not having ABS on track though, is knowing that if I ever get so sideways in a fast turn that I can’t save it, that if I go both feet in, the car will slide in a straight and predictable line. That’s never happened to me, but I’m worried more about contact with other cars and walls than I am about lap times and flat spotting tires. A car with ABS will always slide in some sort of arc with both feet in (if car is not braking from a straight line) simply because the wheels will keep turning.
ABS is great for wet conditions, street panic stops and driving unfamiliar cars at (and beyond) the limit though. I’m doing the BMW Ultimate Driver national runoff thing sometime this winter and I’m sure I never would have qualified without abundant use of the ABS in the X2 that I drove locally. I think I nearly pushed the brake pedal through the floorboard in the stop box!
One thing I like in particular about not having ABS on track though, is knowing that if I ever get so sideways in a fast turn that I can’t save it, that if I go both feet in, the car will slide in a straight and predictable line. That’s never happened to me, but I’m worried more about contact with other cars and walls than I am about lap times and flat spotting tires. A car with ABS will always slide in some sort of arc with both feet in (if car is not braking from a straight line) simply because the wheels will keep turning.
ABS is great for wet conditions, street panic stops and driving unfamiliar cars at (and beyond) the limit though. I’m doing the BMW Ultimate Driver national runoff thing sometime this winter and I’m sure I never would have qualified without abundant use of the ABS in the X2 that I drove locally. I think I nearly pushed the brake pedal through the floorboard in the stop box!
Sep 18, 2018, 06:08 AM
#30
Evolved Member
I have had problems with ABS on track in some really bumpy braking zones where the ABS would go into some kind of snow mode and cut down dramatically on brake force... got into the gravel trap once. Some Porsche GT3s had simmilar issues so it is a known problem.
We cant really just pull the abs fuse as the abs does the job of brake ballance, but I am investigating the deletion of ABS and brake booster for my next brake setup..
We cant really just pull the abs fuse as the abs does the job of brake ballance, but I am investigating the deletion of ABS and brake booster for my next brake setup..