The setup of nearly every car is the same, that is why the manuals are just tweaked for each car. Most of the applications have adjustable timing, so this was an oversight on the engineers part that did that particular manual, and it is getting changed.

Timing belts don't "stretch", if they streched they would be chewed apart by the gears because none of the coggs would line up. They are designed specifically not to stretch. The marks can move around all you want, all the more reason to not adjust it. You are syncing the cam with the position of the number one cylinders piston at TDC compression. The marks aren't attached to the crank so they are meaning less in the end. If you were 1 degree off it is most likely perception! We use a bit more sophisticated method of verifying timing. If you have adjusted your cam gears off of zero, then yes, you will want to re-sync it! If not....Don't!

Jason.

 

If it doesn't have an adjustment how would you resync it with the cam gears? It is right in the menu and this is what changes the ems base timing value so it will match up again, right. So it is adjustable, if you were to check it you could adjust it even with stock gears if it wasn't correct. If you can adjust it after you adjust cam gears you can adjust it before or you can choose to leave it alone. The marks aren't attached to the crank, ya but that belt is which keeps everything in sync with the crank so I would think that it does matter where those marks are. Belts don't streach like a rubber band of course but they do a very , very minor bit this being the reason why you replace them before they brake. Everything streaches or bends before it breaks in most cases. Lets be real don't damage a motor for somthing that takes 5 min to check before you start tuning. I am supprised you can't agree with that.

This can be anyones opinion, in my case maybe I just like to be damn sure before I continue on to the next thing becuase most of the time assumption is what gets you.

Thanks for you insite and I am glad we could have this discussion.

 

If you adjust the cam gear, you are moving its point of reference to the computer. If you don't, you aren't. The timing IS NOT ADJUSTABLE in stock form, meaning you can't mechanically change it. With gears you can now MECHANICALLY change it and therefore need to re- sync it. You will be 100 times more likely to damage the motor if you do change it! The stock settings (which tell the computer the amount of degrees the cam sync comes in relation to the crank for TDC) are 100% correct. Moving the timing indicators doesn't change the timing, just the timing light reference point, therefore they are meaningless. I could take a bare engine, put it at TDC#1, and cams staight up on #1, and put my marker and reference anywhere around the pulley I wanted and it would reference zero! In the EMSs world, anything can happen, as it only knows what you tell it. Timing belts vary maybe a 1/4 degree, it isn't from stretch, it is from slack. The belts come apart because the rubber coatings start to wear, and heat cylcling takes its toll, but they DO NOT stretch.....they break!

Jason.

 

The timing isn't adjustable in stock form no, I never said that I was talking about EMS timing to the motor to make sure it matches after the ems is installed upon its first startup. The same steps should be taken when installed and or even adjusting the cam gears. Timing belts vary maybe 1/4 degree but slack is diffently what gets you due to several factors if you want to get in to every instance that they can gain slack from. Bottom line I understand you are trying to cover several instances or maybe installs that you have done. Sorry to bring it up but all I did is follow the instructions and you can't go wrong be being completely sure that the timing is accurate if you know how to set it on the ems so the ems and motor TDC matches. I understand you guys dont do this and thats cool but a few things you say just done add up. Sounds like there is more than one opinion at AEM as well or they wouldn't of left it in the instruction manual and they wouldn't be posting it on the forums section anytime anyone has a problem with timing from first startup to the last. I am not telling you how to change your method I was just letting the person on here know mine and that I usually choose the safe route but we all have to cover ourselves I guess.

 

The problem is, by checking and adjusting, you are only making it wrong. As I stated twice before, if you don't have adjustable cam gears, or haven't adjusted them, DON'T ADJUST THE EMS! IT WILL BE WRONG!

You can't be assured of the timing light you are using, so just don't do it. There are not several opinions here at AEM, we are ALL on the same page. It sounds to me like you or someone else misunderstood them. The want you to check it to make sure it is close when you put an aftermarket CDI on the car, but they still don't tell you to adjust it, just change the edge on the cdi if it is off!

Jason.

 

http://forum.aempower.com/bbs/viewtopic.php?t=10600

:-)

 

So to sum up this long and drawn out conversation .. DO NOT ADJUST THE TIMING ON THE EVO VIII WITH THE EMS BOX.... Thanks for the input jason..


Mark
turbotrix

 

To Be clear, DO NOT ADJUST THE SYNC for the ignition timing. You can put the timing numbers in the ignition map where ever you want!

Jason.

 

To be even more clear be sure to put the correct information on the instructions manual so other people are not mislead, ones that actualy read the instructions.

And do check and sync the timing on a car that has the cam gears adjusted correct. It is just not a straight DONT ADJUST THE TIMING ON A EVO.