Works Aperture Gains Documented?
Works Aperture Gains Documented?
For a stock car - or even one with 3" TBE?
Buschur Racing is posting that their getting no to negative gain with stock intake. Any comments?
Thanks!
Buschur Racing is posting that their getting no to negative gain with stock intake. Any comments?
Thanks!
Originally Posted by davidbuschur
So, after getting it tuned and two passes that were identical to each other I pulled the stock throttle body off the car.
I had two throttle bodies to test. In my mind NO larger throttle body is going to gain HP if the hole that it bolts to (stock intake) has the same old small hole in it the throttle body use to. In otherwords, bolting a 65mm TB to a 55 mm hole should not gain HP.
First I tested the throttle body we bought from Works on the car. Then I tested our throttle body. The performance was EXACTLY the same. NO change. As a matter of fact if I had to make a decision I would say both lost a little bit of power, 1-2 in a few spots.
You just can't expect to gain HP by making the air more turbulent, going from a larger hole back into a smaller one. It can't happen. Now, porting the hole in the stock intake to match the larger TB would then probably make a difference.
This brings us to what is going on now. The intake is now being taken off the car, we are going to put the ported/Extrude Honed intake on the car now with the larger throttle body and see what happens. I am once again hoping for a gain, but I will post the actual results regardless if they are good or not.
Stay tuned,
David Buschur
I had two throttle bodies to test. In my mind NO larger throttle body is going to gain HP if the hole that it bolts to (stock intake) has the same old small hole in it the throttle body use to. In otherwords, bolting a 65mm TB to a 55 mm hole should not gain HP.
First I tested the throttle body we bought from Works on the car. Then I tested our throttle body. The performance was EXACTLY the same. NO change. As a matter of fact if I had to make a decision I would say both lost a little bit of power, 1-2 in a few spots.
You just can't expect to gain HP by making the air more turbulent, going from a larger hole back into a smaller one. It can't happen. Now, porting the hole in the stock intake to match the larger TB would then probably make a difference.
This brings us to what is going on now. The intake is now being taken off the car, we are going to put the ported/Extrude Honed intake on the car now with the larger throttle body and see what happens. I am once again hoping for a gain, but I will post the actual results regardless if they are good or not.
Stay tuned,
David Buschur
i would like to hear from Works as well on this. My guess is it may improve torque curve, spool or throttle respone that might not show up on the dyno. Big fan of both Buschur and Works stuff.
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Originally Posted by wingless
i would like to hear from Works as well on this. My guess is it may improve torque curve, spool or throttle respone that might not show up on the dyno. Big fan of both Buschur and Works stuff.
I will have an answer for you all after Saturday. My last dyno was done with WORKS P2 and buschur 3" TBE. Since then i have added the Works Aperture and will overlay the results. Just hope my clutch holds up until saturday. I have 26k miles and it is really starting to feel weak. Engages very high compared to new, but as of now there is no clutch slipping when i stomp on it in higher gears.
Quote from Dave B. today. This explains it, and is why both of these companys although very different are both awsome.
[Now is the really messed up part that has left me scambling since Saturday morning.
We started testing throttle bodies last week. I posted the results. I WAS DEAD a** WRONG ABOUT THE RESULTS. I don't know if I was seeing what I wanted to see or what. I had the two dyno charts flipped. In other words the last one was on top and the first one was on the bottom. This lead me to believe there was NO gain from the throttle body bolted to the stock intake. I WAS WRONG. I read the chart wrong. The 65 mm throttle body, both ours and Works, did gain HP. No peak HP was gained but it smoothed out the dips in the run and in those dips the gains were 3-5 whp. This is even with the stock hole still in the intake. Sorry for posting the wrong information.
Next thing we wanted to try was the Extrude Honed intake with the 65 mm throttle body. This is when the testing went down hill and has cost me 5 nights of sleep. The power dropped. The boost dropped. I had the intake off the car 3 times, the throttle body off atleast 8 times. No matter what I did I could NOT maintain more than 16 psi of boost at redline. EVERYTHING was checked or eliminated. The only change was the intake and throttle body. The low end tire spinning monster was gone. The car was lazy to spool and had no boost at redline. Before the intake we were able to hold 19 psi in the 7,000-7500 range. Now max boost in that range was 16 psi. Power was down but I have to attribute this to the dropped boost as I know the Extrude Honed intake will make more power. Ended up no matter what we tried all we could make was 356 whp and 359 ft lbs.]
[Now is the really messed up part that has left me scambling since Saturday morning.
We started testing throttle bodies last week. I posted the results. I WAS DEAD a** WRONG ABOUT THE RESULTS. I don't know if I was seeing what I wanted to see or what. I had the two dyno charts flipped. In other words the last one was on top and the first one was on the bottom. This lead me to believe there was NO gain from the throttle body bolted to the stock intake. I WAS WRONG. I read the chart wrong. The 65 mm throttle body, both ours and Works, did gain HP. No peak HP was gained but it smoothed out the dips in the run and in those dips the gains were 3-5 whp. This is even with the stock hole still in the intake. Sorry for posting the wrong information.
Next thing we wanted to try was the Extrude Honed intake with the 65 mm throttle body. This is when the testing went down hill and has cost me 5 nights of sleep. The power dropped. The boost dropped. I had the intake off the car 3 times, the throttle body off atleast 8 times. No matter what I did I could NOT maintain more than 16 psi of boost at redline. EVERYTHING was checked or eliminated. The only change was the intake and throttle body. The low end tire spinning monster was gone. The car was lazy to spool and had no boost at redline. Before the intake we were able to hold 19 psi in the 7,000-7500 range. Now max boost in that range was 16 psi. Power was down but I have to attribute this to the dropped boost as I know the Extrude Honed intake will make more power. Ended up no matter what we tried all we could make was 356 whp and 359 ft lbs.]
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Stock throttle body vs. WORKS Aperture (original) on the same day with no tuning changes.
In case you can't read the text, stock peak was 229WHP vs. 237WHP and there is smoothness over the dips.
In case you can't read the text, stock peak was 229WHP vs. 237WHP and there is smoothness over the dips.
Last edited by EM@WORKS; Feb 3, 2005 at 09:15 PM.
