heel and toe
It would be awkward to turn your feet like that.
Newbie
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 65
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From: Pembroke Pines FL
i usually brake in a hard corner, and also downshift while the clutch is in.. let the clutch out slowly, and by the time you reach the apex, your engine is up to the speed of the wheels.. that way you don't have to blip the throttle..
but on regular downshifts, i always blip.. much smoother shift..
but on regular downshifts, i always blip.. much smoother shift..
Newbie
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 62
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From: Irvine, CA USA
Originally posted by codemunky
You probably could do it that way. But I wonder if you could hold the brake consistently with that method, since you are rolling your foot laterally, more like a twist. But do experiment on both techniques. When I was just starting out, I saw the pros doing it with the other method, even in the videos. Perhaps try driving with some thick socks on to get the pedal feel, and try both methods. I'm not kidding...
Oh yeah, it's not really difficult, it just feels weird at first. But you'll get used to it. It's not what you consider it to be "normal" driving. Besides, the E-brake isn't just used for holding the car in place when you are going to go get groceries, right?
You probably could do it that way. But I wonder if you could hold the brake consistently with that method, since you are rolling your foot laterally, more like a twist. But do experiment on both techniques. When I was just starting out, I saw the pros doing it with the other method, even in the videos. Perhaps try driving with some thick socks on to get the pedal feel, and try both methods. I'm not kidding...
Oh yeah, it's not really difficult, it just feels weird at first. But you'll get used to it. It's not what you consider it to be "normal" driving. Besides, the E-brake isn't just used for holding the car in place when you are going to go get groceries, right?
Newbie
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: S. Ogden, Utah, USA
EZ give me your email or send it to me on AIM... i want to mob that video from you so i can see the proper way to do it... the way i have been doin it doesnt work so well... rpm's drop a little more than id like... my name on AIM is "klik 95"
I read an article about heel & toe in an SCCA magazine. It involves using the toe on the gas (keeping the revs up as described earlier in this thread), the heel on the brake (since you are slowing down going into the corner), and the left foot clutch (cause you're shifting). The article said this is a smooth way to carry the most speed through a corner in racing. It also mentioned something about a car breaking loose from the jolt of letting the clutch out with the engine revs too low to match the tranny. But this is a full body workout: right toe gas, right heel brake, left foot clutch, right hand stick, left hand steer, all while driving almost out of control around a turn. I tried it and am miles from even pretending to master it, but it's fun trying.
Newbie
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: Irvine, CA USA
Originally posted by urbanknight
I read an article about heel & toe in an SCCA magazine. It involves using the toe on the gas (keeping the revs up as described earlier in this thread), the heel on the brake (since you are slowing down going into the corner), and the left foot clutch (cause you're shifting). The article said this is a smooth way to carry the most speed through a corner in racing. It also mentioned something about a car breaking loose from the jolt of letting the clutch out with the engine revs too low to match the tranny. But this is a full body workout: right toe gas, right heel brake, left foot clutch, right hand stick, left hand steer, all while driving almost out of control around a turn. I tried it and am miles from even pretending to master it, but it's fun trying.
I read an article about heel & toe in an SCCA magazine. It involves using the toe on the gas (keeping the revs up as described earlier in this thread), the heel on the brake (since you are slowing down going into the corner), and the left foot clutch (cause you're shifting). The article said this is a smooth way to carry the most speed through a corner in racing. It also mentioned something about a car breaking loose from the jolt of letting the clutch out with the engine revs too low to match the tranny. But this is a full body workout: right toe gas, right heel brake, left foot clutch, right hand stick, left hand steer, all while driving almost out of control around a turn. I tried it and am miles from even pretending to master it, but it's fun trying.
Newbie
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
From: Camp Pendleton, CA
Can someone tell me where i can find video clips of the heel and toe shift in action? i've bee trying to do it but only mangaged to do it once ( i think, i hit a sharp turn and i just instinctivly or accidently held the gas and brake at the same time, but i think i downshifeted first) well it made a " drift " sound ( is it suppose to do that? ) well thanks for all the info , greatly appreciated
In Timeout
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 214
Likes: 0
From: Monte Carlo
LMAO.... u did wa...
HaHaHaha.... FF don;t drift unless you use your hand brake thru a turn(which is pointless for a FF). Anywho hahahah... it made the drift sound, if anything thats teh sound of your car understeering since US LAncers dont have any type of LSD ro anything. Have fun udnersteering buddy!
....only mangaged to do it once ( i think, i hit a sharp turn and i just instinctivly or accidently held the gas and brake at the same time, but i think i downshifeted first) well it made a " drift " sound ( is it suppose to do that? )
Newbie
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
From: Camp Pendleton, CA
LOL i never said i drifted i said a drift sound. Im not so sure about what i did but u seem to knoe what ur talking about. u mind if we chat on aim? i have a lot of simple questions u would probably be able to answer. Anyways i still need some clips of the h&t. Thanks.
Evolving Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
From: SF
Originally posted by CivicEater
i usually brake in a hard corner, and also downshift while the clutch is in.. let the clutch out slowly, and by the time you reach the apex, your engine is up to the speed of the wheels.. that way you don't have to blip the throttle..
but on regular downshifts, i always blip.. much smoother shift..
i usually brake in a hard corner, and also downshift while the clutch is in.. let the clutch out slowly, and by the time you reach the apex, your engine is up to the speed of the wheels.. that way you don't have to blip the throttle..
but on regular downshifts, i always blip.. much smoother shift..
Newbie
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
From: MTL
Driving towards the curve, start braking (hard, soft, depending on your speed), clutch in, neutral, release clutch
AS your braking by keeping the initial pressure u were giving it (otherwise ur gonna jolt frontwards) and blip the throttle (as u keep on doing it, ull know how much ull need to blip by feeling alone without lookin at the rpm's)
Assuming you reached your desired rpm, you down shift right away (without letting the rpm drop at all much, or else, a nice little jolt comes along once again) and finally finish breaking, then accelerate.
All this done with a smooth finish and BEFORE the apex.
AS your braking by keeping the initial pressure u were giving it (otherwise ur gonna jolt frontwards) and blip the throttle (as u keep on doing it, ull know how much ull need to blip by feeling alone without lookin at the rpm's)
Assuming you reached your desired rpm, you down shift right away (without letting the rpm drop at all much, or else, a nice little jolt comes along once again) and finally finish breaking, then accelerate.
All this done with a smooth finish and BEFORE the apex.
Evolving Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
From: SF
Originally posted by El-Vegs
Driving towards the curve, start braking (hard, soft, depending on your speed), clutch in, neutral, release clutch
AS your braking by keeping the initial pressure u were giving it (otherwise ur gonna jolt frontwards) and blip the throttle (as u keep on doing it, ull know how much ull need to blip by feeling alone without lookin at the rpm's)
Assuming you reached your desired rpm, you down shift right away (without letting the rpm drop at all much, or else, a nice little jolt comes along once again) and finally finish breaking, then accelerate.
All this done with a smooth finish and BEFORE the apex.
Driving towards the curve, start braking (hard, soft, depending on your speed), clutch in, neutral, release clutch
AS your braking by keeping the initial pressure u were giving it (otherwise ur gonna jolt frontwards) and blip the throttle (as u keep on doing it, ull know how much ull need to blip by feeling alone without lookin at the rpm's)
Assuming you reached your desired rpm, you down shift right away (without letting the rpm drop at all much, or else, a nice little jolt comes along once again) and finally finish breaking, then accelerate.
All this done with a smooth finish and BEFORE the apex.
Also if anyone is interested heres a video of a lap of me racing about a month ago in San Diego. Please right click on the link and save it to your hard drive instead of streaming it directly from the server. Thanks.
Right Click and choose save as....
Originally posted by codemunky
Hmmm...that's close to impossible...just because of the usual brake accel. setup. Also, I think you have better pedal feel with the toe on the brake, heel on the gas. Afterall, you are just blipping the throttle with the heel. However I could be wrong: How the hell do you heel-toe on Mini Coopers?
Hmmm...that's close to impossible...just because of the usual brake accel. setup. Also, I think you have better pedal feel with the toe on the brake, heel on the gas. Afterall, you are just blipping the throttle with the heel. However I could be wrong: How the hell do you heel-toe on Mini Coopers?