DYNOJET VS DYNODYNAMICS... Round XX
Apr 3, 2009, 01:58 AM
#76
Since there is an audience of Dyno-Dynamics people here, this is one point of data I always found interesting. Here is an evo motor engine dyno plot, and then after is the DD graph. Also take note of the Shootout mode parameters displayed on the bottom of the DD sheet which effect the power it reads. To me, all dyno sheets should have that type of data at the bottom of them. DD guarantees different dynos read within 5% of each other when run in Shootout mode.
I've never seen a DD sheet posted on the UK board not run in Shootout mode.
I've never seen a DD sheet posted on the UK board not run in Shootout mode.
Apr 3, 2009, 02:02 AM
#77
Those graphs above are from Feb 07 original thread here:
http://www.lancerregister.com/showthread.php?t=140934
http://www.lancerregister.com/showthread.php?t=140934
Apr 3, 2009, 03:44 AM
#78
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As a final note, one thing that has upset me so much over the years is how many DD shops use a 1.1 or 1.2 or even 1.3 correction factor. It really destroys the DD dynos reputation. Whoever is the dealer for DD in the USA I think has been a big let down. Also, all DD runs should be in shootout mode so all the variables of the run are printed on the graph.
As a final note, one thing that has upset me so much over the years is how many DD shops use a 1.1 or 1.2 or even 1.3 correction factor. It really destroys the DD dynos reputation. Whoever is the dealer for DD in the USA I think has been a big let down. Also, all DD runs should be in shootout mode so all the variables of the run are printed on the graph.
They do that over seas most of the time, but for everything to be same same, the dyno has to be certified by dynodynamics for shootout mode. Good luck getting anyone from dynodynamics usa support to come out and do that, half the time they can't even get you a critical part when you need it. I love DD, just hate the support, or lack there of, that we get in the states.
Apr 3, 2009, 05:29 AM
#79
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Shootout mode will read flywheel power almost bang on, not wheel power.
They do that over seas most of the time, but for everything to be same same, the dyno has to be certified by dynodynamics for shootout mode. Good luck getting anyone from dynodynamics usa support to come out and do that, half the time they can't even get you a critical part when you need it. I love DD, just hate the support, or lack there of, that we get in the states.
They do that over seas most of the time, but for everything to be same same, the dyno has to be certified by dynodynamics for shootout mode. Good luck getting anyone from dynodynamics usa support to come out and do that, half the time they can't even get you a critical part when you need it. I love DD, just hate the support, or lack there of, that we get in the states.
On other terms, this is how we set up our load calculations according to Whp/Wtq.
100 Load<300whp
125 Load<400whp
145 Load<500whp
165 Load<600whp
175 Load>750whp+
I do not use shootout mode at all anymore. It has proven to cause more trouble then what it's worth and I will refuse to offer that option because of it.
I believe a chassis dyno is meant to measure whp/wtq. If you want flywheel numbers go to a engine dyno when your motor is out of the car.
Apr 3, 2009, 06:54 AM
#80
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Great explanation. That is exactly how we have to set it up at my shop in order to run the car effectively in shoot out mode. You have to change the parameters from Power/Torque to Flywheel Power/ Flywheel Torque in order for shoot out mode to take effect. Shoot 44, which is what i see in that above graph will also take the load setting on the dyno from whatever you have and set it to 100 load. Now on a big horsepower car, 100 load is ridiculous, you will never be able to get grip and spin the roller effectively. Since I have the updated software, there is no way for me to even hide that I am using shootout mode. That same box will also appear at the bottom of the graph and give every detail of what I put it. (what type of shootout mode, tire pressure, etc) The old software has the option of not showing anything.
On other terms, this is how we set up our load calculations according to Whp/Wtq.
100 Load<300whp
125 Load<400whp
145 Load<500whp
165 Load<600whp
175 Load>750whp+
I do not use shootout mode at all anymore. It has proven to cause more trouble then what it's worth and I will refuse to offer that option because of it.
I believe a chassis dyno is meant to measure whp/wtq. If you want flywheel numbers go to a engine dyno when your motor is out of the car.
On other terms, this is how we set up our load calculations according to Whp/Wtq.
100 Load<300whp
125 Load<400whp
145 Load<500whp
165 Load<600whp
175 Load>750whp+
I do not use shootout mode at all anymore. It has proven to cause more trouble then what it's worth and I will refuse to offer that option because of it.
I believe a chassis dyno is meant to measure whp/wtq. If you want flywheel numbers go to a engine dyno when your motor is out of the car.
Thank you for explaining your system. That's what this thread is all about!!
Quick question, how does 145 load vs 165 load effect the dyno result?
If you had a car run 1 vs the other back to back, what would be the change in the hp reading?
Apr 3, 2009, 08:53 AM
#82
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That was pretty funny,,, As always I enjoy your vids.
Now that you are entertaining this thread, please help us all out here-- you have tons of dyno time under your belt.
What did your 1000whp 150mph evo output on a mustang dyno? If I'm correct Buschur put down 640's to trap over 150 right? According to Buschur, the cars weighs about 2950 vs your 3200 correct?
Have you had the luxury of comparing your output on a DD?
Ultimately, our next test will be with the area's participating MD and I want to know what to expect since there has been confusion with that dyno as well.
I see some MD outputting high 500's with high 120 traps, and other MD with the same output trapping low 140's.
Apr 3, 2009, 09:25 AM
#83
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It all depends on how much power and torque the car is making and how much ramp speed is needed to equate the graph of the actual power being made. For example: A car making 500whp on a 100 load wouldn't make much power at all since it will be over powering the rollers and spinning them too fast. Too much load will cause the car to struggle and in some cases want to give the car traction and start coming up on top of the rollers and head for disaster.
Apr 3, 2009, 09:54 AM
#85
We have been Forge's #1 Evo products dealer for the last few years. 
We agree that the DD is the lower reading dyno.
We have not yet found a feature that the DD can do that the Mustang AWD-500 cannot.
We even have integrated drag racing module with complete external tree.
We agree that the DD is the lower reading dyno.
We have not yet found a feature that the DD can do that the Mustang AWD-500 cannot.
We even have integrated drag racing module with complete external tree.
Thanks for the positive feedback...
On a side note, we held a back to back test with a hallman boost controller vs the forge boost controller that same evening.
It all started when we dumped race gas into the "Skull Evo" and set the boost to 39psi... (20psi spring in the tial 44mm gate and boost controller cranked all the way down).
Hallman peaked to 39psi and started dropping right off the bat. We ended up with about 36psi at 8500rpm.
I must admit that I was skeptical, but when the DGmotors crew kept pushing the forge as a cure --we just went for it. The forge not only held the 39psi for a longer duration, it held more boost to 8500. I was very pleased to say the least.
To all the guys that pushed Forge products to me that I ignored-- my apologies. That thing works!!!
On a side note, we held a back to back test with a hallman boost controller vs the forge boost controller that same evening.
It all started when we dumped race gas into the "Skull Evo" and set the boost to 39psi... (20psi spring in the tial 44mm gate and boost controller cranked all the way down).
Hallman peaked to 39psi and started dropping right off the bat. We ended up with about 36psi at 8500rpm.
I must admit that I was skeptical, but when the DGmotors crew kept pushing the forge as a cure --we just went for it. The forge not only held the 39psi for a longer duration, it held more boost to 8500. I was very pleased to say the least.
To all the guys that pushed Forge products to me that I ignored-- my apologies. That thing works!!!
Apr 3, 2009, 09:58 AM
#86
Shootout mode will read flywheel power almost bang on, not wheel power.
They do that over seas most of the time, but for everything to be same same, the dyno has to be certified by dynodynamics for shootout mode. Good luck getting anyone from dynodynamics usa support to come out and do that, half the time they can't even get you a critical part when you need it. I love DD, just hate the support, or lack there of, that we get in the states.
They do that over seas most of the time, but for everything to be same same, the dyno has to be certified by dynodynamics for shootout mode. Good luck getting anyone from dynodynamics usa support to come out and do that, half the time they can't even get you a critical part when you need it. I love DD, just hate the support, or lack there of, that we get in the states.
And if you look at the example I posted above, I'm shocked you guys don't see the significance of that. That is an engine which went from engine dyno, put in the car, and slapped on a DD chassis dyno. That shows you the spread between flywheel and ATW.
s_hp = flywheel power... run in shootout mode and have it display on the graph "hp" not "s_hp".
Apr 3, 2009, 09:59 AM
#87
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We have been Forge's #1 Evo products dealer for the last few years.
We agree that the DD is the lower reading dyno.
We have not yet found a feature that the DD can do that the Mustang AWD-500 cannot.
We even have integrated drag racing module with complete external tree.
We agree that the DD is the lower reading dyno.
We have not yet found a feature that the DD can do that the Mustang AWD-500 cannot.
We even have integrated drag racing module with complete external tree.
I like the "dragrace" feature. Looks like fun.
Apr 3, 2009, 06:33 PM
#89
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That was pretty funny,,, As always I enjoy your vids.
Now that you are entertaining this thread, please help us all out here-- you have tons of dyno time under your belt.
What did your 1000whp 150mph evo output on a mustang dyno? If I'm correct Buschur put down 640's to trap over 150 right? According to Buschur, the cars weighs about 2950 vs your 3200 correct?
Have you had the luxury of comparing your output on a DD?
Ultimately, our next test will be with the area's participating MD and I want to know what to expect since there has been confusion with that dyno as well.
I see some MD outputting high 500's with high 120 traps, and other MD with the same output trapping low 140's.
Now that you are entertaining this thread, please help us all out here-- you have tons of dyno time under your belt.
What did your 1000whp 150mph evo output on a mustang dyno? If I'm correct Buschur put down 640's to trap over 150 right? According to Buschur, the cars weighs about 2950 vs your 3200 correct?
Have you had the luxury of comparing your output on a DD?
Ultimately, our next test will be with the area's participating MD and I want to know what to expect since there has been confusion with that dyno as well.
I see some MD outputting high 500's with high 120 traps, and other MD with the same output trapping low 140's.
I think the most I made on Buschur's dyno was 690 whp - although I can not specifically recall
Al