View Poll Results: Should all Horspower Records be set or backed up MANDATORY on Dynojet Dyno??
Voters: 240. You may not vote on this poll
Dyno Records.. We need 1 Standard of Measurement!!! Vote Now..
Aug 1, 2010, 09:21 PM
#32
Evolving Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Abq, NM
Posts: 219
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Who gives a **** about dyno numbers anyway, seriously? A dyno is a relative tuning tool to compare one run to the last.
If you want some way to compare one car to the next in different locations and/or at different times just run it at the track. Plain and simple. If you want to take the driver ability out of the equation, just use car+driver weight and trap speed.
But of course, that's just my opinion and I know that so many people here just love dyno numbers.
If you want some way to compare one car to the next in different locations and/or at different times just run it at the track. Plain and simple. If you want to take the driver ability out of the equation, just use car+driver weight and trap speed.
But of course, that's just my opinion and I know that so many people here just love dyno numbers.
If you have a MD and you already know you are at a huge disadvantage of 13%, I don't really think you are competing for any records. Any dyno that can be manipulated to read what ever cf or number you want should be discredited right away. A record should have as little variables as possible and two different dynos is a huge variable. To have a track record there is one variable, 1320 feet. That's it.
I think evodan has it right, who cares about dyno numbers, take it to the track.
About weight, if you are trying to set a record why would you not try to weigh as little as possible? That is just like trying to get a record on a MD. You are a huge disadvantage to start out with. I don't think ER is trying to get a record but other shops have tried and then complained about weight.
Aug 1, 2010, 09:40 PM
#33
I agree with this. And for the people who voted no. It should be, "No, I don't think there should be any dyno records at all."
If you have a MD and you already know you are at a huge disadvantage of 13%, I don't really think you are competing for any records. Any dyno that can be manipulated to read what ever cf or number you want should be discredited right away. A record should have as little variables as possible and two different dynos is a huge variable. To have a track record there is one variable, 1320 feet. That's it.
I think evodan has it right, who cares about dyno numbers, take it to the track.
About weight, if you are trying to set a record why would you not try to weigh as little as possible? That is just like trying to get a record on a MD. You are a huge disadvantage to start out with. I don't think ER is trying to get a record but other shops have tried and then complained about weight.
If you have a MD and you already know you are at a huge disadvantage of 13%, I don't really think you are competing for any records. Any dyno that can be manipulated to read what ever cf or number you want should be discredited right away. A record should have as little variables as possible and two different dynos is a huge variable. To have a track record there is one variable, 1320 feet. That's it.
I think evodan has it right, who cares about dyno numbers, take it to the track.
About weight, if you are trying to set a record why would you not try to weigh as little as possible? That is just like trying to get a record on a MD. You are a huge disadvantage to start out with. I don't think ER is trying to get a record but other shops have tried and then complained about weight.
To the weight comment...people are trying to compare engines... you say go to the track...I'm saying engines aren't the only factor to going fast, therefore you cannot assume that a vehicle with a lower ET/MPH by default makes more power.
Remember we're talking about engines and horsepower records....not necessarily ET records.
Again... look at MarkyMark's stock turbo car running 10.6@129mph. Most street driven Evo's @ 3200+ pounds only attain 10's with a good bit over 550whp (DJ) We're talking about a 700 pound advantage... you can't seriously be trying to compare which engine makes more power.
I do agree that the proof in the pudding is in your results at the track... but to compare Horsepower to Horsepower... you're best bet is the dyno. Otherwise racing it down the track only allows for many other ways of manipulation en lieu of a correction factor.
Aug 1, 2010, 09:57 PM
#34
Evolving Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Abq, NM
Posts: 219
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The distance of the drag race is not a variable, it's a constant.
To the weight comment...people are trying to compare engines... you say go to the track...I'm saying engines aren't the only factor to going fast, therefore you cannot assume that a vehicle with a lower ET/MPH by default makes more power.
Remember we're talking about engines and horsepower records....not necessarily ET records.
Again... look at MarkyMark's stock turbo car running 10.6@129mph. Most street driven Evo's @ 3200+ pounds only attain 10's with a good bit over 550whp (DJ) We're talking about a 700 pound advantage... you can't seriously be trying to compare which engine makes more power.
I do agree that the proof in the pudding is in your results at the track... but to compare Horsepower to Horsepower... you're best bet is the dyno. Otherwise racing it down the track only allows for many other ways of manipulation en lieu of a correction factor.
To the weight comment...people are trying to compare engines... you say go to the track...I'm saying engines aren't the only factor to going fast, therefore you cannot assume that a vehicle with a lower ET/MPH by default makes more power.
Remember we're talking about engines and horsepower records....not necessarily ET records.
Again... look at MarkyMark's stock turbo car running 10.6@129mph. Most street driven Evo's @ 3200+ pounds only attain 10's with a good bit over 550whp (DJ) We're talking about a 700 pound advantage... you can't seriously be trying to compare which engine makes more power.
I do agree that the proof in the pudding is in your results at the track... but to compare Horsepower to Horsepower... you're best bet is the dyno. Otherwise racing it down the track only allows for many other ways of manipulation en lieu of a correction factor.
If people think they can achieve certain times as a stock at turbo running 10.6@129 weighing as much as a stock car, then they should be educated on why they can't. Just like people at altitude in both 1/4 and dyno number and people on MD that are trying to make as much as people on a DJ.
Inform the customer, if they are too stupid just say thanks and let them walk away. Sometimes I think people argue just to argue.
Aug 1, 2010, 10:32 PM
#36
This was not designed as a Debate for Whether Dyno #'s mean anything.. Many of you are reading WAY TOO DEEP into things.. Ill simplify it again..
Do you beleive that if a shop, privateer, Ghost, cartoon character or any of the above are to CLAIM A HORSEPOWER RECORD should they be required to BACK IT UP ON A DYNOJET DYNO??
YES
or
NO
Nothing more nothing less..
Do you beleive that if a shop, privateer, Ghost, cartoon character or any of the above are to CLAIM A HORSEPOWER RECORD should they be required to BACK IT UP ON A DYNOJET DYNO??
YES
or
NO
Nothing more nothing less..
Aug 1, 2010, 10:37 PM
#38
We use Mustang dynomometers for EPA and CARB powermap calibrations, there are no dynojet dynamometers used in the industry that I have even seen. Regardless, in the auto performance industry, I consider Dynojet to be the standard since it made to produce a number, not so much a tuning tool compared to the other systems..I would say use dynojet as the standard all the way unless all of the calibration data and dyno parameters are proven down to the second, but a trained eye can spot when something is fishy.. I bite my tounge on this forum everytime I visit the tuning results section, but I am used to seeing high numbers anymore, hell I have not even posted a graph from a customer in ages
Dynojet uses a very different method of calculating HP/tq then mustang, all in all I think it works very well, but the best of both worlds CAN be combined but this is a niche market and it would be very expensive.. Picture eddy current dyno, 5 or 10 different flywheels for inertia, custom software to calculate power by time vs. roller speed as well as load cell from power absorbtion unit.. Truth be told, mustang does make such an animal
Dynojet uses a very different method of calculating HP/tq then mustang, all in all I think it works very well, but the best of both worlds CAN be combined but this is a niche market and it would be very expensive.. Picture eddy current dyno, 5 or 10 different flywheels for inertia, custom software to calculate power by time vs. roller speed as well as load cell from power absorbtion unit.. Truth be told, mustang does make such an animal
This Poll is for HIGHEST HP CLAIMS.. Not who makes the least amount of emissions, not which is better to tune with.. That is all a matter of preference and there are no facts to which is better.. Like engine mgmt systems., Its only as good as the guy behind the keyboard.. Our shop tuner prefers big roller 424x over all other dynos..
Aug 1, 2010, 10:45 PM
#40
I voted "no". First off I don't care about dyno records to be dead honest, we got caught up in that ONE time and took our black car to Switzers, this was early on and it made 903 which at the time tied us with AMS's 903. It was a waste of time and we never hauled a car there again to set a record with.
Records are for the track and to be honest Mike, you should ignore all these other guys with high numbers because as your signature shows, you know how to put the power to the ground and set records on the track where they belong.
As you said, our black car set and STILL holds the highest MPH for an EVO8 at 172.74 mph, the car here dyno'd like 890 whp...........I think I've seen EVO's making 1100+whp and they can't trap that high, so how much power were WE making? I don't care, I just like having the same record for 4 years!
Records are for the track and to be honest Mike, you should ignore all these other guys with high numbers because as your signature shows, you know how to put the power to the ground and set records on the track where they belong.
As you said, our black car set and STILL holds the highest MPH for an EVO8 at 172.74 mph, the car here dyno'd like 890 whp...........I think I've seen EVO's making 1100+whp and they can't trap that high, so how much power were WE making? I don't care, I just like having the same record for 4 years!
so i voted YES if someone is to claim they have accomplished something that NO OTHER PERSON has been able to achieve making their accomplishment 1 of a kind they should be backing it up on an industry standard dyno..
if not we might as well use the Vbox like the porsche guys and measure our 1/4 mile time by GPS too then and say well i know my car ran 8.9 cause Vbox showed me 9.0 and we know Vbox reads 1% variable..
Aug 1, 2010, 10:47 PM
#41
nearly 8 out of 10 people so far seem to agree with me.. So i must not be nuts, biased, or looking to finger a shop i dont like.. If i asked a regular member to post this poll there would be less fingers pointed at mike @ AWD.. but thats ok i dont mind..
Aug 1, 2010, 10:56 PM
#43
This was not designed as a Debate for Whether Dyno #'s mean anything.. Many of you are reading WAY TOO DEEP into things.. Ill simplify it again..
Do you beleive that if a shop, privateer, Ghost, cartoon character or any of the above are to CLAIM A HORSEPOWER RECORD should they be required to BACK IT UP ON A DYNOJET DYNO??
YES
or
NO
Nothing more nothing less..
Do you beleive that if a shop, privateer, Ghost, cartoon character or any of the above are to CLAIM A HORSEPOWER RECORD should they be required to BACK IT UP ON A DYNOJET DYNO??
YES
or
NO
Nothing more nothing less..
Aug 1, 2010, 11:03 PM
#44
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (11)
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 473
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The distance of the drag race is not a variable, it's a constant.
To the weight comment...people are trying to compare engines... you say go to the track...I'm saying engines aren't the only factor to going fast, therefore you cannot assume that a vehicle with a lower ET/MPH by default makes more power.
Remember we're talking about engines and horsepower records....not necessarily ET records.
Again... look at MarkyMark's stock turbo car running 10.6@129mph. Most street driven Evo's @ 3200+ pounds only attain 10's with a good bit over 550whp (DJ) We're talking about a 700 pound advantage... you can't seriously be trying to compare which engine makes more power.
I do agree that the proof in the pudding is in your results at the track... but to compare Horsepower to Horsepower... you're best bet is the dyno. Otherwise racing it down the track only allows for many other ways of manipulation en lieu of a correction factor.
To the weight comment...people are trying to compare engines... you say go to the track...I'm saying engines aren't the only factor to going fast, therefore you cannot assume that a vehicle with a lower ET/MPH by default makes more power.
Remember we're talking about engines and horsepower records....not necessarily ET records.
Again... look at MarkyMark's stock turbo car running 10.6@129mph. Most street driven Evo's @ 3200+ pounds only attain 10's with a good bit over 550whp (DJ) We're talking about a 700 pound advantage... you can't seriously be trying to compare which engine makes more power.
I do agree that the proof in the pudding is in your results at the track... but to compare Horsepower to Horsepower... you're best bet is the dyno. Otherwise racing it down the track only allows for many other ways of manipulation en lieu of a correction factor.
Very well said.
Aug 1, 2010, 11:06 PM
#45
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (11)
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Oceanside
Posts: 473
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This was not designed as a Debate for Whether Dyno #'s mean anything.. Many of you are reading WAY TOO DEEP into things.. Ill simplify it again..
Do you beleive that if a shop, privateer, Ghost, cartoon character or any of the above are to CLAIM A HORSEPOWER RECORD should they be required to BACK IT UP ON A DYNOJET DYNO??
YES
or
NO
Nothing more nothing less..
Do you beleive that if a shop, privateer, Ghost, cartoon character or any of the above are to CLAIM A HORSEPOWER RECORD should they be required to BACK IT UP ON A DYNOJET DYNO??
YES
or
NO
Nothing more nothing less..