Difference In Power Using DIff mixes with an alky kit
Jul 26, 2005, 07:42 AM
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Difference In Power Using DIff mixes with an alky kit
Not sure if this topic has been discussed before but I am thinking of purchasing an alky kit. Just wondering if any1 could chime in with some info on if there is a significant difference in hp/tq made with different alky mixes. Example 100% methanol vs. 50/50 mix of methanol/water, or 100% methanol vs. windshield fluid, any info would be great, thanks.
Jul 26, 2005, 07:55 AM
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I found this information just looking though google:
Why alcohol injection?
Alcohol is a safe additive to use. Since the 1960s, all cars have been manufactured with alcohol resistant hoses, connections, O-rings, seals, and plastics. This was necessary because of the popular use of alcohol base gas line antifreeze additives, and the use of ethanol mixes in automotive fuel. But, the biggest advantage of alcohol injection is that it is an "on demand" system for both the street, or strip. Especially for street applications, the realities are that, for most drivers, less than 2 percent of the time high turbo boost is actually used. So, the argument becomes: Why have the fuel tank filled with high price race gas, or add a couple of gallons of toluene with every tank, when the higher knock threshold protection is only needed for those relatively brief events closer to WOT? Tuning with alcohol injection only for those boost levels when it's really needed to raise the knock threshold (higher octane equivalent) also accounts for the small quantities of alcohol consumed.
Tuning to the edge of the envelope quickly bumps into the knock limits of the fuel being used. Alcohol injection can increase the knock threshold of 91-93 octane pump gas to the equivalent of the range of 104-108 octane. The relatively small amounts of alcohol injected doesn't increase the total fuel energy much, and only adds small amounts of additional oxygen. While methanol alcohol has an equivalent octane rating of 108, the main effect is the result of large, rapid evaporatative cooling of the intake air. Also, small amounts of water added help control the flame front in the cylinder for smooth, controlled cylinder pressure rises at ignition (the opposite of knock). This effect also shows up as a very significant reduction of 60 to 100 degees (F) of the EGT at WOT. The cooling effect of alcohol is also used on supercharged (up to 8 pounds boost) engines with no IC. The effect is like adding an intercooler. Alcohol injection is a very mature technology that has been in widespread use, especially since WWII, with lots of experience, and data availble. There is no need to re-invent the wheel, or plow any new ground. It is a reliable, cost effective way, to raise the knock threshold of the fuel being used. So, the answer to the question: "Why alcohol injection?" is simply "Why not?"
What kind of Alcohol should I use?
There are many choices of types of alcohol, and possible mixes of 10 to 50 percent water added that can be used. The prefered Methanol alcohol is readily available by the gallon in paint, hardware, and lumber yards. Isopropanol, such as rubbing alcohol, or the premium gas line dryer, Iso-Heet, will work. Also, Ethanol, the alcohol of beer and wines, which is also the additive for "oxygenated" pump gas works. 190 proof Everclear alcohol from the liquor store works really well (a bit expensive though). Even winter windshield washer concentrate, which contains up to 50 percent methanol, can be used for an emergency refill. Depending on the setting of the turn on threshold of the pump, and how much is being pumped, a one quart tank should last about 500 miles of normal driving. Of course, WOT race applications at the track will consume the alcohol at a much faster rate. But, we still are not talking about large quantities of alcohol being required for most uses. There are many variables, such as your engine modifications, that come into play; but fine tuning certainly has the potential HP gains as tuning with race gas, or installing a 50 Shot NOS system.
Why alcohol injection?
Alcohol is a safe additive to use. Since the 1960s, all cars have been manufactured with alcohol resistant hoses, connections, O-rings, seals, and plastics. This was necessary because of the popular use of alcohol base gas line antifreeze additives, and the use of ethanol mixes in automotive fuel. But, the biggest advantage of alcohol injection is that it is an "on demand" system for both the street, or strip. Especially for street applications, the realities are that, for most drivers, less than 2 percent of the time high turbo boost is actually used. So, the argument becomes: Why have the fuel tank filled with high price race gas, or add a couple of gallons of toluene with every tank, when the higher knock threshold protection is only needed for those relatively brief events closer to WOT? Tuning with alcohol injection only for those boost levels when it's really needed to raise the knock threshold (higher octane equivalent) also accounts for the small quantities of alcohol consumed.
Tuning to the edge of the envelope quickly bumps into the knock limits of the fuel being used. Alcohol injection can increase the knock threshold of 91-93 octane pump gas to the equivalent of the range of 104-108 octane. The relatively small amounts of alcohol injected doesn't increase the total fuel energy much, and only adds small amounts of additional oxygen. While methanol alcohol has an equivalent octane rating of 108, the main effect is the result of large, rapid evaporatative cooling of the intake air. Also, small amounts of water added help control the flame front in the cylinder for smooth, controlled cylinder pressure rises at ignition (the opposite of knock). This effect also shows up as a very significant reduction of 60 to 100 degees (F) of the EGT at WOT. The cooling effect of alcohol is also used on supercharged (up to 8 pounds boost) engines with no IC. The effect is like adding an intercooler. Alcohol injection is a very mature technology that has been in widespread use, especially since WWII, with lots of experience, and data availble. There is no need to re-invent the wheel, or plow any new ground. It is a reliable, cost effective way, to raise the knock threshold of the fuel being used. So, the answer to the question: "Why alcohol injection?" is simply "Why not?"
What kind of Alcohol should I use?
There are many choices of types of alcohol, and possible mixes of 10 to 50 percent water added that can be used. The prefered Methanol alcohol is readily available by the gallon in paint, hardware, and lumber yards. Isopropanol, such as rubbing alcohol, or the premium gas line dryer, Iso-Heet, will work. Also, Ethanol, the alcohol of beer and wines, which is also the additive for "oxygenated" pump gas works. 190 proof Everclear alcohol from the liquor store works really well (a bit expensive though). Even winter windshield washer concentrate, which contains up to 50 percent methanol, can be used for an emergency refill. Depending on the setting of the turn on threshold of the pump, and how much is being pumped, a one quart tank should last about 500 miles of normal driving. Of course, WOT race applications at the track will consume the alcohol at a much faster rate. But, we still are not talking about large quantities of alcohol being required for most uses. There are many variables, such as your engine modifications, that come into play; but fine tuning certainly has the potential HP gains as tuning with race gas, or installing a 50 Shot NOS system.
Aug 1, 2005, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by GOKOU
I like to know as well. Also those running 50/50, how do you mix it consistently?
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Aug 2, 2005, 05:07 AM
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Well soon as I get a relay that works *sigh* -- I'll add more to this post. Right now I'm going to start off with the Windshield Wiper mix and move on from there...That's about a 70/30 mix...