Buchur and AMS have a great record with the Evo and their kits seem to perform top notch and are very affordable. Full-Race has a proven track record as well. It would be hard to go to a competitive import event and not see some Full-Race pieces being used on the fastest cars at the event. Sure, relatively new to the Evo world but certainly not new to building race proven parts.

 

Full Race is the one with something to prove. I would love for them to prove it too. If I could get quicker spool with no significant loss of power, then I would be all over a TS kit even though it costs $$$$$$$$$$.
It has been proven on other makes of vehicle but you can't just say it would be the same for every vehicle. Most likely it would be, but any researcher will tell you that jumping to that large of a conclusion would be just plain stupid.
Full Race needs to do the testing, and I believe that they are getting some info from customers such as Evodan2000. But the testing that I have seen so far has not been a regimented back-to-back approach.
To put this in perspective, Nissan went out and bought a couple of 911 turbos to run against their GTR during the actual road/track testing. They did not introduce the GTR and wait for Porsche to buy one and try to prove it as an inferior product. Though you can bet someone from Porsche is getting their hands on a couple ASAP to see what makes them tick.

 

There are few who have direct, actual experience with aftermarket TS setups. This includes individuals AND vendors alike. The few negative comments I've seen here are speculative and baseless.

Those who are waiting on the sidelines for objective parties to report will just have to be patient as they trickle in, simply because not everyone can afford a TS kit. Full-Race has provided sufficient testing to support their findings with various platforms. Whether they decide to conduct more testing or not is their perogative.

 

exactly, its kinda of crazy hearing about how full-race isnt proven when the fact is they are more proven then any other company mentioned here, no offense to anyone, everyone mentioned here offers a great product to the consumer, in the end thats what it comes down to, the consumer and what they want, all the testing in the world wont change anything, customers who are set on AMS will go with ams.. same with FR and bush...

and even if FR did all the testing and the single scroll was proven far superior AMS and bush.. would produce TS manifolds and FR would gain no extra business, AMS and bush would...

 

Sorry Bud, I love FR and if there kits did'nt cost 7K I would think about getting one. FR is no where near as proven in the EVO, 4G63 world as Buschur or AMS. FR has ruled the Honda world for ever which is sweet, but not an EVO. In the end when it comes to TS setups on an EVO it will be FR that proves they're worth or not.

 

That's not the way it works. Why should Buschur and AMS loose $$ to test another companies products. Even if they're results confirm their views on twinscroll kits, some people will say the results are biased for obvious reasons. Buschur and AMS test their products rigorously before they are released, just like the HTA35R that Dave had on his car for about 6months before it was produced by FP. The problem is when companies make big claims without proof, a la Full Race. Like saying that a TS 40r will outspool a 37r and make more power. So where's the pudding after months of waiting? You're telling me that we have to wait for customers results to find out how it really performs on an Evo ? I guess that's the way it works when you won't sponsor anyone or test your products ON AN EVO before they are released. Why should Buschur and AMS take the burden of testing the Full RAce products at a loss, when they should have been tested hard with real results by Full Race before they were released.

 

full race is $$$ no matter if its TS or SS they are expensive... thats the bottom line.

i was simply stating that FR has been around, it seems everyone is acting like Fr popped out from no where and thats certainly not the case.

 

im a full race dealer, i could offer a good discount on anyone willing to swap out their kit, maybe that could help some people out, but thats as far as im able to go..

 

I hear you dude, It's $$$ and beautiful without a doubt. I think the concesus is if the TS kit is so much better than the offerings from Buschur, AMS than FR should show the community. Not AMS or Buschur who already have proven stable kits.

 

i dont think any one company would gain from any testing.

 

20+ posts. No one has mentioned how much faster the ts is supposed to spool on a given set up or if it makes more power.

Take into consideration 2 very real world probablities that generic tubular manifolds have - cracking and exhaust leaks (gaskets/warpage).

Is the trade off how much faster spool occurs(200 rpm???) vs unknown worth it?

And - most obvious - can you make up the RPM differences through other designs in the manifold like cad/cam design, cast manifold, runner size, proprietary tweaks (like AMS and Buscher might provide) to the turbo itself etc... .

Finally - for crcain - spool is less important in drag racing than it is in short coarse road racing and street driving. Which application should we use for your discussion as I take it you are considering this set up for your car.

 

I've been interested in a fast spooling turbo with the capability of putting down more power and similar torque as compared to the Green. I have created posts asking opinions on combining the AMS 2.3RR with a Full Race TS 3076 kit. I think that this could possibly be a great combo for a time attack car. Quick spool and alot of torque down low with the ability to rev closer to a built 2.0 and wring every last bit out of that 3076 TS. But until someone does some testing of a TS3076 with a 2.3 stroker, it is all just conjecture. I don't know if I'm willing to spend the huge dollars to put this dream setup together and find that I could have done just as well with a built 2.0 and an FP Green. I know that it is my decision to make but it would help greatly if there were more info out there.

 

jmrsx, That defiately sounds like a dream setup, The problem is the cost of both the 2.3RR as well as the TS kits. That cost is prohibitive to someone diving into to test a hugely expensive unproven setup. I'm sure it will happen and am excited to see the results but I'm defiately not holding my breath. Good luck on your choice.

 

That would seem physically unlikely.

The reason why TS works so well is because it avoids a transition from a relatively small primary into a large open area, which is the fundamental fault of a conventional turbine housing. The fact that a TS primary exits into a smaller 'collector' preserves pulse energy and velocity, which is most important with 4 cyl engines. As a result, the turbine wheel spins faster at ALL rpm and throttle positions (not just WOT).

 

my buschur 30r kit makes 200whp at 4500 rpm. evodans fullrace twin scroll gt3076r makes 200whp at 3,500 rpm!!!!.

how much more proof do you need.
i never seen anyones gt30r spool that fast before. and it makes a ton of top end too