they are good clutches very agressive tho alot stiffer than stock clutch

 

Are you serious? As apposed to what?

ACT Clutches, and specificly, the ACT 2600 pressure plate and organic street disc kit has been one of the best proven, tried and true clutches to use in the DSM application. Numerous reports from alot of people with high hp daily driven cars with lots of track abuse, lasting for thousands upon thousands of miles. I have used this clutch in all of my DSMs, and have never had an issue whatsoever.

 

Well mine feel like Shtt why would anyone have 500hp Evo and have to wait for 1 or2 second before shifting.

 

either way i already have a ss clutch line and would be buying a new flywheel so guess my choice is made, ACT MB7-HDSS

 

NO...

lockout issues are the worst..
you'll regret the ACT

 

I can second this..
my car had about 450whp..worked good at first(very short lived)..then it started to lock me out at full throttle around 7100rpms....
only way I'd get it into gear was to back off the pedal, let the rpms drop..and put it in.

I came on here and did multiple searches...many people suggested adjusting the clutch pedal etc....
I did this over and over...but nothing worked..

eventually I tossed the clutch..put in a RPS twin carbon, and immediately the problem was GONE!

 

lol, the trini brother has spoken

 

Since the person that posted the comments below has the same screen name as you I'm going to go out on a limb and assume that it's you. From what I read it doesn't seem like you have much luck with different clutches from different manufacturers.

Nah............must be the clutches fault, it can't be you .

The following in red are quotes from you in the same thread. The original thread is below.

I am...
thing is back in the day these clutches I used never got a break.
On a good day at the strip I would put down a minimum of 10 passes and sometimes 5-6 of these would be back to back passes.

Was really hard on the clutches.

Here is the other quote from you taken from the same thread.

So I've owned an evo for the last 6 years...since '01, an E7

Went through lots of clutches. My car had about 450whp.

-ACT - Absolute trouble. Would work great in the beginning, then lock me out of gears after

-HKS GD MAX- Same story..worked great for about 6 months, held up to high rpm launches. But after 6 months...the bolts on the clutch snapped. Rebuilt it and after 3 months ended up with the same problem.

- RPS twin carbon- Seemed great. Held up to even more high rpm launches but then one day something went wrong and the clutch pedal was on the floor and wouldn't come back up. They sent the replacement parts free of charge(great customer service though) and it was repaired.

Here is the original thread

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ne...eply&p=5663981

My point here is that there are two sides to every story, at times when it's suits people they come on here and tell the side that works for the story or leave out other details. Based on your own words, your driving style could have easily warped the disc from too much heat after numerous launches and slipping the clutch. I don't know anything is possible, but I'm willing to bet that you'll never say that it's your fault that all of these clutches have failed in one way or another.

 

It never ends does it Daryl. Always used ACT in my DSM, seen many passes at the 1/4 and its going strong still. The ACT outlasted 2 motors and about 4 turbos. It currently still is in my car on the 3rd engine and 5th turbo, and starting to slip, but then again, it wasn't babied and was driven hard, any clutch will die.

As far as this lockout issue, sounds more like an EVO thing, not had any issues with it but then again, I've got a 190K tranny it doesn't go into gear smoothly no matter what RPM.

-Canada Sam

 

I have a 95 TSI AWD 413awhp. My rev limiter is set for 8500rpm's and I never have a lockout issue with this clutch when I beat the crap out of my car and rev it up there. Strange how many people are reporting having this lockout issue though.

 

I put so many launches and 1/4 mile passes on my ACT street disk it was crazy. It still lasted like 50,000 miles.

Want to know what clutch I'm going with now!??!

6 puck sprung and prolite flywheel. ACT will always get my business.


Thumbs up for Daryl.

 

You're absolutely right..that is me...
I'd hate to think that you feel as if I'm attacking ACT alone....but this was the topic so it came across this way.

if any thread pops up about HKS or RPS twins I would state what happened with me as well.

In any event...the ACT did perform at one point as I said....but after that..lockout.
I made a thread..or posted in a thread about it...I even think you replied and suggested adjustment..
which I did...but it didn't help my situation, sorry to say.

As for the RPS...(when I took pictures)...well they agreed that it seemed to be some fault in manufacture and they replaced the parts.....after which all worked well.

 

Daryl,
See this has always been my view of ACT. Coming from the DSM world its just been the clutch you put in. If you are making 500-600+ you put in a PTT. (Or you just change the 3200 disc out once a season, and the PP every other) So its really hard for me to see ACT get trashed so hard in the Evo community.

However, I don't think that ALL of the fuss is imagined. People may not be upfront with how they treat a clutch (or drive) and if anyone knows that side of the situation as well as you its a vendor...

But if it makes you feel better do a couple searches on exedy twins and I assure you it will not turn up ALL pink puffy clouds and roses. Trust me, I read every clutch thread I can find.

So here's one to you Daryl. I'll give you as much background info as you need and you answer to the best of your ability.

My mods are in my sig and this car is driven EVERY single day.
(Aside from all DBA brakes, hawk pads, and a SS clutch line I just put in) Since I was bleeding the entire system I did that as well. I did not remove the restrictor pill.

Car makes 400+whp. I am still on the stock clutch - 35,000 miles. This turbo has been on for 13,000 miles. (If that gives you any insight into how its driven.) The stock clutch holds just fine from anything but a launch. 90% of my fun is from a rolling punch. But it is beginning to get iffy from a punch in 1st. Obviously with good cause. The transmission suffers ZERO issues. No grinds, no disengagement issues. And will shift at 8000 rpm. With the clutch line it is not even notchy or rough when cold. So I know disengagement is not an issue.

The car WILL need to be launched at the track. The car WILL be receiving meth and should be closer to high 400's. But remains the car that gets groceries as well. Much like your average evoM'er. However it will be responsibly driven, not back to back launched, or repeatedly beat on, or autoX'd. Thus it needs to maintain some friendly nature in regards to the clutch. The car is simply my happy place. I get in, it is fast, reliable, and it drives like a dream. I would like to retain as much of that as possible. If I wanted a car that drove like a track **** I have a 2g AWD sitting here I could shell and 42R.

MB7-HDSS going to be ok?
Prolite or Street lite?

Or do I buy the exedy TDHD?


I genuinely want to hear your thoughts. I don't think my power range or requirements are out of the range of your products. I will not attack you. I truly want your opinion. But I think an honest conversation about this might help alot of those on the fence. Thus this being a post and not a PM.

 

Dustin, Thanks for the post. I was busy in the office so I didn't respond yesterday.

It seems like you're pretty easy on the stock parts so unless your driving style drastically changes you should be able to get good use and life out of any clutch you use.

For consistency all numbers will be listed in torque and not hp, since clutches are always rated in torque. All of the numbers we list in our catalog are flywheel numbers, because torque numbers listed at the wheels will vary based on the dyno used. The following are the 3 options you could use.

MB7-HDSS rated at 508 ft. lbs, if you use a 15% correction factor for drivetrain loss it would be rated at 431 ft. lbs at the wheels.

MB7-HDG6 rated at 651 ft. lbs and using the same 15% it is rated at 553 ft. lbs.

MB7-XTSS rated at 567 ft. lbs and using the 15% for loss it is rated at 482 ft. lbs.

Depending on how often you launch the car and how good the launch technique is the MB7-HDSS could very well work for you and offer good driveability that is close to the stock clutch but with better torque capacity and much improved feel.

If you're going to be doing a lot of track days, launching and slipping the clutch the ceramatallic friction material used in the pucks on the HDG6 kit would be the better option. The driveability will be compromised compared to the HDSS, but many on here have used it with great results and the pedal effort will be the same as the HDSS but the engagement will change.

If you didn't want to compromise the smooth engagement characteristics offered by our street disc for the HDG6 but still required more torque capacity than our HDSS kit, the XTSS would be the way to go. The compromise on the XTSS would be increased pedal effort and the added cost because of the different diaphragm (higher clamp load) used in the Xtreme pressure plate. Driveability will be the same as the HDSS with the aforementioned increased pedal effort.

As with any clutch, launch technique will be crucial to clutch life as I mentioned on the HDSS and this is especially true on a full face organic disc. The organic material will not withstand repeated slipping and excessive heat. I will say that Exedy does make a good product but no clutch is infallable from physics or human error.

The thread below on the Exedy twin disc proves that if a disc or pressure plate gets hot enough it can warp or deform and cause disengagement issues. It also shows that the ACT is not the only clutch that needs to be adjusted contrary to popular opinion on here. However I didn't notice any of the dissention and hostility (not that there should be any) normally associated when similar issues arise on our products by both vendors and board members. All of these issues are on a clutch that costs at a minimum twice that of any thing we sell and in some cases more than that.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=347028

To further prove my point on how important technique is to clutch life, John Shepherd went an entire season going 8's on one pressure plate and two full faced street discs using off the shelf ACT parts. The power the car made well exceeded the torque capacity of the parts he was using, but they were able to hold up because of his driving style.

 

I think the HDSS will be the clutch I buy. I'm used to the ACT feel and I believe the marginal increase in pedal effort will just feel more like home to me. I do not mind a stiff clutch but, I would prefer not to stand on a brick. As far as the HDG6, I refuse to put any pucked clutch in any car I drive. Period. For what you get as far as driveability is concerned you could have gotten more out of a twin disc.

*But that is just my personal opinion.

I think with my more conservative driving style - and not having a need for back to back launching, I will be fine with the HDSS. I will track the car maybe 1 or 2 times a month. I think I've launched the car on the street once. My technique consists of slipping the clutch until you can just feel the car about to lurch forward. Usually as the last light illuminates. As soon as the car moves about 3 feet... I simply step off the clutch pedal completely. Which is why I left the restrictor in place. As the factory system dampens the quickness of the engagement from that point to a degree. I feel this is a good balance between how much shock I'm sending thru the drivetrain, and how much I'm heating the clutch.

I should be close to the HDSS torque capacity with 93 & meth. But the car is not a world beater. A full weight mid 11 second pass, and good street manners will be more than sufficient.

Prolite or street lite?

You don't have to show the downsides on the Exedy Twin's to me. In my opinion the cost and complexity, coupled with the life expectancy of the twins in general have me seeking a single disc. I want to see another 35,000+ miles on this clutch. Changing these is not a fun experience... and I have alot of other things I need to be doing besides swapping clutches.

Thank you very much for your insight thus far Daryl. Please keep it coming. Total weight of MB7-HDSS and either flywheel?