k dude, I'm saying deck height changes timng, I've said it several times. teh difference in why you end up advanced with a 63 belt and retarded with the 64 belt is because you put an extra tooth on the drive side of the belt.

evo/dsm/4g63 gears have the cam gear mark on the peak of a tooth, 94 galant has it on the valley between teeth. they moved it for a reason. I degree my **** the right way.

obviously its not the god damn belt length that is making it a half tooth off it is the deck height. When I was talking about the belt being 12mm longer it was to explain why you get mixed results between the two belts. The 64 belt allows your to but a extra tooth on the drive side...

get over the belt length thing. The ONLY thing that matters is getting the cams zero'd.

Aim the inner marks on your adjustable cam gears at the stock timing marks is close is good enough for you. Degree your cams properly if you want to build a motor like a big boy.

 

Degree cams in car is almost impossible. So we have to work with what we have.

 

exactly, thats it.

bust out the degree wheel and dial gauge

..or if you think building motors is like horse shoes and hand grenades line the inner marks to your valve cover. whatever

94awdcoupe: I'm not mucking up anything. I'm saying the same thing you are. I just wanted to go into detail on why people end up out of time one way or the other depending on what belt they use and why that is. Everyone always seems confused why the belt "makes it change."

ultimately the deck height is what changes things....

 

Also 94AWD you forgot a pulley. :-P

 

the bold is where you falter over and over. there are no extra teeth being placed on drive side with belt length changes. that is a fixed length.

the fixed idler gear (middle right circle) would need to move in order to get timing changes with belt length changes. in the case of VVT that pulley is not fixed and moves. thats how they get timing changes. in the 4g63 that pulley does not move.

 

and you are confusing them because belt length does not change timing at all on these engines.

we are not saying same thing.

 

haha, that the super rare 4g61t that came from the factory with a dry sump....

you don't even wanna think about trying to run that belt on your 2.4... 37.5* advanced

 

ok, here is what is happening afaict.... people say 63 belt advances half a tooth and 64 belt retards half a tooth... that confuses everyone. then everyone asks, "how could a different belt be changing the timing???"

I explained that this happens when people put the extra tooth on the drive side of the belt. which is possible with either belt.

so it goes from half a tooth advanced to half a tooth retard because the 64 belt is allowing people to put 51 teeth on the drive side. ultimately your results will vary and that explanation tends to confuse.

my explanation was simply to clarify why people are coming to different results using the different belts. Not to claim the belt is ultimately why it ends up off time

 

I have a method that is quite easy. works with engine in or out of car. doesnt use a dial indicator.

but is way over the heads of the intelligence in this thread. so I will not be wasting any more of my time

 

here you try:

freddie "retard 3.75* for 63 belt, advance 3.75* for 64 belt"

blue91t: "why is it that you end up half a tooth off in opposite directs with either belt??"

now interject and describe why these events occur...

 

your reading comprehension < my intelligence


try to understand the context before you move to ad hominem attacks next time

 

I had S2s on a 2.0. They did/do not need to be degreed. My timing wouldn't even line up with the cam gears in the EVO holes.

The dowel pins are in the right holes.

Forget the cam gears, as I solved that issue a year ago.

 

The dowel pins are not in the right holes. Period. Overlay a stock gear on the DSM hole of the Fidanza and you will see it DOES NOT line up. It is a tooth off. Its very simple. A DSM hole Fidanza is true ZERO is at -7.5* on the gear on an Evo.

 

Haha well I guess I accidentally have my motor spinning backwards then.

 

both rotate clockwise.

with the 63 belt installed you ended up -3.75. it was supposed to be +3.75. take out the -7.5 from the cam gear being in the wrong hole and it sounds like the belt is on right

maybe your not getting all the slack out of the 64 belt