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Divided Wastegate issue

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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 07:53 AM
  #46  
TiALSport's Avatar
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From: MI
Originally Posted by sparky
I still want you to answer my question about his Black being overgated. Theoretically shouldn't a single one of those two Tial remote gates be enough to control boost on an FP Black 2-Liter setup? In practice most guys can control boost on a Black with the stock internal gate. A JB Black is not really a fast spooling turbo.
if it was overgated, he would not be able to make the boost he wants to, and that isn't the case, he's overboosting. Or it would dump a large portion of the boost when the gate cracks and that isn't happening either

we've run 4 cyl twin scrolls with 4, yes 4 V60's
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:00 AM
  #47  
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Well, for comparison's sake the same could be said about the internal wastegate passage(s) on the MHI 10.5 turbine housing. The waste gate bypass port(s) on the stock turbine housing source at 90 degrees off the turbine inlet area. Even so the stock wimpy internal gate alone diverts sufficient exhaust flow tangentially to control boost in most all cases on a JB FP Black. So, why can't twin remotes with more than double the valve surface area control boost in this scenario?
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:02 AM
  #48  
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From: MI
Originally Posted by sparky
Well, for comparison's sake the same could be said about the internal wastegate passage(s) on the MHI 10.5 turbine housing. The waste gate bypass port(s) on the stock turbine housing source at 90 degrees off the turbine inlet area. Even so the stock wimpy internal gate alone diverts sufficient exhaust flow tangentially to control boost in most all cases on a JB FP Black. So, why can't twin remotes with more than double the valve surface area control boost in this scenario?
it's not 90*...it sticks out IN the flow path to collect the gas, I mentioned this in previous posts
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:03 AM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by TiALSport
if it was overgated, he would not be able to make the boost he wants to, and that isn't the case, he's overboosting. Or it would dump a large portion of the boost when the gate cracks and that isn't happening either.....we've run 4 cyl twin scrolls with 4, yes 4 V60's
OK. this is where it gets interesting. I imagined that he was in fact dumping too much exhaust volume when both gates cracked. Thanks for clearing this up.
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:05 AM
  #50  
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From: MI
this is an ideal setup for a wastegate
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:07 AM
  #51  
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Originally Posted by TiALSport
it's not 90*...it sticks out IN the flow path to collect the gas, I mentioned this in previous posts
Thanks for taking the time to explain these details to me. You did mention this earlier. The fact that there is this flow path obstruction.

The header is poorly designed especially with respect to how it is flanged then?
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:11 AM
  #52  
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From: MI
Originally Posted by sparky
Thanks for taking the time to explain these details to me. You did mention this earlier. The fact that there is this flow path obstruction.

The header is poorly designed especially with respect to how it is flanged then?
the header itself is fine

it's the angle at which the flange is mounted, if it were transitioned in and the exhaust gas could flow to it freely it would work great.
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:27 AM
  #53  
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i guess i will put a bigger spring in the gates and hope for the best.

on a side note... my friends honda civic b16 turbo with a divided setup had an issue on the dyno as well. the 2 mvs wastegates had the black and red spring (i believe 1 bar) and it gave him 30psi on the dyno.
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:46 AM
  #54  
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From: MI
Originally Posted by BOOSTINAT30PSI
i guess i will put a bigger spring in the gates and hope for the best.

on a side note... my friends honda civic b16 turbo with a divided setup had an issue on the dyno as well. the 2 mvs wastegates had the black and red spring (i believe 1 bar) and it gave him 30psi on the dyno.
don't get me started on most Honda manifolds lol
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 08:59 AM
  #55  
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Is the spring chart different for MVS compared to a standard 44? His .5 bar spring isn't opening until 19psi on a bench. That's close to where you stated a 1bar should start to open.
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 09:12 AM
  #56  
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From: MI
Originally Posted by batty200
Is the spring chart different for MVS compared to a standard 44? His .5 bar spring isn't opening until 19psi on a bench. That's close to where you stated a 1bar should start to open.
for an MV-S that is normal 17-19psi

all of the gates will be different because of valve diameter differences and diaphragm area differences
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 09:25 AM
  #57  
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I'll see if i can get a sheet made up of cracking pressure for all the gates on a test bench
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Old Jul 13, 2012 | 11:01 AM
  #58  
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From: NJ
thank you
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