27psi on 91oct????!!!
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
From what I remember, Aby was running 27 psi back in the day on 91. He did plenty of playing around, and found that (especially on octane limited fuels) that the Evo motor loves boost and hates ignition advance. So, keep ignition advance low and crank the boost. Easy power on limited octane 
27 psi has been done before on 91. People tend to run more boost nowadays on 91. Like 23-25. Back in the day (2006-2007), you'd see 21 or so. Maybe 22.
27 psi has been done before on 91. People tend to run more boost nowadays on 91. Like 23-25. Back in the day (2006-2007), you'd see 21 or so. Maybe 22.
yeah, but i could swear i used to get knock at peak torque. it's been a while, so i may be mistaken. but good point about the lower boost at higher RPM.
i'm not good at tuning, so i'm not sure if the timing is good/bad/etc. like i said, i leave that up to Jay. i stay out of stuff i don't understand LOL
i'm not sure of PTW measurements as i didn't put that part of the engine together. i checked with JE and Buschur and was assured they were, in fact "drop in", meaning they were the proper size and no machine work had to be done, etc. that's the extent of my involvement with the piston installation.
ring seal issue at high boost? maybe. i THINK i've noticed some blue smoke when brake boosting and pushing it hard.
i've never measured crank case pressure. i don't have a way to right now. it does not blow smoke under normal driving/boost, that i've noticed. nobody said anything at the last autox. no blowing out the dipstick, etc.
spark plugs look perfect. no discoloration, no detonation, not black, no lean conditions.
i've checked the timing more times than i can count. it's spot on, every time i check it. the only thing that can't be confirmed is if, for some reason, the MIVEC system wasn't functioning right. i verified the pulley was installed into the MIVEC gear correctly. i also rotated the cam gear back and forth to verify oil was being sucked/drained out.
a dynojet is fine but we're using the EXACT same VD settings/program/etc that we've used for years. going to another dyno would be comparing apples to oranges, but i understand your reasoning. Jay has been asking me to get the car to him, but it's not easy for me to get the car 4hrs away AND get back there to pick it up.
my WB sensor is brand new.
i used "smoothing 2", but i guess i could drop it down.
no audible knock, though the valvetrain seem a bit noisy. i assumed that was due to the upgraded valve springs.
i'm very certain if the car just needed more timing, Jay would have taken care of it. he is familiar with these setups.
i'm not good at tuning, so i'm not sure if the timing is good/bad/etc. like i said, i leave that up to Jay. i stay out of stuff i don't understand LOL
i'm not sure of PTW measurements as i didn't put that part of the engine together. i checked with JE and Buschur and was assured they were, in fact "drop in", meaning they were the proper size and no machine work had to be done, etc. that's the extent of my involvement with the piston installation.
ring seal issue at high boost? maybe. i THINK i've noticed some blue smoke when brake boosting and pushing it hard.
i've never measured crank case pressure. i don't have a way to right now. it does not blow smoke under normal driving/boost, that i've noticed. nobody said anything at the last autox. no blowing out the dipstick, etc.
spark plugs look perfect. no discoloration, no detonation, not black, no lean conditions.
i've checked the timing more times than i can count. it's spot on, every time i check it. the only thing that can't be confirmed is if, for some reason, the MIVEC system wasn't functioning right. i verified the pulley was installed into the MIVEC gear correctly. i also rotated the cam gear back and forth to verify oil was being sucked/drained out.
a dynojet is fine but we're using the EXACT same VD settings/program/etc that we've used for years. going to another dyno would be comparing apples to oranges, but i understand your reasoning. Jay has been asking me to get the car to him, but it's not easy for me to get the car 4hrs away AND get back there to pick it up.
my WB sensor is brand new.
i used "smoothing 2", but i guess i could drop it down.
no audible knock, though the valvetrain seem a bit noisy. i assumed that was due to the upgraded valve springs.
i'm very certain if the car just needed more timing, Jay would have taken care of it. he is familiar with these setups.
There are a few ways to log crankcase pressure with a analog boost gauge. You are just gathering data with it to come to a conclusion.
Can you log mivec? I thought Mfred figured it out at some point. Maybe make a run with a stock mivec map and then your modified one.
Possible valvetrain issues, they typically show up at rpm but something to consider if everything else checks out.
VD to a dynojet are two different things. VD is helpful for some tuning/logging but a dyno is a great tool to utilize for tuning or troubleshooting. Its much easier to hear audible knock or other problems from 3ft away and standing there then driving the car down the road. When the car is on the rollers you can see alot more of whats happening then a software program calculating things going down american highways.
The 4hr drive/few days without the car doesn't sound bad to me since he will have all the tools/knowledge under one roof. I'm offering suggestions from the other side of the country over the internet. lol. Things are much different when the car is right in front of you.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
Pistons will "drop in" but IMO its still important to know the PTW and how tight/loose things are. Typically a aftermarket piston with an excessive PTW will rattle on start up and then get quieter as the engine heats up and the piston expands.
There are a few ways to log crankcase pressure with a analog boost gauge. You are just gathering data with it to come to a conclusion.
Can you log mivec? I thought Mfred figured it out at some point. Maybe make a run with a stock mivec map and then your modified one.
Possible valvetrain issues, they typically show up at rpm but something to consider if everything else checks out.
VD to a dynojet are two different things. VD is helpful for some tuning/logging but a dyno is a great tool to utilize for tuning or troubleshooting. Its much easier to hear audible knock or other problems from 3ft away and standing there then driving the car down the road. When the car is on the rollers you can see alot more of whats happening then a software program calculating things going down american highways.
The 4hr drive/few days without the car doesn't sound bad to me since he will have all the tools/knowledge under one roof. I'm offering suggestions from the other side of the country over the internet. lol. Things are much different when the car is right in front of you.
There are a few ways to log crankcase pressure with a analog boost gauge. You are just gathering data with it to come to a conclusion.
Can you log mivec? I thought Mfred figured it out at some point. Maybe make a run with a stock mivec map and then your modified one.
Possible valvetrain issues, they typically show up at rpm but something to consider if everything else checks out.
VD to a dynojet are two different things. VD is helpful for some tuning/logging but a dyno is a great tool to utilize for tuning or troubleshooting. Its much easier to hear audible knock or other problems from 3ft away and standing there then driving the car down the road. When the car is on the rollers you can see alot more of whats happening then a software program calculating things going down american highways.
The 4hr drive/few days without the car doesn't sound bad to me since he will have all the tools/knowledge under one roof. I'm offering suggestions from the other side of the country over the internet. lol. Things are much different when the car is right in front of you.
I’ll look for a way to log crank case pressure.
Jay says there is a way to log MIVEC, but he hasn’t told me how and I’ve searched with no luck on how. I’d like to, so I can rule that out.
Valvetrain is kinda where I’m at. The head was cleaned, checked for defects, then assembled without any re-surfacing that I know of.
A dyno would be nice so I can stand outside of the car. That’s true.
An 8 hr drive (4 each way) isn’t easy for me due to my schedule. Doing it twice is twice as hard. Maybe it’s easier for some. I’m still trying to find a day I can free up to get the car to him.
Last edited by kaj; Jul 31, 2015 at 08:44 AM.
Compression and leak down indicate good ring seal, as wells as no leaky valves. PTW is likely fine. OEM pistons are gapped tighter due to not being forged, then with some wear, and then a hone, most of them end up just fine. If you're not getting piston slap when it's cold, you have nothing to worry about. Even if you were, the rings are still sealing just fine given the leak down numbers so it doesn't really matter.
Does the car feel slow?
Does the car feel slow?
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
Compression and leak down indicate good ring seal, as wells as no leaky valves. PTW is likely fine. OEM pistons are gapped tighter due to not being forged, then with some wear, and then a hone, most of them end up just fine. If you're not getting piston slap when it's cold, you have nothing to worry about. Even if you were, the rings are still sealing just fine given the leak down numbers so it doesn't really matter.
Does the car feel slow?
Does the car feel slow?
car feel okay. it's still fun to drive, but i feel i wasted my money on this turbo. luckily, i have a second one to try, assuming it turns out that's my issue.
it's definitely not what i expected by looking at others' dyno charts and testimonials. my stock IX turbo made 330whp at 25psi and tapering to 18-19, if i remember right. this makes LESS. definitely not right.
Something is definitely not right. But usually when there is a turbo issue, it won't make boost, or at least not 27psi. Just seems weird. Your car should be making 330wtq+ with that much boost down low.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
i had such high hopes.
i've been at this for months now. i'm literally ready to sell the whole thing and just put in an OEM longblock and a new turbo.
i even thought about selling the car, which is saying a LOT for me because i love this thing.
exactly. and, from what i can tell, 350whp or so, which would be EXACTLY what i want out of a turbo.
i had such high hopes.
i've been at this for months now. i'm literally ready to sell the whole thing and just put in an OEM longblock and a new turbo.
i even thought about selling the car, which is saying a LOT for me because i love this thing.
i had such high hopes.
i've been at this for months now. i'm literally ready to sell the whole thing and just put in an OEM longblock and a new turbo.
i even thought about selling the car, which is saying a LOT for me because i love this thing.
The persistent drivetrain whine in my car has me on the verge of selling it. I know the feeling.
With cams and an intercooler, you should be able to reach your power goal with a 9 turbo on virtual dyno. I was pretty much there when I had that setup...
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
maybe. but i like my smaller cams and the FMIC is an older AMS unit, so i'm good there. as for drivetrain whine, my rear makes noise since adding diff bushings. it's even more loud with no interior. my Mustang did the same thing. i just pretend i have a sequential transmission LOL
maybe. but i like my smaller cams and the FMIC is an older AMS unit, so i'm good there. as for drivetrain whine, my rear makes noise since adding diff bushings. it's even more loud with no interior. my Mustang did the same thing. i just pretend i have a sequential transmission LOL
I've added bushing to a few friends Evo's with no change in noise. The problem is getting resolved, or I'm selling the car because it sucks to drive. Makes my ears hurts on freeway drives longer than 20 minutes or so. I'll trade it in to a dealer that won't take it on the freeway when they test drive it..
After I get some money out of the parts that are on it of course..
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
I've added bushing to a few friends Evo's with no change in noise. The problem is getting resolved, or I'm selling the car because it sucks to drive. Makes my ears hurts on freeway drives longer than 20 minutes or so. I'll trade it in to a dealer that won't take it on the freeway when they test drive it.. After I get some money out of the parts that are on it of course..
After I get some money out of the parts that are on it of course..
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
okay, so never mind. spun rod bearing on cylinder three. number four looked like crap as well. selling off the forged stuff and going back to OEM. f this crap.
Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 13,632
Likes: 824
From: Fresno, CA
i asked if checked all the clearances and he said "yes". i'm trusting him, as i didn't actually see him ever do it.
the first time the car ran after the build, there was a loud whine. turns out the bolt from the oil-pump balance shaft backed out. the bolt got beat around quite a bit. the bearings and balance shaft looked good, but that threaded cover for the shaft took some damage and was very hard to get out. my engine builder says he thinks metal from the bolt and/or cover contaminated the oil and caused the spin on cyl 3 and damage to cyl 4.
at least the cylinder walls all look perfect, which means i can sell the pistons and rods. well.. three good rods, anyway.
hearing rod knock on a fresh engine is the worst sound in the world.