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Thinking about running either FP Red or Green w/ stock internals

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Old Aug 12, 2017, 03:37 PM   #1
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Thinking about running either FP Red or Green w/ stock internals

How well would the internals manage? I will be running a sheepie built IC, 1200cc precision injectors, I already have a walbro fuel pump. Internal wise I just have aftermarket bearings and head gasket.
I do plan on getting a tune. About how much safe boost should I push?
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Old Aug 12, 2017, 03:46 PM   #2
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Keeping the tq down preferably below 400ft lbs and a good tune should pose no problems. Will you be on e85 or pump gas?
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Old Aug 12, 2017, 03:54 PM   #3
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Keeping the tq down preferably below 400ft lbs and a good tune should pose no problems. Will you be on e85 or pump gas?
Pump
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 12:24 AM   #4
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i just got an fp red and im on stock internals other than hks 272 cams and the car is right around 400 hp and 370ish torque and it is safe. but keep the torque under 400, the stock rods tend to give way past that.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 01:24 AM   #5
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On my old setup, JESTR Tuning had me tuned to 464hp/367tq on E85 at 27psi and that was on the second tuning pull. A good tuner can do this easy and an Evo can take it like a champ if you keep the torque down as mentioned.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 11:12 AM   #6
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You probably know this already, but, in case you don't:
The more power you want, the more lag you will have. You have to figure out how you want the car to behave and go from there.
A lot of people go with big turbos and peak dyno numbers then, a week later, are disappointed in how the car drives.
Either turbo will net the same torque, the larger turbo will make more power. Unless you upgrade the valvetrain, you will be limiting your power band with the bigger snail.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 01:39 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by tbaird58 View Post
i just got an fp red and im on stock internals other than hks 272 cams and the car is right around 400 hp and 370ish torque and it is safe. but keep the torque under 400, the stock rods tend to give way past that.
How much boost were you pushing at that time?
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 01:39 PM   #8
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You probably know this already, but, in case you don't:
The more power you want, the more lag you will have. You have to figure out how you want the car to behave and go from there.
A lot of people go with big turbos and peak dyno numbers then, a week later, are disappointed in how the car drives.
Either turbo will net the same torque, the larger turbo will make more power. Unless you upgrade the valvetrain, you will be limiting your power band with the bigger snail.
Thanks for the info
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 05:34 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaj View Post
You probably know this already, but, in case you don't:
The more power you want, the more lag you will have. You have to figure out how you want the car to behave and go from there.
A lot of people go with big turbos and peak dyno numbers then, a week later, are disappointed in how the car drives.
Either turbo will net the same torque, the larger turbo will make more power. Unless you upgrade the valvetrain, you will be limiting your power band with the bigger snail.
You are partly right but the green and red with MHI housing are hardly a "big" turbo. All MHI based turbos will taper around 7700-8000rpm and that's perfectly fine for the stock valvetrain and cams. Don't get too caught up in running a small turbo and trying to make 30psi at 3300rpm because someone else did. The engine needs some rpm to actually move the air. Furthermore a really small turbo (stock,hta,hks) with a quick hard spike is hard on the engine since it's such a low rpm. Now, most people tune to delay and respect the 400tq limit so you can still be ok. Just having a green or red let's you hit that 400tq number around 3800-4000 (on ethanol) and then carry the torque for a good period of time. A smaller turbo is gone to peak and fall quickly.

I had a red on my stock cams/block evo 9 engine and it worked well. Very responsive and would make 20psi by 3800-4000 rpm and whatever you targeted after 4300 or so. I made 430-450whp on a Dynojet on pump gas at 23-25psi . With ethanol it would make 500whp with 27-29psi and ride the 400tq limit for awhile. . It had a fat 4000 rpm power band and would still spool using part throttle like the stock turbo did. I made over 600whp before removing my stock engine and putting a built engine in.

If you were hardcore into chasing cones the green spools quicker then the red . For anything else I think it's a great street/track turbo. Great transient response. I went to multiple auto x events,track days and the drag strip. The red will also come up hard enough to slide the car in first or second gear around corners.

If you are going BB be sure to read up on proper crankcase pressure venting and use the correct restrictor for the oil line.

Last edited by Abacus; Aug 13, 2017 at 05:40 PM.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 05:55 PM   #10
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Like I always say: preference. I like reaching 20psi @ 3300 and the instant kick in the back. I've never been hungry for power, though- just fun. I like the car being super responsive with the gas pedal, as opposed to waiting. Yeah, I only make 425whp on a track tune, but I make it as fast as the engine internals will allow. It's definitely not for everyone and I do have fun riding in high-cars, so I understand the allure.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 06:13 PM   #11
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How often are you below 3500 on the roadcourse ? Do you have a Dynojet graph of your car. A small turbo is going to spike and fall . Average power and a large band are helpful on the road and street. From all the data I've found and made the red delivers well.
Believe me I like fun also.. and power. These cars at a responsive 500whp-600whp are a blast and can live a long time there.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 06:24 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Abacus View Post
You are partly right but the green and red with MHI housing are hardly a "big" turbo. All MHI based turbos will taper around 7700-8000rpm and that's perfectly fine for the stock valvetrain and cams. Don't get too caught up in running a small turbo and trying to make 30psi at 3300rpm because someone else did. The engine needs some rpm to actually move the air. Furthermore a really small turbo (stock,hta,hks) with a quick hard spike is hard on the engine since it's such a low rpm. Now, most people tune to delay and respect the 400tq limit so you can still be ok. Just having a green or red let's you hit that 400tq number around 3800-4000 (on ethanol) and then carry the torque for a good period of time. A smaller turbo is gone to peak and fall quickly.

I had a red on my stock cams/block evo 9 engine and it worked well. Very responsive and would make 20psi by 3800-4000 rpm and whatever you targeted after 4300 or so. I made 430-450whp on a Dynojet on pump gas at 23-25psi . With ethanol it would make 500whp with 27-29psi and ride the 400tq limit for awhile. . It had a fat 4000 rpm power band and would still spool using part throttle like the stock turbo did. I made over 600whp before removing my stock engine and putting a built engine in.

If you were hardcore into chasing cones the green spools quicker then the red . For anything else I think it's a great street/track turbo. Great transient response. I went to multiple auto x events,track days and the drag strip. The red will also come up hard enough to slide the car in first or second gear around corners.

If you are going BB be sure to read up on proper crankcase pressure venting and use the correct restrictor for the oil line.
So its all preference in either going with the red or green? My evo 8 is also my DD i forgot to mention. I dont track it, only run it on the street. I think I enjoy the boost when it comes on more quickly better, but i also like that "glued to your seat" feeling
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 06:28 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Abacus View Post
How often are you below 3500 on the roadcourse ? Do you have a Dynojet graph of your car. A small turbo is going to spike and fall . Average power and a large band are helpful on the road and street. From all the data I've found and made the red delivers well.
Believe me I like fun also.. and power. These cars at a responsive 500whp-600whp are a blast and can live a long time there.
If I decide to take the car to a meet or AutoX, Im often at low RPM. When I had the HTA71, it was a riot. Stop light to stop light was just silly, all without breaking the speed limit. Yes, it tapered off on that road course, but was still fast enough for my skill level. I like pulling out of corners, like, right now LOL.
​​​​​​ I've never had a desire to make 500-600whp, though. The amount of upgrades I'd have to make to reliably track a car with that much power doesn't appeal to me. Plus, I've seen crazy fast lap times with far less. I think the last list at my local track had only two cars, in the top 40, that had over 500whp. One was a full-on NSX racecar.
Im not saying I'm right and you're wrong, by any means. Just that this is how I like my car to work. Insta-torque puts a smile on my face, every time. As does being able to point and shoot the car anywhere, anytime.
I do like that my green didn't have to work as hard on the road course. 25psi, all day, making as much power as I dare. It was more "racecar" just not as fun for me.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 06:30 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Womb Raider View Post
So its all preference in either going with the red or green? My evo 8 is also my DD i forgot to mention. I dont track it, only run it on the street. I think I enjoy the boost when it comes on more quickly better, but i also like that "glued to your seat" feeling
If driving around town, you gotta ask yourself how often you plan to rev the car out to get that "wee" factor.
The BEST thing is to find people will these turbos and go for rides, if possible.
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Old Aug 13, 2017, 06:38 PM   #15
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If driving around town, you gotta ask yourself how often you plan to rev the car out to get that "wee" factor.
The BEST thing is to find people will these turbos and go for rides, if possible.
Lol thats out of the equation, my evo9 turbo blew a seal so now im out here searching for something with a better oomf, so in the meantime my car is sitting in a shop.
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