Engine rebuild opinions
I disagree, but that's all the more reason to start a thread to collect our thoughts an ideas. But even with that said...
Some of us actually care about comfort. Making a blanket statement of removing something like the balance shaft no matter what, just won't fit everyone's desires. For some builds it's worth removing, for some it's worth keeping.
@2006EvoIXer , I'd love to see a current discussion thread, I've read through a few in the past, but people's experiences where very limited. I'm a firm believer that the balance shaft does more good than harm, even if it's way more work to keep in your build than just deleting it.
Some of us actually care about comfort. Making a blanket statement of removing something like the balance shaft no matter what, just won't fit everyone's desires. For some builds it's worth removing, for some it's worth keeping.
@2006EvoIXer , I'd love to see a current discussion thread, I've read through a few in the past, but people's experiences where very limited. I'm a firm believer that the balance shaft does more good than harm, even if it's way more work to keep in your build than just deleting it.
I laugh every time someone links the 15yr+ old page from Jacks trans. You don't see him selling a balance shaft adaptation kit for the EvoX, do you? Because if they were so vitally important, the EvoX would have them.
If you can't handle the small amount of vibration at idle, I really don't know what you're doing building and driving high performance vehicles.
It doesn't do any harm, you're right, until it literally does all the harm possible when the belt comes off, or the tiny bearings that are spinning twice the engine speed give up and wipe out the rest of the motor.
You don't ever hear about engines that have died because of properly deleted balance shafts. On the other hand plenty have from balance shaft related failure. So I would think it wouldn't be controversial to say that removing the balance shafts improves reliability. That being said if you are going to dump a bunch of money into a build, increasing reliability at the expense of comfort isn't unreasonable. It doesn't hurt that you are freeing up some ponies too.
Evolving Member
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 469
Likes: 38
From: HWY 9
It's not an opinion, what you're saying is factually incorrect. Many 4 cylinders don't come with balance shafts, the 4b11 in the EvoX included. There is no other major design difference in these engines to stop the 2nd order harmonics that the balance shafts are there to cancel out (do you you even know what cause the second order vibrations?).
I laugh every time someone links the 15yr+ old page from Jacks trans. You don't see him selling a balance shaft adaptation kit for the EvoX, do you? Because if they were so vitally important, the EvoX would have them.
If you can't handle the small amount of vibration at idle, I really don't know what you're doing building and driving high performance vehicles.
It doesn't do any harm, you're right, until it literally does all the harm possible when the belt comes off, or the tiny bearings that are spinning twice the engine speed give up and wipe out the rest of the motor.
Nothing like a bearing that is smaller in diameter than the rod bearing spinning 2x as fast, or the 3/8" wide belt, to ruin your day.
I laugh every time someone links the 15yr+ old page from Jacks trans. You don't see him selling a balance shaft adaptation kit for the EvoX, do you? Because if they were so vitally important, the EvoX would have them.
If you can't handle the small amount of vibration at idle, I really don't know what you're doing building and driving high performance vehicles.
It doesn't do any harm, you're right, until it literally does all the harm possible when the belt comes off, or the tiny bearings that are spinning twice the engine speed give up and wipe out the rest of the motor.
Nothing like a bearing that is smaller in diameter than the rod bearing spinning 2x as fast, or the 3/8" wide belt, to ruin your day.
Lets agree to disagree. I can't imagine Mitsu put a balance shaft in the 4G for funsies, what they did in future iterations of the motor is irrelevant, it's a different motor. I haven't had any failures of balance related components, I change my belts often and use the Gates race belts. When I do have a failure, I'll start to reconsider keeping my BS in, but until then I'll continue running it. Thanks for your input though.
Don - Where is our balance shaft debate thread!?
Edit - There you are, responding as I am typing.
Evolving Member
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 469
Likes: 38
From: HWY 9
I would hate to disagree with you too, but even though its a different engine in the X, its still an DOHC inline 4. I dont care if its a GM engine, Toyota engine, whatever brand engine, if its an I4, its an I4. Same concept applies to all I4 engines. I am siding with Letsgetthisdone on this one 100%.
Don - Where is our balance shaft debate thread!?
Edit - There you are, responding as I am typing.
Don - Where is our balance shaft debate thread!?
Edit - There you are, responding as I am typing.
I really wish we could hear Mitsubishi's reasoning to put in the BS in the first place. Anything else is pure speculation.
Seems weird to me that they didn't shave the cost of the BS in the first place. It's very expensive to include one in every motor as standard, one has to think they had good reasoning.
Evolved Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 2,110
Likes: 320
From: Croatia
I really wish we could hear Mitsubishi's reasoning to put in the BS in the first place. Anything else is pure speculation.
Seems weird to me that they didn't shave the cost of the BS in the first place. It's very expensive to include one in every motor as standard, one has to think they had good reasoning.
Seems weird to me that they didn't shave the cost of the BS in the first place. It's very expensive to include one in every motor as standard, one has to think they had good reasoning.
Evolving Member
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 469
Likes: 38
From: HWY 9
There were lots of engines with ballance shafts and all of them were done to cancel second order engine shake that is typical of 4 cyl in line engines.. It is a comfort thing.. Also, there were some 4G engines without them... guess where the OE ballance delete kits come from..
There were lots of engines with ballance shafts and all of them were done to cancel second order engine shake that is typical of 4 cyl in line engines.. It is a comfort thing.. Also, there were some 4G engines without them... guess where the OE ballance delete kits come from..
My opinion:
The evo x block is aluminum. So counter vibrations from balance shafts would be absorbed in the aluminum and wouldn't get to the crank. So the benefits aren't there to keep in evo x.
Evolving Member
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 469
Likes: 38
From: HWY 9
Wait for the new thread. Lol
My opinion:
Also, the evo x block is aluminum. So balance shafts would be absorbed in the aluminum and wouldn't get to the crank. So the benefits aren't there to keep in evo x.
My opinion:
Also, the evo x block is aluminum. So balance shafts would be absorbed in the aluminum and wouldn't get to the crank. So the benefits aren't there to keep in evo x.
Thread Starter
Newbie
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 63
Likes: 1
From: Denver
Back to the original topic ☺
Apologies on not replying sooner. Life and eye surgery came along and set me back for a bit. So I ended up finding a good used set of stock length Manley Tuff H beam rods and stock size, 9:1 comoression pistons shipped to me for $400. Was too good of a deep to pass up. I went out and got a bore gauge kit. All cylinders are very tightly at 85mm except one which is only about 1/32 of a mm over if that. So I decided to get the matching 85mm ring set that wiseco offers and 2 sets of king bearings to match up as close to even clearances as possible..
As to the balance shaft delete. I did it and I hated it. Way too much vibration for my flavor. This is a DD after all so I would like to get as much comfort out of it as is practical. I reinstalled the balance shaft parts and retimed and it was smooth as butter. I can't speak onto the engineering part of it but from my experience I prefer to have it all in.
As to the balance shaft delete. I did it and I hated it. Way too much vibration for my flavor. This is a DD after all so I would like to get as much comfort out of it as is practical. I reinstalled the balance shaft parts and retimed and it was smooth as butter. I can't speak onto the engineering part of it but from my experience I prefer to have it all in.