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Tuning for RoadRacing - This could save you thousands

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Old Feb 9, 2006, 06:02 AM
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thanks for the great write up. It makes me feel better about shopping around for a good tuner especialy since I am just getting started in racing here in Vegas. This summer will be brutal on the car (always is) tarmac temps reach 160 degrees out here.
Old Mar 28, 2006, 12:16 PM
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This is an outstanding post, I am going to start road racing, and I am sure this post will save me alot of hassel down the road. Thanks for taking the time and effort to write this up!
Old Mar 28, 2006, 05:40 PM
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THIS is the kind of stuff that should be front and center on the boards. I'm preparing to do a dyno session with Pruven Performance, and it's great to have this voice of reason banging around in my head. Certainly will enter into my discussions as I explain my goals for the tune.
Old Apr 27, 2006, 09:30 PM
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.....
Old Jan 14, 2007, 10:13 AM
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Would the Koyo Small Radiator Kit be a cooling Upgrade or a Downgrade???
Old Jan 17, 2007, 09:47 PM
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Awesome post
Old Jan 24, 2007, 01:24 AM
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Hey, out of curiosity... I was at BeaveRun last summer and a guy in a black evo blew his motor going down the front straight... was that you? I saw the post and saw your motor go (if that was in fact you).

Each lap you were blowing some flame out as you came off the juice in the braking zone but started smoking a little bit too. It slowly got worse and a few of us thought you may be burning a turbo. Next thing we know... POP.

Sorry about your car, quite quick and it was fun watching while it lasted.

Once again if it was you, I was pitted a few spots down in the white Golf TDI. I think most folks thought I was a smoking 1.8 as my instructor told me to check my oil. When he found out it was a diesel he about peed himself.

The outing took a bit of a toll on me as well with a toasted set of Kumhos and a spent temp sensor and a bad wheel bearing that screamed at me the whole way home. Then again it was not that bad and beating up on the MiniS's in the group made my car a legend in the TDI community. I then turned around and sold the car for more than I had in it after driving it for two year and now have a nice down payment for an EVO once I find the right one...

Then again if that was not you, never mind. =-)
Old Jan 24, 2007, 05:51 AM
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Check, Check , Check we ready to race
Old Jan 24, 2007, 05:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Sharkbite2000
Check, Check , Check we ready to race
Sharkbie i see you have cosworth cams how are they. i am getting mixed reviews on them
Old Feb 1, 2007, 05:36 PM
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this thread is 2.5 years old, but i'm glad i found it before having my car tuned before i go racing this summer. (3) 20-30 minute sessions at Miller no doubt will be hard on my car.
Old Feb 2, 2007, 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted by metaphysical
As most of you know, I blew my engine road racing. Unfortunately, I learned after the fact that my tune wasn't safe enough for road racing, and this mistake cost me thousands of dollars. Fortunately, David Buschur has bent over backwards to help get my motor back together. The most important thing is understanding that your factory engine can withstand huge amounts of stress, and tuning is the most important aspect of reliability.

No matter what system you use to tune your car, whether it be a simple piggyback, reflash, complete piggyback system or a stand-alone engine management system, these suggestions apply to you.

I talked to about a dozen of the best tuners in the entire country to develop this list of suggestions (and franky, things you must do unless you plan on buying a new engine)

These are general ideas/concepts/suggestions, not specifics - let your tuner handle the specifics. But, the more you know, the better your car will run.

1) Finding a tuner
There are a lot of great tuners out there, you don't have to drive 2000 miles to find a competent person to tune your car. Find someone who is familiar with the system your using. Explain to them what your going to do with the car in detail. Let them sell you, they should be experts, they should be able to answer all your questions - so if they can't, don't have them tune your car.

2) Autocross and Roadracing require different tuning approaches
**And your tuner may not know the difference**
Your car is under great stess whenever you are on boost and at WOT throttle, there is a huge difference between 12 seconds of WOT and 45 minutes. The main difference is simple physics. Your turbo is spooled by exhaust gases, these gases happen to be very hot. So, the air is compressed by your turbo, but subsequently it is compressed and very hot. Your intercooler is designed to cool this air down before it enters your combustion chambers. If you roadrace or autocross, you will be under WOT for a long time, thus making your turbo extremly hot (hot enough to glow red), and eventually your intercooler will surpass it's efficiency and become very hot. This is an extremely bad thing - you then begin pumping extremely hot compressed air into your combustion chambers. If you have a tune designed for drag racing or daily driving (and apply tip #1, if your tuner has never autocrossed or roadraced think twice about going with him) your engine may be destroyed.

3) Take every safeguard to combat the heat problems with tuning
Tune your car with a large safety margin, the harder you plan on driving, the more safety margin you need. Use a very safe air/fuel ratio and timing - ie. a 10.5 air/fuel; it may not make as much power, but it is safer than anything above 11:1. Don't use too much boost - boost creates heat. This will also make less power, but if you want to make big power use race gas. Most tuners I talked to didn't advise anything above 20psi on 93 octane. Pump gas varies from store to store, so don't expect 93 octane to always be 93 octane. So, in short, you want your tune to be conservative.

4) Use knock control and have a full set of gauges/warning lights
**Your tuner might not have it enabled - turn it on**
Use knock control, period. It works, it may save you a motor. The only reason not to use it is if you run straight racefuel and have tuned your car extremely rigorously (less than 5% of us). You can cheaply and easily wire knock warning lights to alert you. The more gauges you have the better, in the event of a problem you can get answers fast. Gauges may cost money and give you zero hp, but they can save your motor and help you get answers to your problems fast. Don't assume that knock control is turned on, so if you have already been tuned, check and see if it's on. If your EMS system has a datalogger, learn how to use it. This can help you spot a problem well before it happens, and your factory sensors can tell you quite a bit, much more than a set of three gauges can. If you don't want to take a computer with you at the track, consider other alternatives (AEM EMS Specific). Gauge-tech.com makes a stand-alone monitoring system for the AEM EMS and it has a built in warning light which you can have triggered with EGT, knock of a/f warnings.

5) Fuel and spark run your engine - use the right gas and right spark plugs
$30 dollars of racegas may save you thousands on a engine rebuild. Racegas is added assurance. It works. If your tuned for 93 octane, add 3-4 gallons of leaded gas for extra safety. You can't stop heat unless you stop racing, so the extra octane and lead will stop or help to combat detonation. Water or Alcohol injection can work wonders, but keep in mind that you can have fuel slosh, pump failures or run out of water/alcohol with these systems also. Alcohol injection, in most cases, will not pass a road course tech inspection (think twice before putting something highly flammable in your windshield washertank). If you want to make more power, tune your car for straight race gas. A pump gas tune won't make as much power as a race gas tune, for a simple reason besides octane - 93 octane isn't always 93 on the other hand Sunoco GT100 is always 100 Octane. Leaded gas can ruin your 02 sensors, but it's much less expensive than a $3000 dollar motor. Change your spark plugs often, NGKs are inexpensive. And more importantly, inspect your spark plugs, they will show detonation spots and other signs. Run the correct heat range plugs. You may want to run a different (colder) heat range for road racing (BPR7ES for daily driving/BPR8ES for road racing). Ask your tuner for recommendations for spark plugs, if he/she doesn't seem to know, go somewhere else.

6) Overbuild your cooling and fueling
Read AEM EFI basics (available on the aem forums at www.aempower.com). Make sure your fuel pump, injectors and lines are up to the task of fueling. I wouldn't recommend doing any roadracing without a Walbro 255 pump. Make sure your injectors can supply enough fuel for your power levels. Most of the other parts of the fuel system can support very high horsepower, but it's always better to be safe than sorry. Roadrace on a full tank of gas, if your gas gets low, don't go out. If your serious and competitive, buy a fuel cell and or full fuel system with a surgetank. A larger intercooler is an excellent safety mod, if designed properly it will cool more efficently and help prevent heat induced detonation. If you do extremely long road racing events in extremely hot weather, consider an upgraded radiator. Heat in your engine can cause detonation.

7) Dynos lie (and so do knock sensors)
Refer back to the heat induced detonation failures. A dyno pull in 3rd gear with ample cooldown time does not stress your engine, your intercooler may still be operating at full efficiency and you may get zero knock with too much boost, too low of an air/fuel ration and/or too much timing. If your dyno operator uses a huge fan/sprays water on your engine/intercooler and gives you a 20 minute cooldown between runs, you may not be safe even if you get zero knock (I wasn't). Don't add racegas and get a reflash unless you plan on running racegas all the time. Keep in mind, you can strap your car on the dyno and run it through all the gears at WOT, it may not make huge numbers but it will make you feel better when your on the road course for 45 minutes. Road tuning can also be used, but be safe. A load bearing dyno is also a nice thing, but any type of dyno, if properly used, can do an adequate job. When you get tuned: Get a print out of your dyno sheet, but more importantly, find out how much boost your running, timing and your a/f. And it's not a bad thing to tune your car in extremely hot weather, nor is it bad to skip cooldown runs, nor is it bad to have low dyno numbers - after all, do you want to beat someone on the racetrack or the dyno?


Thanks,
JD

And many thanks to all those who helped and advised me.


Right on !
Old Mar 8, 2007, 02:19 PM
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I used to have a 2002 sentra se-r specv a long time ago and i can say that i was one of the very first turbo se-r and my 2 cents is you have to keep your knok sensor up and runing, one day going on a long 3 hour drive i experienced a fuel cut and ses light and it repeated the next time i push the accelerator, reason my boost gauge read over 11 psi when i only used to go under 6 the cause was a broken bolt on the wastegate actuator and it wasnt closing with boost, it was a very primitive set up but the knok sensor wich i was actually going to ground (so i did not lose power on timing retard) and some other safty device saved my engine from a bad set up in my turbo.

these was not the only problem with my set up, other long list of problems, almost all of them involved heat.

I have learned the lesson and with my evo i am going to be really conservative
Old Mar 8, 2007, 06:16 PM
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very good posts my friend. road racing is a Man's sport so i tell people all the time "performance ain't cheap" especially when road racing. a perfect example is Formula 1. those cars stall below 3K rpm...

i have exclusively used Sunoco GT 104+ unleaded racegas in my evo for 2 yrs now & i am tuned only on that. everyone said i was crazy to spend that much every time i got gas but here was my point that has been justified time & time again:

"$8/gallon is cheaper than a new motor!!!!!"

i can't emphasize cooling also as u mentioned. especially in areas like AZ where track temps exceed 160F easily in the summertime there. low temp t-stats, radiators, Tomei's Thermo killer, Redline's Waterwetter, & the best oil/fluids u can buy are all factors to aid in cooling.

& yes tuning is the difference between life & death on the track. Linear power is preferred over big turbo power. u see guys all the time at the track with a GT35R on their car getting passed by a N/A Civic cause he's waiting for his turbo to SPOOL!!!! by the time that thing hits it's time to TURN!

the other 2 areas people slack on in road racing is brakes & suspension but we'll save that for another sticky...
Old Mar 25, 2007, 01:36 AM
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good write up thanks metaphysical
Old May 6, 2007, 06:44 PM
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Very well put. Road racing/track days can uncover major issues with a vehicle, even though you "think" you have a perfect tune/setup. Cooling is the biggest concern, IMHO. Keep the heat down (and not just talking about upgraded rads and oil coolers), and your engine will be happiest. If a customer tells me they intend to track their car....even once a year....the strategy changes dramatically.


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