gsc cams nightmare
Installer error. I see you guys appear to be "friends" with the installer, so you are having a hard time blaming him. No matter how many times you do something, being human means making mistakes. It happens.
Greg is a stand-up guy, and would own up if it was a mechanical problem....but i believe that is next to impossible. If there was a problem, a lot of cams would have had the problem, not just 1 cam.
Greg is a stand-up guy, and would own up if it was a mechanical problem....but i believe that is next to impossible. If there was a problem, a lot of cams would have had the problem, not just 1 cam.
Originally Posted by hotrod2448
Not to mention if your installer is as good as you say he is why didn't he stop turning the motor when he felt everything bind up? That's just common sense.
As far as timing it wrong, the only thing i can say is wouldnt all the valves be bent if he turned it over 4 full times???
We're not talking about an amplifier or an ecu with thousands of little components inside, where if anyone of them drifts out of spec, product no worky. We're talking about a set of cams that are manufacted from one material througout and were made using the same machine that produced hundreds of other cams. Measure the cams. You probably wont send em back because they're good. The installer probably pulled a fast one on you. Good luck though.
Evolved Member
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 2,815
Likes: 24
From: Davidson, NC
Originally Posted by NOLIMITMOTORS
2 years ago i was assembling a 4g63 long block and i was sitting down turning it over with a torque wrench. The motor was on a stand obviously and i was facing the crank pulley and just turning it over. It got a little hard to turn at once point but never got hard enough for me to really have to pull down hard, it would get a little tough and then ease up. well later down the line, i found ou I has fuct sumthin up and i had bent all 8 intake valves. And there were supertech SS valves!!!!! I wasnt even turning it over hard and i bent all of them. i couldnt believe it.
As far as timing it wrong, the only thing i can say is wouldnt all the valves be bent if he turned it over 4 full times???
As far as timing it wrong, the only thing i can say is wouldnt all the valves be bent if he turned it over 4 full times???
Me and my old friend did the cam installation on this car. First of all i will try to explain things as they happened i'll try to be brief and please spare my english we in Puerto Rico don't practice it very often and it is a little hard to explain this things in this language. We installed the cams and cam gears and before we started the car as we always do without the valve cover installed yet we spinned the engine by hand with a 1/2 racket and ext. to see if everything was smooth.We turn the engine and it made a weird sound so we put the valve cover on no bolts on it just to see if all the marks were aligned they were perfect so we took the valve cover out and slowly turned the engine and we noticed that the valves on piston 1 and 4 were staying open and when the engine return to tdc the pistons were pushing them back and that was the source of the hard ticking sound. I called the owner of the car for him to see it and we then source a set of 272 HKS. We installed the HKS and turn the engine and it was super smooth and we checked the marks on cover and engine they were fine so we started the car.The was messed up it didn't idle and when it got to normal temp it dies and it was hard to start it again so we checked compression piston 1 had 0 piston 2 had 147 piston 3 had 136 and piston 4 had 0. It was obvious it had valve damaged. We took the head out and took the pictures. Today we installed a head back and the car started with no problems.
I know i'm not perfect maybe i made a mistake but we have to measure the cams first to determine who to blame.
Here are couple of pictures of a set of GSC i tried to installed on my car and as you can see they were defective. The cams did not fit so i send them back to greg at gsc and he gave my $ back that was fine for me i'm not a whining internet racer like a lot of people on the forums so i kept my mouth shut and did not post here about it. So out of 250 sets they made is absolutely posible the machine cut one really bad. I have more pictures if you need them.
I know i'm not perfect maybe i made a mistake but we have to measure the cams first to determine who to blame.
Here are couple of pictures of a set of GSC i tried to installed on my car and as you can see they were defective. The cams did not fit so i send them back to greg at gsc and he gave my $ back that was fine for me i'm not a whining internet racer like a lot of people on the forums so i kept my mouth shut and did not post here about it. So out of 250 sets they made is absolutely posible the machine cut one really bad. I have more pictures if you need them.
Last edited by onpol; Sep 26, 2005 at 03:28 PM.
It happened before (the last one was definitely a cam problem), it can happen again. With the last set other mechanics saw the cam and definitely that cam was useless, but Greg was very helpful and he reimbursed the $$$. The point its that it can happen, why it happened two times for us? Thats maybe just bad luck!
But we need to measure the cam first before we are absolutely sure its another bad cam, but all the people that was there at the shop are almost sure its the cams. But lets wait for the measurements guys.
But we need to measure the cam first before we are absolutely sure its another bad cam, but all the people that was there at the shop are almost sure its the cams. But lets wait for the measurements guys.
Originally Posted by evosorio
At plain sight the lobes look normal, but still a minimal difference could be something that is naked to the human eye. The only valves that touched were the intake ones. There were no problems with the exhaust cam
Check if you installed an exhaust cam in the intake side.
Maybe they shipped you 2 exhaust cams.
Just a thought since you think it's not an installer error.
Heres the thing. You cant just look at the timing marks on the valve cover. You gotta pull the accessory pully and check the mark on the crank also. You also have to be sure you dont have it 180 degrees out of phase, because the marks will be lined up, but wont be in time.
Another thing, just because you put HKS 272s in afterwords dont mean a thing. For one the damage is already done and 2 you may have got it right the second time. Its pretty obviouse you guys messed up. I'd cough up the dough and make your friends car right again.
Another thing, just because you put HKS 272s in afterwords dont mean a thing. For one the damage is already done and 2 you may have got it right the second time. Its pretty obviouse you guys messed up. I'd cough up the dough and make your friends car right again.
I have to agree with almost everybody on here. Installer error!!! Even the most experienced people make mistakes, but only a real man will admit when he has made a mistake.
No you don't!!! How could you be sure its not the installers fault? Because he's installed many before? So your saying he doesn't make mistakes and does every install perfectly?
If you measured the cams like everybody suggested, then you would know it was the cams fault. Until you do so nobody is going to believe you.
Why do you keep blaming the cams when you don't even know. You're automatically blaming GSC when you have no proof.
Originally Posted by The_Predat0r
Hey guys, we are posting this because we are trying to find if someone else had problems with any other bad cam. I am sure it wasnt an installer problem, the owner of the car knows it wasnt an installer problems and all other guys there know it wasnt an installer problem.
You are not helping at all trying to blame the installer, who is one of the bests. We just think we should share our experience and we want to know is this has happened before.
You are not helping at all trying to blame the installer, who is one of the bests. We just think we should share our experience and we want to know is this has happened before.
If you measured the cams like everybody suggested, then you would know it was the cams fault. Until you do so nobody is going to believe you.
Why do you keep blaming the cams when you don't even know. You're automatically blaming GSC when you have no proof.
sr20det- by cheking the marks i meant all 3 marks lined up . The two at the valve cover and the one on the crankpulley.
Evonyoass- if it was my fault i will admit i'm not afraid to do so. After all the car was fixed and the owner is happy with his HKS cams and the car now. But how can you explain about the incident i had before.That 264 ex cam couln't even be fitted in place. Thats why we believe it was the cam .
Ok people enough said we will measure the cams and get back here.
Evonyoass- if it was my fault i will admit i'm not afraid to do so. After all the car was fixed and the owner is happy with his HKS cams and the car now. But how can you explain about the incident i had before.That 264 ex cam couln't even be fitted in place. Thats why we believe it was the cam .
Ok people enough said we will measure the cams and get back here.
Although it is possible that the cam is manufactured wrong, i'm going with installer error as well. I just don't see how 1 cam out of hundreds that came from GSC is off like this. If it is a problem with the cam then I'll be the first to say that Greg at GSC is a stand-up guy and has the best customer service I've ever seen. Good luck.
