Why get a bigger turbo? Help!
Why get a bigger turbo? Help!
I am have been struggling all day looking through various posts and trying to decide which big turbo to get. Talk to a couple of different vendors regarding there offering but after a ton of research I am having trouble understanding why. I have a 2003 Evo 8, APS 3" TB, APS Intake, 10.5 Hotside, SS 02 Housing, HKS 264/272, Snow Alky (100% Alky), Dynoflash, and thats it for performance mods... running 26 pounds on an MD Mustang Dyno I got 350/400.
Dynochart
I was looking for a 35r but w/ stock head/stock block i got a little worried. Though while researching torque seemed to drop down pretty hard, but people gained HP, couldn't justify the high price tag.
Started looking at 3076r's people seem to be making 400hp w/ alky(or c16) with 350 in trq(on dynojets btw). The turbo spools up alot later (around 5500) though maintaining the power later in the RPM range with minimal dropoff. So essentially my question is would it be worth it to pay 3 grand for 50 ftlbs less trq, and 50 hp? Opinions would be greatly apreciated...
The post where I am getting the 3076 #'s is here.
Dynochart
I was looking for a 35r but w/ stock head/stock block i got a little worried. Though while researching torque seemed to drop down pretty hard, but people gained HP, couldn't justify the high price tag.
Started looking at 3076r's people seem to be making 400hp w/ alky(or c16) with 350 in trq(on dynojets btw). The turbo spools up alot later (around 5500) though maintaining the power later in the RPM range with minimal dropoff. So essentially my question is would it be worth it to pay 3 grand for 50 ftlbs less trq, and 50 hp? Opinions would be greatly apreciated...
The post where I am getting the 3076 #'s is here.
didnt know there was a timer. as always thanks for the productive input post officer. i am essencially looking for a reason to get a bigger turbo as the numbers don't seem to justify it, go sell something bud.
Today, 10:29 PM
Today, 10:53 PM
There is a reason to get a bigger turbo. Your mistake is thinking that a 3076 only puts down 400whp/350wtq with alky, cams, and all the bolt-ons. My guess is you don't understand the difference between dynos (even when it's the same dyno type sometimes).
Today, 10:53 PM
There is a reason to get a bigger turbo. Your mistake is thinking that a 3076 only puts down 400whp/350wtq with alky, cams, and all the bolt-ons. My guess is you don't understand the difference between dynos (even when it's the same dyno type sometimes).
i can understand fluctuations in calibration, but that shouldn't be very drastic, that was a little bit more productive, thanks. your a plethora of information when you dont flame.
Nobody can answer your question, "is it worth it?" because nobody knows what you want yet.
You said you're struggling - what are you struggling with? What are your goals, and what are you willing to forfeit to achieve them? Unless you race for money or have a prostate condition that induces ejaculation at high boost, no modification is "worth it" unless it gives you what you want, so what is that?
Stock spool? With a stock block, it's gone with any turbo that's not stock. Are you patient?
More high end? The 35R may be a waste if you're not going to reinforce your bottom-end to maximize the opportunity. Are you willing to?
You said you're struggling - what are you struggling with? What are your goals, and what are you willing to forfeit to achieve them? Unless you race for money or have a prostate condition that induces ejaculation at high boost, no modification is "worth it" unless it gives you what you want, so what is that?
Stock spool? With a stock block, it's gone with any turbo that's not stock. Are you patient?
More high end? The 35R may be a waste if you're not going to reinforce your bottom-end to maximize the opportunity. Are you willing to?
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I am just looking for a huge bang for the buck mod, at this point i think thats the only thing left to do other then build my bottem end or head.
I am struggling with the idea of spending 3,000 for a bigger turbo with marginal gains similiar to installing alky for $500.
I understand the stock spools pretty well, though its not the concern in this situation, its the concept on spending 3,000 for half a second. Should that be worth the cost or would it make more sense to wait to build the engine.
I am struggling with the idea of spending 3,000 for a bigger turbo with marginal gains similiar to installing alky for $500.
I understand the stock spools pretty well, though its not the concern in this situation, its the concept on spending 3,000 for half a second. Should that be worth the cost or would it make more sense to wait to build the engine.
Last edited by App420; Jul 20, 2006 at 11:31 AM.
Originally Posted by ez76
Unless you race for money or have a prostate condition that induces ejaculation at high boost, no modification is "worth it" unless it gives you what you want, so what is that?
gosh this thread sucks.
there's only two reasons to go with a bigger turbo. one is fuel choice. the other is rpm choice.
ask yourself why no s2ks are turboed with anything less than a gt35r. that would be because they rev up to 9k, putting our stock turbo on that car would do more harm than good. and with such a high revving car you can produce massive horsepower and it's easy to stay in the rev range because the range is infact so large.
what about fuel choice. if you are going to run 30psi and 110 octane all the time a stock like turbo is a waste because you're never making 30psi. even at 26 you're only making 26 for about 20% of the time and then it peters off to some number that is basically less.
if you want to stay on pump gas then go no further than a 3071, which is a 48trim turbo. you can go 50trim if warr tells you so.
if you plan to rev to 8.5k then consider a turbo that can get you there. no less than 3076. you can get a 50trim if warr tells you so.
if you want to run racegas boost all the time then consider at least a 3071 but likely you'll be more happy with a 3076.
if you want to run alcohol... it's a big toss up, becuase alcohol is only sometimes and you get all this hissy hissy blah blah, you can tell i don't like alcohol. so listen to what warr has to say about that cuz i don't care to share my opinions on it.
there's only two reasons to go with a bigger turbo. one is fuel choice. the other is rpm choice.
ask yourself why no s2ks are turboed with anything less than a gt35r. that would be because they rev up to 9k, putting our stock turbo on that car would do more harm than good. and with such a high revving car you can produce massive horsepower and it's easy to stay in the rev range because the range is infact so large.
what about fuel choice. if you are going to run 30psi and 110 octane all the time a stock like turbo is a waste because you're never making 30psi. even at 26 you're only making 26 for about 20% of the time and then it peters off to some number that is basically less.
if you want to stay on pump gas then go no further than a 3071, which is a 48trim turbo. you can go 50trim if warr tells you so.
if you plan to rev to 8.5k then consider a turbo that can get you there. no less than 3076. you can get a 50trim if warr tells you so.
if you want to run racegas boost all the time then consider at least a 3071 but likely you'll be more happy with a 3076.
if you want to run alcohol... it's a big toss up, becuase alcohol is only sometimes and you get all this hissy hissy blah blah, you can tell i don't like alcohol. so listen to what warr has to say about that cuz i don't care to share my opinions on it.
Did you just say "build my bottem end of head"? Do yourself a big favor. DO NOT MOD YOUR CAR. If you don't even know the basic architecture of a inline 4 cylinder, and you attempt to modify your own car, you will blow things up. Try to learn more about engine tuning and which modifications are best before you decide to start modifying.
Originally Posted by App420
I am just looking for a huge bang for the buck mod, at this point i think thats the only thing left to do other then build my bottem end of head.
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Joined: Jun 2005
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From: IL
I will agree with the statement above! If you want to go with a turbo kit, first find out what your goals are. A 35R is a great turbo that is very capable of putting out power but if you are doing a lot of auto x probably not your best selection, if you are building a drag queen then the building a 2.0 with the 35 or 37R is a great way to go.
If you want a really fun pump gas car with methanol, do a 50 trim turbo, I put out 500 whp on AMS kit. Great numbers have been posted for the turbo trix kit as well. mine is a daily driver on pump gas so I wanted something that would put out good power.
Other option, do a 2.3 stroker motor with the stock turbo and probably one of the fastest spooling street cars around that will still put out great power and more torque.
You will also see there is a point that horsepower and torque will stay very close to one another but once you get to a level horsepower will start to pull away. I believe that was one of your concerns in your first post.
Basically after all that, just find out what you want to do with the car and then make your choices off of that.
If you want a really fun pump gas car with methanol, do a 50 trim turbo, I put out 500 whp on AMS kit. Great numbers have been posted for the turbo trix kit as well. mine is a daily driver on pump gas so I wanted something that would put out good power.
Other option, do a 2.3 stroker motor with the stock turbo and probably one of the fastest spooling street cars around that will still put out great power and more torque.
You will also see there is a point that horsepower and torque will stay very close to one another but once you get to a level horsepower will start to pull away. I believe that was one of your concerns in your first post.
Basically after all that, just find out what you want to do with the car and then make your choices off of that.
I understand your frustration because I was just in the same similar situation. I have been wanting the 35r but I dont have the cash for the stroker upgrade to marry it with. I did not want to go with the 35r without the stroker because I enjoy an earlier spool up. For the price of the 3076 and the 50 trim, I would rather just save for the whole package (35r + 2.3 stroker equals my high boost ejaculation dream). I realistically would not have the money for this job for a while. So here was my decision. I purchased the Evo 9 20g 6blade TME. This will give me some extra horsepower I am looking for, faster spool up, and give me the temporary fix my veins need until I can afford to really blow a wod. I can even look at the stroker package and have a fun street monster until my budget could afford the 35r and stroker. I would give you numbers but I install tonight and tune this weekend. I picked up my turbo at turbocharges.com. The price is right for what I want. I was actually going to wait longer......but my poor poor lil stock turbo started the death cry.