I can not make it tomorrow at ATCO - but we are still having the EVO meet Sunday night in Nanuet, NY - 9:30 p.m. RT 59 and 304 in the Pathmark parking lot !!!

Good luck with the 3" exhuast - but I predict that you will run exactly the same trap speeds as you ran before with no exhuast at all! My dyno testing shows that the 3" straight through exhuast system makes the same exact HP on our cars as no exhuast at all which is what you had before

 

What are your thoughts on the e-manage on an otherwise stock car? I'm seriously thinking of using only the e-manage and perhaps the Greddy EBC...... I really don't want a loud exhaust, I think the WRX cured me of that sh*t
I would like to see a little more power though... I think there might be another 10-20 ponies in the car that just need some careful tuning..... What do you think?

 

Boost is limited by the combustion/octane rating of the fuel used. Its not an issue of richening the fuel to increase boost. Anything more than 18psi on 93 octane will begin detonation.

 

AL gave me a ride in his EVO on Sat while i was at PRUVEN getting my EVO dynoed,,All i heve to say SH(*^^^&*Y&*T!!! that thing is screaming now .made my stock one feel slow.yep of course now i am buying the same set up!!!

AL thnx for the ride +all the legg work
PRUVEN, YOU GUYS ROCK!!!!!

 

What exactly is the "PRUVEN setup"? I thought that Al's car got lots of it's power from the e-manage.... Of course, I think he has a good bit more in the way of mods including a new IC and turbo back exhaust. I want to start with just the e-manage and then gradually modify the car. I don't think I'll be changing the IC, and frankly, I'm in doubt about the whole exhaust because of the increased noise level. I just don't want a loud car..... I guess I'm finally getting old....

 

what meeting? tell!! Im also in NY. were is this meeting and when? Al, are you organizing this?

 

If you just get the rmr downpipe and cat-back, and retain the stock cat ... it won't be loud. Al claimed his complete exhaust (rmr turbo back w/ pruven cat-delete pipe is just barely louder than stock. Got to free up that exhaust man ... the car is literally being choked with the stock exhaust ... a good turbo back could yield 30 + additional hp! There is always the RalliArt cat-back if you want quiet .... but it's overproced IMO ... the rmr is better performance while being just as quiet for less $. Just my 2 cents ...

 

I know all about the restrictive exhaust of most cars... I understand what you are saying, but I know from my experience with my WRX and other cars in the past that there are some consequences from going with bigger (or the same size) aftermarket exhausts. The noise level is one of the negative results, even though the increase might seem very small to some people, that is very subjective and it might become untolerable to others..... There are also other things that come up such as unintended boost increases, lower torque at lower rpms, higher exhaust temps and the potential for CELs. Of course, these are not certain to occur but there is always that chance....
Anyway, you are right that a freer exhaust is generally good for a turbo charged car, but there are some negative results. Also, I'm not sure that the HP gains can be quite as high as 30HP.....

 

Good point, silverEVO8. This is why WORKS offers our exhaust upgrade (“Exhale”) with an ECU remap. This ensures no boost creep, no torque loss, and no CELs.

-- DavidV

 

On the EVO VIII - there is NO boost creep or spike with a 3" exhuat - - the Trq is more than stock all the way from 1500 to red line - in fact its about 50 ft lbs more at 3500 and 70 ft lbs more than stock at 5000;

THE EGT's are very very low

I dont think there is any disadvantage with going to a 3" turbo back - execpet of course the cost

Finally - as for vendors who try and make claims regarding thier particular exhaust - a 3" tube is a 3" tube - period - the only significant difference between various different systems is the sound, the fit and finish and the materials

 

Remeber people the 4g63 seems to like a little bit of back pressure and a FULL exhaust.. you will usually make more with a good 3" back then just dumping out of the downpipe. That and length does make a difference because of pressure waves.


-Zach

 

David,

The "Exhale" sounds like an excellent product; however, while many of us strive to achieve the LEAST amount of weight and overall restriction from an exhaust system, we are also concerned about noise. Since "Exhale" does NOT include a muffler or silencer of any kind, it leads one to believe that it will be loud as hell!!! Is this the case? Can you provide a sound clip? Secondly, as you read earlier in this post, Al's dyno test concluded that the RMR turbo-back made the same amount of hp as the car with no exhaust at all .... not that I am RMR bias because of 1 dyno test, but this particular exhaust system (RMR) has 2 silencers and a muffler for a "almost stock" sound, yet it seems to have 0 restriction ... according to Al's tests. Basically, I have to ask how can it get better than this? In other words ... is the major benefit of the exhale weight reduction??? Because it is difficult for me to believe that it won't be loud or drone on the highway. Please advise ... thanks.

 

Generally speaking, this true.

However, different companies offer different approaches to a number of variables including the number, type and size of both mufflers and resonators used, as well as the number and degree of bends.

All things being equal, fewer/smoother bends will provide for more power as it is the most direct route for exhaust gases to escape.

Also, clearance on the EVO is very tight. I have heard reports of 3" exhausts not cleanly clearing the rear cross-member. We invest the extra time and money to have custom bends tooled for us where applicable. As an example, our "Exhale" features a custom tooled 3" bend to line up with the factory mounting hardware and exit at the appropriate point, while maintaining the smoothest exhaust path possible. We also custom machine all of our flanges and mounting brackets to work with the factory hardware.

Then there's the ECU tuning. No doubt about it: A 3" exhaust with and ECU tune will make power than a 3" exhaust on stock ECU -- every time.

-- DavidV

 

Unless you remove the cat, you shouldn't get a CEL from an exhaust upgrade.

An ECU remap will only affect boost creep in a positive way if you detune the engine (less exhaust, less creep). Anyone who says otherwise doesn't really understand what boost creep is.

An exhaust should make the turbo spool up faster, which means more torque at a lower RPM. But until the turbo spools, you will lose a little torque with a larger exhaust. Not a ton, though.

 

Also, I'm not sure what there is to re-tune when you install an exhaust. The ECU will measure more air coming into the engine as a result of the ehaust upgrade. So it will match that extra air with more fuel. You may be able to run a little more timing and/or a little leaner due to the cylinders being able to evacuate a little more exhaust.

But that should be studied on a case-by-case basis. If you buy an AFC or some other piggyback, you can tune the car yourself, rather than relying on someone else. That way, if you decide to run race gas, you can tune your car on the fly.

Lets put it this way. I raced my car on pump gas a few weeks ago. No change from how I drive my car on the street. I ran a 13.3@101mph.

Last week, I dumped in some Sunoco Supreme N.O.S. race gas (117 octane). I leaned the engine out 7% from my street tune and added 2 degrees of timing advance. I also turned up the boost. I ran 107.5mph in the 1/4. I didn't change the boost at all from that point, but with tuning, I was able to end up running 111.5mph at the end of the night. I ended up leaning the mixture out by another 6%, and I added another 3 degrees of timing advance over my initial settings.

My tune wasn't that extreme. I suspect that the car has a lot more left in it.

My point is that you can't get that kind of adjustability from an ECU re-flash, unless you re-flash your ECU after every 1/4mi pass. Learn how to tune your own car, and in the long run, you will get more power, more torque, and be able to tune your car for the conditions that it is in, currently.