thanks for the prop...ran a 2:01 for the new NASA NorCal TTA record last weekend in a full weight/interior car on full depth RA1's (it was suposed to rain)...320 at the ground....DMs 50's...

 

Thanks for the compliment from Innovative Tuning.

I am happy to be compared a company with a reputation like Ohlins. We are direct competitors in the market place, but hopefully they respect us as we do them. We each offer top of the line shocks with entry level systems in the 2500 to the 3000$ range up to factory setups of over 20k$.

You will see an Ohlins shock on more professional race cars than any other manufacturer in the world, hopefully we will be able to get our share of that market some day as well and are working hard to bring that technology to more affordable setups. You may not have independant adjustment on the entry level units, but you know the design experience from the competition stuff is in their blood (or shock oil if you will) somewere.

See you out at the tracks or rallies guys
-mark

 

No problem. I'm happy to promote a product that's worked so well for us. We have some DMS love on the bumpers too.



In the future you'll be seeing us at the track rather than at the rallies. Time to switch things up.

-Mike

 

nice, it was nothing major, a subtle re-shaping of the rear high-speed compression curve, all for steet ride. The trick is keeping the low speed exactly the same so there is no penalty at the track...

I have seen the curves from all out major competitors and nothing is anywhere as refined as our stuff (25 evolutions in dampening and counting ).

 

these are all good questions, and you are absolutely correct it thinking it's all in the shims. When we do re-valves we change the shims which changes the dampening curve. Even though the Ohlins R&T is "only" single adjustable (and priced accordingly) they are internally 5-way adjustable (just like any other shock). DMSs are externally two-way adjustable but DMS does not allow you or anyone but them to crack them open and tune them so they are "only" two way adjustable. Robi does not have an ongoing refining of the valving on his DMSs unless he sends them back to DMS and asks for changes. We on the other hand take advantage of Ohlins more open minded and open sourced approach. We manipulate them using shims and canister pressure to improve every aspect of the dampening curves. The curves you see for DMS and other competitors are very basic, there is in fact no real curve at all the dampening starts at zero (of course) and in a very linear manner increases due to shaft velocity, simple stuff and it works great on the track (unless you wallop a curb or drop a wheel) but the car will not like regular road at regular speeds. We (Vishnu is "we") manipulate the curves at all points to remove compromise, our curves are very curvy some with multiple humps depending on the particular application. This takes a massive amount of R&D and every time you change something you discover something so you continue to refine the curves.

Let me ask you, who else directly does this? We dyno all sorts of shocks and check them out and nothing has this level of refinement and we do it because it's just plain cool how the evo responds to the changes, it is an amazing platform.

One last thing that's bugging me in some posts...progressive springs. Progressive springs have no place in road racing period! The only exception is for a car that has a non-linear motion ratio (something with pushrods and bellcranks, formula car/prototype) They are not used at all. Why you ask? Simple, how do you consistently dampen a progressive spring? Shocks are speed sensitive not position sensitive so you are overdampened on the light end of the spring and maybe underdampened on the heavy end of the spring, in the end you have just introduced a compromise that shouldn't be there. They do work off-road BTW, hell my KTM dirt bike has a progressive suspension and it works great (off-road). You may be thinking "wait a minute they use tender springs on the rear of the Ohlins!" yes we do but the tender is not there to add a low spring rate it's there to keep the spring seated in full droop travel as soon as any load hits that spring it coil binds. We have plenty of droop travel BTW and my tires don't come off the ground even with my softish spring rates that allow more pitch and roll that a pure track set-up would.

Just because we don't currently have product to sell doesn't mean I have to let our competitors nutty propaganda take over!

 

You don't need propaganda if the stuff works 2:01 at T hill NASA last weekend TTA CLASS RECORD (wern't you guys only a few seconds faster qualifing in a full racecar with FULL SLICKS? at the 25 debacle?)EVO with Buschur bolt ons 320WHP full weight full interior car....DMS 50s and 275's FULL DEPTH RA1's (it was suposed to rain...)...Took a V customer with olins.....he could not believe the differance in the two cars.....oh it rides MUCH better on the street too....(the double adjustables bonus)
DMS NO BS just control to make your EVO do what you want it too...
PS in the Touge trailer your car is PUSHING massively.....

(prob.trail braking too ..lolroflmfao...;-)))

sorry just couldn't resist....

 

Paul-- Get off the internet and get back to working on your World Challenge car for the race this weekend in Long Beach. Let those without professional racing experience (like me, for instance!) argue on the internet

 

The question is WHEN you expect Ohlin to start sending you the coilovers. The fact that no one (not only Paul/Vishnu) seems to be willing to or can answer the "when" question makes us potential buyers very uneasy about Ohlin's ability to meet demand. This reminds me of the problems that Apple computer had some years ago with putting product on the shelves in an all important Christmas buying season. Sooner or later buyers will grow weary of the "just hang in there" statements.

BTW I know this is beyond your (chrono/Vishnu) control.

 

No Problem Robi, this is what the internet is all about and makes it great! You say "no BS" yet I "accuse" you of BS in my last post and you have no actual response for it other that comparing two different cars running at the same track years apart and then say we were seconds faster??? Yes we were on Yoko slicks no the car did not have much power (270whp for the 25hr) oh and the Ohlins on that car had stock valving (in your defense you did not know that part) and it was heavy because of the 40 gallon cell.

I do appreciate that you are running in and winning events ( )but it's irrelevant till we run head to head again (and we will this year, do you hear that Shiv! we need a "shop car!"). I haven't seen the Touge DVD but the car can be made to understeer if the driver prefers that but I doubt he understeered his way around when he was going for a lap time, the car was much to quick on the clock for that right? I doubt he would have said all those glowing things about the handling and the car in general?

As far as the Vishnu Ohlins guy you gave a ride to were his Ohlins re-valved? Vishnu sold many sets before we started re-doing them, we have had some sent back in to get done and they continue to trickle in.

Anyway back on topic, anyone who is coming out to Long Beach come see me at the At Speed Motorsports trailer and we'll walk around the paddock looking for DMSs and any cars running progressive springs

for chmodlf, we're working on it, until a solution is found I seem to be an internet racer! We are continuing to develop the Vishnu stuff, my car is going in for re-valve 26 while I'm in Long Beach. I guess the point is when we have a solution it will be the best one and I believe you'll feel it was worth the wait. Finally, thank you thank you for the ridiculous amount of patience all this is has been and is requiring

 

A 2:01 lap with the bypass at Thunderhill is absolutely nothing special, and certainly nothing to brag about.

As far as lap records, that time trial stuff that you try and call 'racing' is a new class, so isn't any lap you run a 'lap record'? Please don't let facts stand in the way of your typing.

 

yeah John a "Muellerized" customer did a 2:06 in the same class...same day with an Evo blessed by your talents....and normalized to mine by the TTA rulebook...complained about how he couldn't get the front end to hook-up on the friday rained on green and greasy track..You know John Griggs? he was impressed..and that's good enough for me, and was there driving..and complaining about the lack of traction in a 600 whp 'stang with 315's Hoosiers.
TT ran all last year and this was the third event this year..

Edited to clear up a false impression

RRF

 

Again you choose to mislead people, rather than type what happened. Our
'Muellerized' team was at Sears Point that same weekend running the SCCA event, yet you choose to post up we were at a different track? I know of a few drivers that could have been running our products at T-hill, but all of them are novice drivers, still learning the basics.

Please don't let facts stand in the way of your typing.

 

TTA car with "full" Muellerized.set-up. yes your customer never stated "Team Muelller" was there if it so reads than my bad. I think Percy has some MAD skills...the set-up tire combo just didn't work....slick track everyone scratching for traction...Hope you did well with the SCCA

 

Wow, so angry yet so amazingly unable to answer any technical questions


Coincidence?...I think not

Robi (and Al) philosophy...when you don't know an answer (or get caught stretching the truth)...ATTACK!!!

 

Man it sucks when what could be an informative and educational thread turns into the "Oh yeah whip it out" thread. On one page you have 3 posters that all can take your Evo to a new world of performance bashing and chest pounding. Take it to the track and leave the internet for info and **** like god intended.

Not an attack, but Chrono, You accuse someone of being angry but I see no exclamation points, Caps or inflamatory remarks. He wished them well at their event. Then you bring up another site vendor to bad mouth. Maybe its not a cioncidence but rather someones own perception...

Sorry to interrupt, I vote Ohlins as they work great on my bikes and that is my only point of reference and not worth 2 cents.