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Old Oct 3, 2013, 04:21 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by golgo13 View Post
Does anyone on this board use a suspension tuner or is it all trial and error? I understand that if you don't tune the suspension together, you'll be pushing off one problem (say, understeer) onto one part in an attempt to compensate for that problem and potentially add in an entirely new problem because the wrong part was added to the equation or adjusted incorrectly.

I was considering coilovers and eventually a RSB, but I have absolutely no idea how these particular parts are going to work as a system. I'm aware that suspension is not a simple bolt-and-go but I'm a bit ovewhelmed by my utter lack of knowledge surrounding this topic.

The forums are tough because I'm constantly running into conflicting information.



I want to step up from my OEM sway bars and my MR Bilsteins with Swift Spec-R springs at some point very soon, but I'm not sure the best way to approach this.

Any knowledge from suspension gurus would be welcome.

Actually, this post might need to be its own topic...

Email Smike....:-) my take is that you need a systematic approach. and quality parts that actually do adjust or have an decent effective adjustment. And knowledge of how things affect each other. Both cost $$

/\/\ the other poster is correct, there are different ways to achieve the same thing and knowledge of what worked on one car must be tempered with what the car was really setup for and the conditions. This is the whole reason true race suspensions have such a range of adjustment and options. To find a way to get the car to handle for that particular application and track or surface if you will and allow the driver to get the best out of the car. And yes sometimes you have to compensate for the driver involved...For example if the driver is not good at trail-braking then you dont want to set the car up so that it has to be tossed and trail-braked to get it to turn in. Other wise the driver is just gonna be slow. and unhappy with what they cant do very well.

You have spent enough time on these forums so you have a good idea of the better parts involved. Ohlins, KW swift springs and sways Whiteline Tanabe FSB etc.

The best info I can give you ....clearly define the use and track targets for the car... If you dont have time to play with settings, then get Robi or Mueller to set the car up ( maybe SMIKE dont know if he does that or if you are local ) Yes that costs money to get Robi out to your track.

Alternatively, get Andrew at GTWorx to help you out and get it spec'd and setup properly.



Then get a driver /coach familiar with the car and setup to coach and help with any car tweaks.

Best regards
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Old Oct 3, 2013, 04:37 PM
  #47  
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Originally Posted by golgo13 View Post


Well, I wasn't expecting a one size fits all solution, but I wish I knew were to start to get a good baseline.

Thinking a good place to start would be an adjustable rear way bar. That will offer you a lighter then stock position, a stock position and then a heavier then stock setting. This will allow you to play a little bit with how the suspension works and not put you in a compromising position. Try that. It gives you t he flexibility to change and provides some options. the bilstien and gxworks springs are a great combo-- I just did the whiteline fsb---thinking about it and driving it, not a whole lot of diff over stock-- maybe this will help. GL
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Old Oct 3, 2013, 09:39 PM
  #48  
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Let me go turn on the Smike signal, maybe he'll jump in here.



Anyway, I'll go talk to some people and see where is a good place to start for some road race upgrades.
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Old Oct 4, 2013, 05:00 PM
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Every time I go to autoX events, I'm reminded how capable an EVO is with minimal mods. There is an IX with stock KYBs and swift springs, camber plates, rear sway bar and as much wheel and tire as he can run in STU and I think that's about it. He's very close to FTD almost every weekend and usually top 3-4 PAX. We have 4-5 national champions that are part of or region so we aren't overwhelmingly slow or anything.

It's truly impressive how fast such a simple car can be with a person driving the hell out of it. I'd love to buy a stock IX and spend a year or two in it just tracking the hell out of it.

I have a BMW that I autox that I just did a full suspension setup in. I swear to god, it was faster on the stock suspension simply because of how comfortable I was with it. I'm sure after a couple events to sort everything, that will change greatly, but right now, driver confidence is everything.
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Old Oct 6, 2013, 11:18 AM
  #50  
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Originally Posted by 03whitegsr View Post
I swear to god, it was faster on the stock suspension simply because of how comfortable I was with it. I'm sure after a couple events to sort everything, that will change greatly, but right now, driver confidence is everything.
^^^
I think this is it ultimately.

With regard to the FSB on the other hand I think Robi is one of the top guys for suspension set-up. I got his springs and hard bushing kit w/ RCK and Perrin steering precision kit and that stuff is great.

Robi also recommended a heavier rear bar. I didn't go for it. After an ACD flash and a TRE Max-lock I am happy that I didn't do the rear bar and I am contemplating installing a FSB - I have one under my bench. I think it will allow me to get on the throttle earlier, harder and ultimately longer because I will feel more comfortable with the car that way. It has worked for me in other cars. But until I do put it in I won't know.

Certainly one guy on the board posted that at Laguna he could keep his foot in it after putting in a FSB, whereas he felt the need to lift before.

Yet there are many different ways to set up a car that will work for different drivers, different preps and different applications/tracks ... ultimately it is the whole package that matters ...
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Old Oct 6, 2013, 02:47 PM
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Originally Posted by alleggerita View Post
^^^
I think this is it ultimately.

With regard to the FSB on the other hand I think Robi is one of the top guys for suspension set-up. I got his springs and hard bushing kit w/ RCK and Perrin steering precision kit and that stuff is great.

Robi also recommended a heavier rear bar. I didn't go for it. After an ACD flash and a TRE Max-lock I am happy that I didn't do the rear bar and I am contemplating installing a FSB - I have one under my bench. I think it will allow me to get on the throttle earlier, harder and ultimately longer because I will feel more comfortable with the car that way. It has worked for me in other cars. But until I do put it in I won't know.

Certainly one guy on the board posted that at Laguna he could keep his foot in it after putting in a FSB, whereas he felt the need to lift before.

Yet there are many different ways to set up a car that will work for different drivers, different preps and different applications/tracks ... ultimately it is the whole package that matters ...

Do it.
I have a TRE max lock, ACD Race Flash, Robispec springs, oem kyb, and star specs, and a tanabe fsb. Before, with the stock fsb I would have to lift off the throttle a the S turn in the back stretch at Thunderhill. I would have to almost be at 2nd gear and start to get on the throttle towards the middle end of it. There was also long sweeper that I would start to get too much rear bias and rear end would just start coming out and I would have to lift off the throttle to keep the grip on the front end.

I installed the Tanabe fsb and went back to the track the following month with nothing else changed, boy what a difference. That sweeper I was now able to take with my foot planted down and the car would stay really neutral. The S turn I mentioned I could take in the top of 3rd gear now with no issues. 4th gear seemed like a bit much so maybe I actually need more rpm now for that turn.

.
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Old Oct 7, 2013, 05:33 AM
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What's the question?
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Old Oct 7, 2013, 06:07 AM
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Smike to the rescue!!
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Old Oct 7, 2013, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Smike View Post
What's the question?
My Smike signal worked!



So, my thread jack question was:

What's a good suspension upgrade path?

I have no idea where to go next with my set-up.
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Old Mar 31, 2016, 01:30 PM
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Old Apr 5, 2016, 06:40 AM
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got mine in the mail yesterday! looks good, but id on't like that the ends are welded on
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Old Apr 5, 2016, 07:24 AM
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Wondering why you felt it necessary to uprate the FSB

I have spoken w/many EVO track guys including 2 very serious EVO susp shops (Robi / Mueller) who note, uprating the FSB is a performance negative on our EVO's

The idea behind their opinion is AWD's need to have all 4 wheels firmly planted when cornering. Uprating the FSB (especially w/higher rate performance springs) will cause inside wheel lift during hard corning
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Old Apr 5, 2016, 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by MinusPrevious View Post
Wondering why you felt it necessary to uprate the FSB

I have spoken w/many EVO track guys including 2 very serious EVO susp shops (Robi / Mueller) who note, uprating the FSB is a performance negative on our EVO's

The idea behind their opinion is AWD's need to have all 4 wheels firmly planted when cornering. Uprating the FSB (especially w/higher rate performance springs) will cause inside wheel lift during hard corning
I have never seen an evo lift the front wheel - I'm running 8k/10k, various bushings, WL RSB (on soft), ohlins, cusco 1.5way RS rear diff, ER ACD tune, and street tires - my car lifts the inside REAR wheel on turns in autox, I'm very loose (rear comes out) on lift, and the rear comes out in a controlled manner on power. On track, with the same setup minus the FSB, the car was fairly neutral on warm tires and oversteering (not on power) on cold tires.

There's a pretty good FSB thread on here that goes over some of the benefits of a FSB.

here it is:

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...de-evo-ix.html

Last edited by kyoo; Apr 5, 2016 at 07:55 AM.
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Old Apr 5, 2016, 08:15 AM
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Yeah, Was involved in the debate on that thread

My inside rear used to lift until I had a set of C/o's made for my driving style. No droop springs needed 10K / 12K (Swifts)

You are already running a high rate spring pkg. The old saying goes: Soft springs w/big sways or big springs w/ soft sways. Cant have it both ways / one or the other
Ive seen inside lift on EVO's. Its a known performance neg

Anyway, Its all good. Youll get first hand experience to see if it works for you
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Old Apr 5, 2016, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by MinusPrevious View Post
Yeah, Was involved in the debate on that thread

My inside rear used to lift until I had a set of C/o's made for my driving style. No droop springs needed 10K / 12K (Swifts)

You are already running a high rate spring pkg. The old saying goes: Soft springs w/big sways or big springs w/ soft sways. Cant have it both ways / one or the other
Ive seen inside lift on EVO's. Its a known performance neg

Anyway, Its all good. Youll get first hand experience to see if it works for you
thanks - I'm reviewing it as we speak. one nice thing: I'll be driving the evo this weekend with the setup as-is (except for superpro bushings being installed), and fresh re71rs. I'll see how the car behaves - if it's perfect, then maybe I won't do it. but if it's still a little loosey-goosey on these lifts (slaloms are scary - car feels like it'll bite at any moment) then i'll put on the bar. so between races, the only change will be the fsb, except for the clutch which is being serviced, which is why I'm doing the FSB.
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