Notices
Evo X Engine Management / Tuning Forums Discuss the major engine management systems.

How does the ECU determine load?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Jan 10, 2009 | 07:08 PM
  #16  
mrfred's Avatar
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (50)
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,675
Likes: 132
From: Tri-Cities, WA // Portland, OR
Originally Posted by madcows
I'm not trying to get into a product discussion/argument, but since the ZChip modifies the MAP signal to change performance, wouldn't that mean the MAP sensor must be doing more than what you described?
Hmm, in looking at the Z-chip webpage, they do apparently tweak the MAP sensor signal to affect performance. I guess the MAP sensor does play a role. I'll have make that a priority in my examination of the Evo X ROM.
Reply
Old Jan 10, 2009 | 08:18 PM
  #17  
madcows's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 662
Likes: 0
From: michigan
Originally Posted by mrfred
Hmm, in looking at the Z-chip webpage, they do apparently tweak the MAP sensor signal to affect performance. I guess the MAP sensor does play a role. I'll have make that a priority in my examination of the Evo X ROM.
While I'm no assembly language pro, if there is any way I could help out in this process, I'd be more than happy to. I'm personally really interested in the relationship between the ECU and the SST on the MRs/Ralliarts.
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 02:10 AM
  #18  
madcows's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 662
Likes: 0
From: michigan
Originally Posted by mrfred
Hmm, in looking at the Z-chip webpage, they do apparently tweak the MAP sensor signal to affect performance. I guess the MAP sensor does play a role. I'll have make that a priority in my examination of the Evo X ROM.

I'd imagine the MAP sensor is used to measure boost in the plenum, and therefore give the ECU the info it needs to regulate the turbo wastegate. You agree?
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 02:34 AM
  #19  
SiC's Avatar
SiC
Evolved Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,018
Likes: 0
From: Kanagawa, Japan
Originally Posted by madcows
I'd imagine the MAP sensor is used to measure boost in the plenum, and therefore give the ECU the info it needs to regulate the turbo wastegate. You agree?
Not actually, the wastegate duty cycles are adjusted in accordance with load and RPM. It doesn't take MAP readings to adjust the boost control solenoids.
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 10:50 AM
  #20  
madcows's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 662
Likes: 0
From: michigan
Originally Posted by SiC
Not actually, the wastegate duty cycles are adjusted in accordance with load and RPM. It doesn't take MAP readings to adjust the boost control solenoids.
Wouldn't it use load and RPM to determine the necessary amount of boost, and then use the MAP to verify the boost?

I don't see how it could be a good idea to indirectly measure boost.
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 12:02 PM
  #21  
GST Motorsports's Avatar
Account Disabled
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,366
Likes: 2
From: Hayward
Originally Posted by madcows
Wouldn't it use load and RPM to determine the necessary amount of boost, and then use the MAP to verify the boost?

I don't see how it could be a good idea to indirectly measure boost.
Mitsu has a history of doing odd things with their boost control systems.

On the 8/9 boost load from the factory follows a load that changes with temp. It will give you more boost when its warmer and less when it is cooler, until you change the load address it follows.

mrfred did write a patch that allowed the 8/9 to use PSI-target boost (using the 3 bar map sensor) instead of using Load-target boost. I'm sure that will happen again with the 10. Right mrfred.

On the 10 there is a very large MAP reference table that the 8/9 does not have. I would assume it is a check reference table or something, I am sure mrfred/gunzo will find out soon enough.
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 12:31 PM
  #22  
mrfred's Avatar
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (50)
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 9,675
Likes: 132
From: Tri-Cities, WA // Portland, OR
Originally Posted by GST Motorsports
...

mrfred did write a patch that allowed the 8/9 to use PSI-target boost (using the 3 bar map sensor) instead of using Load-target boost. I'm sure that will happen again with the 10. Right mrfred.

On the 10 there is a very large MAP reference table that the 8/9 does not have. I would assume it is a check reference table or something, I am sure mrfred/gunzo will find out soon enough.
Evo X direct boost patch? What's that?

Do you have an address for the large MAP reference table for any of the Evo X ROMs?
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 12:42 PM
  #23  
GST Motorsports's Avatar
Account Disabled
iTrader: (8)
 
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 3,366
Likes: 2
From: Hayward
Originally Posted by mrfred
Evo X direct boost patch? What's that?
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 03:38 PM
  #24  
gunzo's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,328
Likes: 0
From: Somewhere
Originally Posted by mrfred
Evo X direct boost patch? What's that?

Do you have an address for the large MAP reference table for any of the Evo X ROMs?
0x60454 for the table .. you should be able to jump in from the pointer to the subroutine ..

Its a 16bit table ..
Reply
Old Jan 11, 2009 | 08:46 PM
  #25  
madcows's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolved Member
 
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 662
Likes: 0
From: michigan
Originally Posted by GST Motorsports
Mitsu has a history of doing odd things with their boost control systems.

On the 8/9 boost load from the factory follows a load that changes with temp. It will give you more boost when its warmer and less when it is cooler, until you change the load address it follows.

mrfred did write a patch that allowed the 8/9 to use PSI-target boost (using the 3 bar map sensor) instead of using Load-target boost. I'm sure that will happen again with the 10. Right mrfred.

On the 10 there is a very large MAP reference table that the 8/9 does not have. I would assume it is a check reference table or something, I am sure mrfred/gunzo will find out soon enough.

It does make sense to provide more boost in the summer than in the winter in order to keep power output consistent throughout the seasons, though it may be less efficient due to higher intake charge temps (has to cut timing, or give more fuel).

Do any of you think it might be possible that the rich mixture throughout the fuel maps is due to mitsu being "better safe than sorry" should their car be driven on very hot days?

I was also wondering if it was possible that mitsu might be opening the throttle all the way on cruise, and use the wastegate to maintain a specific airflow. The benefit would be less stress on the turbo (and since it would be spinning slower, the charge would be cooler as well). The big negative here would be sluggish immediate throttle response because the turbo would have to spool up further (not a big deal when cruising, right?). I don't know. Just a thought.
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
djd24
ECU Flash
16
Mar 19, 2007 07:50 PM
djd24
ECU Flash
13
Sep 25, 2006 07:35 PM
C6C6CH3vo
ECU Flash
153
Sep 17, 2006 06:55 AM
Noogles
ECU Flash
65
Jun 16, 2006 10:24 AM
blk-majik
04-06 Ralliart Engine/Drivetrain
3
Aug 8, 2004 05:09 PM




All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:14 PM.