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Removing Pill

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Old Aug 14, 2009 | 05:52 PM
  #31  
nj1266's Avatar
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Originally Posted by COBB Tuning
The reason we do not simply turn up WGDC (wastegate duty cycle) is two fold. First, you don't want to max out the boost control system to hit your target. The reason for this is that if your system goes to 100% (static) there is no longer any control, we like to keep a buffer in place so that the boost control system can function in both directions.
But Mitsu sets the fine WGDC table at 100% at 70-80% WOT. They do that on the Evo X and they did that on the Evo 8-9. Are they wrong in doing that?

I do understand that in the Subie world the WGDC is limited to 90%. That is what it reads when I look at the WGD Limit Max table. It is set at 90%. Is that where this idea comes from?

It may be that in some instances you might need more duty cycle for given ambient conditions. To this end, it is more beneficial to mechanically alter the system by increasing or decreasing the size of the orifice in the restrictor pills, or by removing them completely. This allows you to keep some buffer in the system and still reach your boost targets.
So your saying that removing the pill is optional. Because in this thread there are two cobb stage two OTS users who removed the pill and had boost spikes. There is another thread in the turbo section of one of your customers with overboosting issues when he removed the pill.

Is there anyway that you can reflect that on Cobb's website? Maybe say that it is optional rather than required.

Secondly, just becuase you increase duty cycle, the car may not increase boost pressure. Since the EVOX uses load targets, if the car is hitting is desired load targets, it may not try to increase boost pressure.
Let me ask you a question since we are on the subject of the Evo X's boost control system.

In most of your 93 octane stage 2 maps, the boost target is set at 252+100 offset = 352. Now two issues arise out of this:

1. In your Access Tuner Race help file you state that the values in the boost traget tables A-C is limited to 191:

"The desired boost can be increased by increasing the value in tables A-C. However, the values in these table are limited to 191. The actual Target boost = target boost + boost control offset. For example. If the target in the boost map is 190 and the boost control offset is 130 the final target boost is 320."

So my first question is why set the number at 252 when the actual limit is 191. The actual limit is really 159 as HB Speed explained it in another thread. But let us say the limit is 191, then why set it at 252. Is that just a quirk in the software?

2. Even if the limit is 191, the boost target becomes 191+100= 291. Is it possible to hit that high a load on stage 2 maps? I have logged several stage two Evos and they usually hit between 250-260 at peak load/boost, but that is at sea level. Did you log higher than that at higher altitude?

Thanks for respondin to my questions. Much appreciated.
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Old Aug 31, 2009 | 05:27 AM
  #32  
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update: I got my TBE on this weekend and am using the stage 2 93 octane map. i am noticeably down on power compared to my perrin stage 1 tune. i haven't removed the pill but i am suspecting i am not hitting the boost targets. gotta take some logs first though.

i didn't know if cobb or whoever would find this informative as there are noted variations in the bcs.
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Old Dec 30, 2009 | 06:32 AM
  #33  
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Can someone tell me in a dual solenoid system where the pills are? Simply put a red dot on this pic

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Old Jan 1, 2010 | 02:49 AM
  #34  
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At least let me know if the reactive solenoid is the upper or the lower
Is this image OK?


Last edited by eTiLiKo; Jan 1, 2010 at 04:39 AM.
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Old Jan 1, 2010 | 06:22 AM
  #35  
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Click on "instructions" in one of the Stage 2 Cobb maps listed below for pill removal.

http://www.accessecu.com/accessport/.../EVOXMaps.html
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Old Jan 1, 2010 | 06:57 AM
  #36  
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The top one is the wastegate solenoid per the service manual section 15-5. Where did you get that pic? Did you take it or get it somewhere else?
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Old Jan 1, 2010 | 11:21 AM
  #37  
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Found here on evom
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Old Jan 2, 2010 | 01:06 PM
  #38  
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Has anyone reinstalled the pill? And if so what direction does it go in? The stock boost pill has one side bigger than the other. Or it doesn't matter?
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