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Need some opinions and thoughts about issues......

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Old Nov 29, 2009 | 12:56 AM
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Need some opinions and thoughts about issues......

Well here's a break down of what happened......

Had the car tuned and ran into a problem where the car over boosted due to melting some hoses for the wastegates.
Once that happened we did a compression test and got 0 on cylinder #4. Once we took apart the motor we noticed there was a very small chunk taken out of the head and block.
A brand new short block was purchased from the dealer. The head was welded professionally and sent out to a machine shop to have resurfaced and checked. At that time head was returned all fixed up and tripled checked for any problems.
Motor was then assembled and installed back into the car. Once motor was in the car and together, it started with no problem. Once the car was started, we left it idling for about 2 hrs or so and everything was good and sounded good.
The following day the car was told to get tuned (note also, block at this point has never ran besides idling) once on the dyno and tuning on low boost car sounded great..... Once getting into the higher psi which I believe was about 15-20psi the first thing that happened and noticed was the oil dip stick was pushed out. Once that was noticed, we also noticed a very loud and noticeable tick coming from the head.

So what I am asking according to the above story, what would anyone think would cause the dip stick to get pushed out?

As for the head, we have not removed it yet, but when clearance was checked, all that was said was there was way too much clearance. So what may have caused that?


Haven't been able to have the car checked yet, so would like to get some thoughts on these issues.
Also the motor itself is stock, with only the Kelford 214-B cams and valve springs.
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Old Nov 29, 2009 | 01:17 AM
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Well inorder for the dip stick to get pushed out the pressure in the crank case has to be above ambient pressure. Basicly is sounds like your getting alot of blow by into the crank case or your not getting any EVAP. You know that hose thats on your valve cover. its supposed to have a check valve or something in the hose that allows gases to vent from the crank case but not allow boost into your head. I'd check that hose first. Then if thats not the problem check your piston rings. If neither of them are the problem, check anything that could cause pressure in he crank case.
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Old Nov 29, 2009 | 01:42 AM
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Originally Posted by H Jensen
Well inorder for the dip stick to get pushed out the pressure in the crank case has to be above ambient pressure. Basicly is sounds like your getting alot of blow by into the crank case or your not getting any EVAP. You know that hose thats on your valve cover. its supposed to have a check valve or something in the hose that allows gases to vent from the crank case but not allow boost into your head. I'd check that hose first. Then if thats not the problem check your piston rings. If neither of them are the problem, check anything that could cause pressure in he crank case.
Well one thing that someone did mention to me was, that since the block is brand new and using synthetic oil, the rings have not seat probably and that is causing too much crank case pressure. Does that sound like something that can be happening???
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Old Nov 29, 2009 | 08:17 AM
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You are facing 2 problems.

Too much blow by. The rings have not broken in yet. Drive on the highway and don't baby the car but also don't molest her.. Stay at 65 mph and do a short burst upto 90mph for a minute and slow back down to 65. Do this for about a 100 miles.

Change your oil and oil filter after 100 miles.

Go out for another 1 hour drive. Check compression after that. Remember, crank more than 3 times.

The tick you heard is probably a valve tap. I had an audi come into my shop and it had a ticking noise every second. Opened up the head and found 2 valves bent. The car had an oil leak and when I checked the dip stick, it was totally dry. Dunno how but his motor did not die.
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Old Nov 29, 2009 | 08:44 AM
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Have you modified the PCV system in any way?
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Old Dec 1, 2009 | 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by prodigy1210
You are facing 2 problems.

Too much blow by. The rings have not broken in yet. Drive on the highway and don't baby the car but also don't molest her.. Stay at 65 mph and do a short burst upto 90mph for a minute and slow back down to 65. Do this for about a 100 miles.

Change your oil and oil filter after 100 miles.

Go out for another 1 hour drive. Check compression after that. Remember, crank more than 3 times.

The tick you heard is probably a valve tap. I had an audi come into my shop and it had a ticking noise every second. Opened up the head and found 2 valves bent. The car had an oil leak and when I checked the dip stick, it was totally dry. Dunno how but his motor did not die.
Yea this time around we are going to try and put some miles on the car before we return to tune, to break it in properly. We just got to take the head off first and find out whats wrong, so it can be fixed.

Originally Posted by AutoXer
Have you modified the PCV system in any way?
I'm about 95% sure we did not.
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Old Dec 7, 2009 | 07:03 PM
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Okay, well....... problem has turned out to be A LOT worse then even expected. Now we are trying to find out what can have caused this to happen, since motor was purchased from the dealer brand new, installed and taken to the dyno to tune.
Here are pics of the damage that happened to the block once the head was removed......






















Besides the damage pictured to the block, after sending the head out to get checked, there was 1 bent exhaust valve, besides that the head checked out good. The pieces that were broken off the piston made its way into my turbo which damaged the turbine, so now that has to be sent out to be repaired as well.

What can anyone think caused this?
I had someone tell me that they think, maybe the block came with some manufacture defect or something, cause they have never seen the damage caused to the pistons happen in almost identical spots.
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Old Dec 7, 2009 | 07:40 PM
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more than one cylinder??? you probably have a case of major detonation..perhaps you should revert to a stock tune for a little while.
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Old Dec 8, 2009 | 06:23 AM
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Originally Posted by mike100
more than one cylinder??? you probably have a case of major detonation..perhaps you should revert to a stock tune for a little while.
Yes, I think those are cylinder 3 & 4. Well car was not driven at all after it was put back together this time. Only time it was driven was on the dyno, then had the problem I mentioned in the first post, and now that we took it apart this is all the damage I find.
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Old Dec 8, 2009 | 07:11 AM
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Ring gaps butting together causing them to chunk the top of the piston. This is due to a lean condition.
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Old Dec 8, 2009 | 02:00 PM
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Well still really curious as to what caused this, but so far I contacted the dealer and have agreed to at least take a look at it once I can bring in the block.
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Old Dec 11, 2009 | 10:37 PM
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Still haven't been able to get the block over to the dealer that sold it to me, but now I am a bit curious and trying to get other people's thoughts.

I had a machinist, and 3 shop owners look at the damage and give me there thought on what they think of the damage and I was really surprised that all of them said they think that this is something to do with a defect in the piston casting or something.

What do you guys think of that?
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Old Dec 11, 2009 | 11:05 PM
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I've read that the stock pistons can have issues with the ring land gaps being too tight and higher boost can cause them to do this type of damage. Do some searches and you will see what I mean.

I'm somewhat confused with idling the car for 2 hrs? I would have checked for leaks and at least done a light load drive. Usually I've read people breaking in the cars with regular oil for a few hundred miles so that the rings seat properly and make the engine see some moderate boost and different RPM's, just avoid 6k+. Then switch to synthetic after and get the car tuned for max power. You should also verify the crankcase breather line off the driver side of the car is not crimped or blocked somehow.

Let us know what you find!
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Old Dec 11, 2009 | 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Hiboost
I've read that the stock pistons can have issues with the ring land gaps being too tight and higher boost can cause them to do this type of damage. Do some searches and you will see what I mean.

I'm somewhat confused with idling the car for 2 hrs? I would have checked for leaks and at least done a light load drive. Usually I've read people breaking in the cars with regular oil for a few hundred miles so that the rings seat properly and make the engine see some moderate boost and different RPM's, just avoid 6k+. Then switch to synthetic after and get the car tuned for max power. You should also verify the crankcase breather line off the driver side of the car is not crimped or blocked somehow.

Let us know what you find!
Thank you for your post, will be trying to find some more info on what you mentioned above.
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Old Dec 27, 2009 | 03:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Hiboost
I've read that the stock pistons can have issues with the ring land gaps being too tight and higher boost can cause them to do this type of damage. Do some searches and you will see what I mean.

I'm somewhat confused with idling the car for 2 hrs? I would have checked for leaks and at least done a light load drive. Usually I've read people breaking in the cars with regular oil for a few hundred miles so that the rings seat properly and make the engine see some moderate boost and different RPM's, just avoid 6k+. Then switch to synthetic after and get the car tuned for max power. You should also verify the crankcase breather line off the driver side of the car is not crimped or blocked somehow.

Let us know what you find!
+1
Here is the similar issue

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...sfiring-2.html
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