IX vs Spec C
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The issue runs deeper than lap times. There have been other Spec C vs. Evo comparisons and the odd thing is that the Spec C is not only faster, but is more involving and fun to drive. It has even better turn in and less understeer. The reason this is odd is that these are the same attributes that magazines give to the evo in the states because the US STI understeers and isn't nearly as sharp as the Evo. It's also odd because subaru even recently made a non US sti (WR1) that was blasted for the same problems the US sti has (understeer). So it seems Subaru is capable of building a car that's sharper and more fun than the evo, yet for some reason they keep making ones that aren't. There's no need for US evo owners to worry though because it seems that no "good" sti will ever make it to the states (good handling wise). This is of central interest to me since I'd use an STI/evo as a track day car and good turn in is imperative.
understeer and oversteer + alignment and camber plates and good suspension setup = exactly however much "turn in" you want, just.. fyi, i've been in my Evo, and I've been in an STi with SERIOUS handling mods, and they both feel almost exactly the same, except his steering wheel is twice the size of mine. Oh, I've got coilovers and an alignment
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Joined: Sep 2002
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From: Miami, FL
Originally Posted by burningmoney97
still seems open to me 
The thing is:
1. The Evo and Sti are really very close competitors, and can both be tuned to rediculous levels of performance.
2. we are neither getting the spec C nor the FQ400 !
So what's the point of comparing these cars when we are dealing with more of a personal preferance issue?
Most people have a bias and faced with a choice will get the one they prefer and dial in the mods they want if stock is not enough.
... This thread ought to be retired.
Originally Posted by Yargk
The issue runs deeper than lap times. There have been other Spec C vs. Evo comparisons and the odd thing is that the Spec C is not only faster, but is more involving and fun to drive. It has even better turn in and less understeer. The reason this is odd is that these are the same attributes that magazines give to the evo in the states because the US STI understeers and isn't nearly as sharp as the Evo. It's also odd because subaru even recently made a non US sti (WR1) that was blasted for the same problems the US sti has (understeer). So it seems Subaru is capable of building a car that's sharper and more fun than the evo, yet for some reason they keep making ones that aren't. There's no need for US evo owners to worry though because it seems that no "good" sti will ever make it to the states (good handling wise). This is of central interest to me since I'd use an STI/evo as a track day car and good turn in is imperative.
BTW UT EVO the non-Spec C's understeer problems cannot be truely fixed with 'camber plates and coilovers' because the issue is caused by geometry issues outside of the suspension goodies influence. You can make them handle better but to fix it you have to by all the Spec C stuff including subframe, control arms and steering rack etc. etc.
Last edited by chronohunter; Apr 17, 2005 at 09:24 PM.
Originally Posted by Turbo-Ron
Unfortunately ...
The thing is:
1. The Evo and Sti are really very close competitors, and can both be tuned to rediculous levels of performance.
2. we are neither getting the spec C nor the FQ400 !
So what's the point of comparing these cars when we are dealing with more of a personal preferance issue?
Most people have a bias and faced with a choice will get the one they prefer and dial in the mods they want if stock is not enough.
... This thread ought to be retired.
The thing is:
1. The Evo and Sti are really very close competitors, and can both be tuned to rediculous levels of performance.
2. we are neither getting the spec C nor the FQ400 !
So what's the point of comparing these cars when we are dealing with more of a personal preferance issue?
Most people have a bias and faced with a choice will get the one they prefer and dial in the mods they want if stock is not enough.
... This thread ought to be retired.
Originally Posted by chronohunter
nice post, and dead on
BTW UT EVO the non-Spec C's understeer problems cannot be truely fixed with 'camber plates and coilovers' because the issue is caused by geometry issues outside of the suspension goodies influence. You can make them handle better but to fix it you have to by all the Spec C stuff including subframe, control arms and steering rack etc. etc.
BTW UT EVO the non-Spec C's understeer problems cannot be truely fixed with 'camber plates and coilovers' because the issue is caused by geometry issues outside of the suspension goodies influence. You can make them handle better but to fix it you have to by all the Spec C stuff including subframe, control arms and steering rack etc. etc.
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Joined: Jul 2003
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Originally Posted by chronohunter
nice post, and dead on
BTW UT EVO the non-Spec C's understeer problems cannot be truely fixed with 'camber plates and coilovers' because the issue is caused by geometry issues outside of the suspension goodies influence. You can make them handle better but to fix it you have to by all the Spec C stuff including subframe, control arms and steering rack etc. etc.
BTW UT EVO the non-Spec C's understeer problems cannot be truely fixed with 'camber plates and coilovers' because the issue is caused by geometry issues outside of the suspension goodies influence. You can make them handle better but to fix it you have to by all the Spec C stuff including subframe, control arms and steering rack etc. etc.
One thing that really hinders the US STi is the "keep it shiny side up despite the ****** drivers" alignment. Little to no camber in front, plenty of camber in the rear, and running the rear tires with just about perfect ammount of air to maximize grip. So front grip is minimized, while the rear grip is maximized as far as alignment goes. Try putting in -1.7 to -2.0 camber in front, and raising the rear airpressure to 40psi "warm". It has NO understeer unless you complete fail to know how to drive.
Oh and BTW the FQxxx series of cars are ALL modified with aftermarket parts by Ralliart. Should we compare the normal EVO over there to the Litchfield Type25 and call it "fair"?
Originally Posted by XT6Wagon
The USDM STi is effectively a Spec-C with normal STi interior and comfort features.
One thing that really hinders the US STi is the "keep it shiny side up despite the ****** drivers" alignment. Little to no camber in front, plenty of camber in the rear, and running the rear tires with just about perfect ammount of air to maximize grip. So front grip is minimized, while the rear grip is maximized as far as alignment goes. Try putting in -1.7 to -2.0 camber in front, and raising the rear airpressure to 40psi "warm". It has NO understeer unless you complete fail to know how to drive.
Oh and BTW the FQxxx series of cars are ALL modified with aftermarket parts by Ralliart. Should we compare the normal EVO over there to the Litchfield Type25 and call it "fair"?
One thing that really hinders the US STi is the "keep it shiny side up despite the ****** drivers" alignment. Little to no camber in front, plenty of camber in the rear, and running the rear tires with just about perfect ammount of air to maximize grip. So front grip is minimized, while the rear grip is maximized as far as alignment goes. Try putting in -1.7 to -2.0 camber in front, and raising the rear airpressure to 40psi "warm". It has NO understeer unless you complete fail to know how to drive.
Oh and BTW the FQxxx series of cars are ALL modified with aftermarket parts by Ralliart. Should we compare the normal EVO over there to the Litchfield Type25 and call it "fair"?
)
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Joined: Jul 2003
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What differences... Seriously. Only one I know of is we don't get the bar in the trunk to stiffen the suspension, and the front strut tower brace.
And sorry but the EVO isn't all that. There are more than a few weaknesses that the STi can exploit on many tracks to flat waste a EVO. Of course the EVO has its advantages too... so you can find tracks that suit it.
And sorry but the EVO isn't all that. There are more than a few weaknesses that the STi can exploit on many tracks to flat waste a EVO. Of course the EVO has its advantages too... so you can find tracks that suit it.
Originally Posted by Late Apex
correct me if im wrong but isnt the Spec-C the "best" sti? Their best performer?
Why dont they compare it to the FQ400 then? Why just a regular 9?
Why dont they compare it to the FQ400 then? Why just a regular 9?
The Spec C limited is equipped with power window, center door locks, electric powered door mirrors, manual air conditioner, exclusive seats cloth, off black center panel & venti rater grille, black door trim, leather wrapped shift brake lever & plating button, red meter, REV indicator, and sports pedals with aluminum pad.
thanks to the material used in its construction, boasts a notable torsion resistance and lightness (the IMPREZZA spec C prepared by TOP RUNhas reduced its weight by 90 kg with respect to the STI 2004).
http://forums.livingwithstyle.com/ar...p/t-93396.html
thanks to the material used in its construction, boasts a notable torsion resistance and lightness (the IMPREZZA spec C prepared by TOP RUNhas reduced its weight by 90 kg with respect to the STI 2004).
http://forums.livingwithstyle.com/ar...p/t-93396.html
Fuji Heavy Industries Applies to the FIA for Group N Homologation
for the Subaru Impreza WRX STi spec C
Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd. (FHI), a global manufacturer of transportation and aerospace-related products and the maker of Subaru automobiles, today announced that it will submit a homologation application to the Fédération Internationale de lfAutomobile (FIA) for the Subaru Impreza WRX STi spec C to race as a Group N vehicle in 2005*. The application embodies the companyfs plan to position this model as a key competitor in motor sport activities for 2005 and beyond.
To enter FIA-approved racing and rallying championships that take place around the world, cars must be homologated according to the FIA regulations. Group N (production cars) is one of the rally and off-road vehicle groups set forth by the FIA. Defined as large-scale series production touring cars, Group N homologation imposes strict limits on modifications to production models and is known as the category that best reflects the performance inherent to the basic production model.
FHI will produce more than 1,000 units of the Impreza WRX STi spec C during 2004, which is the minimum level of production required for Group N classification, and the company is planning to have the vehicle homologated before the 2005 rally season begins.
Impreza WRX STi has long demonstrated its strengths in Group N class races; in fact, the top three drivers in the 2003 FIA Production Car World Rally Championship (PCWRC) for Group N cars were all driving the Impreza WRX STi. Now lighter and even more suitable for competition than the Impreza WRX STi, the Subaru Impreza WRX STi spec C is packed with new features and is equipped with a higher performance engine.
Major Features of the Impreza WRX STi spec C
E Compared to the Impreza WRX STi, Impreza WRX STi spec C is about 90 kilograms lighter through the adaptation of lighter glass, a trunk lid composed of aluminum, and thinner roof construction.
E A rear crossbar has been fitted to further improve body rigidity.
E The turbocharger in the Impreza WRX STi spec C uses precise ball bearings in the shaft to reduce friction, thereby offering a smooth and speedy turbo boost and providing ideal engine response.
E A large water reservoir for the intercooler water spray as well as an air-cooled engine oil cooler have been implemented to ensure stable engine performance.
* Applicable 17inch tire specification only
http://www.fhi.co.jp/english/news/pr.../04_09_01e.htm
for the Subaru Impreza WRX STi spec C
Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd. (FHI), a global manufacturer of transportation and aerospace-related products and the maker of Subaru automobiles, today announced that it will submit a homologation application to the Fédération Internationale de lfAutomobile (FIA) for the Subaru Impreza WRX STi spec C to race as a Group N vehicle in 2005*. The application embodies the companyfs plan to position this model as a key competitor in motor sport activities for 2005 and beyond.
To enter FIA-approved racing and rallying championships that take place around the world, cars must be homologated according to the FIA regulations. Group N (production cars) is one of the rally and off-road vehicle groups set forth by the FIA. Defined as large-scale series production touring cars, Group N homologation imposes strict limits on modifications to production models and is known as the category that best reflects the performance inherent to the basic production model.
FHI will produce more than 1,000 units of the Impreza WRX STi spec C during 2004, which is the minimum level of production required for Group N classification, and the company is planning to have the vehicle homologated before the 2005 rally season begins.
Impreza WRX STi has long demonstrated its strengths in Group N class races; in fact, the top three drivers in the 2003 FIA Production Car World Rally Championship (PCWRC) for Group N cars were all driving the Impreza WRX STi. Now lighter and even more suitable for competition than the Impreza WRX STi, the Subaru Impreza WRX STi spec C is packed with new features and is equipped with a higher performance engine.
Major Features of the Impreza WRX STi spec C
E Compared to the Impreza WRX STi, Impreza WRX STi spec C is about 90 kilograms lighter through the adaptation of lighter glass, a trunk lid composed of aluminum, and thinner roof construction.
E A rear crossbar has been fitted to further improve body rigidity.
E The turbocharger in the Impreza WRX STi spec C uses precise ball bearings in the shaft to reduce friction, thereby offering a smooth and speedy turbo boost and providing ideal engine response.
E A large water reservoir for the intercooler water spray as well as an air-cooled engine oil cooler have been implemented to ensure stable engine performance.
* Applicable 17inch tire specification only
http://www.fhi.co.jp/english/news/pr.../04_09_01e.htm