denver

iTrader: (9)

I saw the same thing, both high and low the same... and had knock counts between 6 and 10.... I took some timing out where the knocks where and pasted my stock map back in the low octane maps, now it is much better!

nj1266

iTrader: (6)

I had the misfortune of downloading a dynoflash map from an Evo 9. YIKES. Here is the run down of what I found:

This was the timing profile for the car. The car had between 8-15 counts of knock:

RPM----Timing
3000-----7/8
3500-----6
4000----7
4500----7
5000----7/6
5500----8/7
6000----9/8
6500----13 (a jump of 4*)
7000----17 (a jump of 4*)
7500----20 (a jump of 3*)

Not only was the timing too high for 91 octane gas, the timing increase from one rpm row to the other was too much. As a general rule of thumb, timing should not be increased by more that 1-2* between rpm rows. Abrupt timing changes are certain to trigger knock.

The second thing that I noticed in the maps is that the high octane and low octane fuel and timing maps were almost identical. That should not be done. The low octane maps are a “safe harbor” to be used when your car knocks. If an Evo consistently knocks, then the “octane flag” parameter will consistently decrement. As it decrements, the ECU will start using the low octane maps to save the engine from failure due to excessive knock. If the low octane maps are the same or similar to the high octane maps, then the ECU cannot save your engine. The best practice is to either leave the low octane maps alone, or make the fuel map way richer and the timing map way more retarded than the high octane maps.

The third thing that I noted, was that the boost limit was maxed out at 319. This is another poor practice that I have noticed in a lot of maps. At 319, this car had no protection in case of an overboost condition. Granted, overboost conditions rarely happen, but what if it does. Do you really want no protection in case your car overboosts?

I just feel sorry for the guys who are getting their brand new X tuned by him. Since ECUtech is a "closed" system, we have no way to tell what he is doing. Can't wait to get ECUflash for the X so we can discover all the innovations that he came up with.

Mellon Racing

iTrader: (38)

I'm going to play devil's advocate for a moment, not in defense of dynoflash, I'll let him do that for himself but to dispell some common misconceptions.

1. some cars will allow abrupt changes in timing and some will not...there's no hard fast rule that says you should NEVER allow more than a 2* jump, it does not ALWAYS set off knock.

2. even when the low octane fuel/timing maps are matched to the high, the ecu can still adjust fuel/timing, just not as much.

3. 319kpa isn't a cap necessarily, I see 380kpa without fuel cut.

all that being said, what I do on my own car isn't necessarily what I would do on a customers car. I utilize the safety features for my customers as I'm not in the business of buying engines for them, nor do I intend to be

discuss!

nj1266

iTrader: (6)

A general rule of thumb does not ALWAYS apply, but it applies MOST of the time. Running abrupt changes of 3-4* of timing is more likely to trugger knock, than not, especially when dealing with CA 91 octane gas.

It is poor practice to collapse the maps or to make them really similar.

I did not say that it was a logging cap. It is just maxed out in the rom. Moreover, DF disabled the 1000ms timer table that will allow the fuel cut to kick in. So there was no protection whatseover for the engine.

All in all, this is just poor practice on his part and does not even clear the threshold of basica tuning practices that we all use in ECUflash forum.

racer135

iTrader: (2)

Are those the actual timing of the log or the rows. I notice that during a log you may see higher jumps in timing specially at over 6000~6500 rom due to the decrease in load and therefore jumping to the previous colunm (less load) which has a higher timing number. Numbers are not as high as 4 but I have seen 2* jumps.

I guess those are the actual row values since it looks like a block tune. How does the logs look. Do they really stay at 6~7 form 3500 to 5500? That timing sounds really high specially when peak load is around 3500.

Mellon Racing

iTrader: (38)

the timing you can run hinges on airflow/octane to name a few things, so to say 6* at 3500 seems high doesn't mean much without knowing the rest of the story.

6* at 3500 might be too much for 26psi on 93 octane for one car but might work fine at 21psi on 93 octane for another car (just examples)

nj1266

iTrader: (6)

The timing map was intended for 91 octane gas. 6* on 91 octane gas @ 3500 is nuts even on stock like boost. Those of us who tune on 91 octane use no more than 2-3* of timing @ 3500. Apparently DF did not get that memo.

nj1266

iTrader: (6)

These are the numbers from the map based on the load cells that the car hits. (1 octane gas is very sensitive to sudden changes in timing advance. You have to make it burn as soon as possible and as quickly as possible. Give it too much timing advance and you will give it time to knock.

6* of timing at peak is nuts on 91 octane gas for a car with a TBE and an intake.

racer135

iTrader: (2)

Thats exactly my point. I am running 2~3 on 93 with 22 psi (sometimes I sea a 23 peak) and I sometimes see a few knockcounts (2 or 3). We are talking pump gas here. Race gas is another story.

sabastian458

iTrader: (25)

ha, hahahaha, hahahahahahaha

Wow, Someone else experianced the DynoFlash tune. Granted there may have been something else that is causing some of the knock. But either way, Switch tuners and be happier. Mellon or 4WS are good, personally I am using Touringbubble to tune mine.

Thegame

iTrader: (26)

I had issues with Dynoflash when I had my VIII. My new tuner showed me some of the old timing maps and there was just a block of 8's like everywhere I looked. I think I actually still have the map.

sabastian458

iTrader: (25)

The words used to describe mine by another tuner, not any that have been mentioned yet in this thread.

"Wow, who tuned this?" tuner

"uh DynoFlash. Why?" me

"Man this looks bad." tuner

"What do you mean?" me

"Parts of this tune are so corrupted that I can not use. The data here is all corrupted. Im going to have to clear it all and start off with 1 of my stock flashes." tuner

"Really? Wow." me

DynoFlash

iTrader: (91)

Feel free to call me 203-515-4110 or PM to review your "WOT feeling numb" condition and se if we can come up with a resolution to your situation.

DynoFlash

iTrader: (91)

Some of the comments in this thread are really just too much.

I have been tuining Evos for 6 (SIX) years now and there are hundreds and hundreds of cars out there with many of the original tunes which were much more basic and simple in design than our current offerings. Back in 03 - 05 we were working with the now antiquated raw hex code editing applications which were the only tools available before ecu flash and ecutek came out. The inherant limitations of those applications then used resulted in many mapping strategies which appear overly crude and simplistic - like the so called "block of 8's " - which by the way was very effective and safe in practice.

In any event, it should be noted that these days and for the past couple of years - I set all low octane timing and fuel maps with seperate more safe mapping than the high octane mapping. Although, the ecu will still pull timing with the maps fixed the same, I have adopted the method of using different maps as of at least 2 years ago. It should be noted that I have never seen any of my customer's cars knock badly enough to transition to the low octane maps.

EVERY car I custom tune is driven on the road extensively to check for knock count activity and no car leaves my hands with any significant knock count number - period.

The base maps I use for mail in reflash program have hundreds of hours of R & D and testing behind them and have proven to be very reliable and safe in years of use and hundreds of thousands of miles of opertaion.

AL

WongFu

iTrader: (9)

Damn im sorry to hear you dont like DynoFlashes map. Before i went AEM EMS i had a map from DF and it ran flawless for a year. Hell Al even gave me the eflash before i payed for it and then i deployed to iraq. To this day ive sent him a few pm's saying im back from iraq and i want to square up with him but no reply back. THanks Al for supporting the troops! Oh about my eflash tune yeah i got counts of knock but i dout it was real knock cause my tuner striped down his tune and said it was alittle on the safe side. I will agree my car felt slower then stock but my track time said diffrent, I dropped .3 seconds of my 1/4 time.