RIPP SDS and Winter Weather
Dec 11, 2005, 10:03 AM
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RIPP SDS and Winter Weather
Well, cold weather has been the preferred topic as of late, ranging from snow tires, to FI kits, to engine management, so I thought I would throw in my experience with RIPP SDS and their blackbox and how it reacts in cold weather:
Winter isn't exactly easy to cope with (engine tuning wise) because depending on where you live, its going to get very dry and very cold, the air is denser, and your ECU has to compensate for it. You read around here alot of threads about people's engine managment screwing up or just becoming real quirky in the winter.
Well, i'm glad to say I have experienced no problems with RIPP's blackbox. In fact, it drives exactly the same as it did in summer (besides the engine itself needing to warm up a little bit). I've driven it through 2 snow storms in Kansas already, and pretty much every other day (and it can get cold here) and I've never had problems with quirky idles, stalling, rpms jumping, etc etc. Hell, I don't even have any trouble starting the car, it drives and behaves exactly the same as stock.
I think this is really because the blackbox is self learning, so it compensates accordingly instead of having a static fuel map to work from year round. I've driven my car in as many climates as possible, ranging from sea level with high humidity, to up in the mountains, to the dry plains of kansas, and the blackbox has learned each climate and adjusts itself, no resetting the ecu or stalling out at all. I've driven to the east coast to the midwest, and I'm going to be making the same trip this winter, which speaks volumes for the reliability of this kit.
Just thought I'd let you guys know (especially the canadian guys, as they seem to have the most trouble with pretuned boxes) that cold weather or any weather, is a non-issue for the blackbox and RIPP's SDS. There is no simpler way to put it other than: the use of superior technology amounts to better usability, drivability, and reliability.
If you guys have any questions, let me know.
Winter isn't exactly easy to cope with (engine tuning wise) because depending on where you live, its going to get very dry and very cold, the air is denser, and your ECU has to compensate for it. You read around here alot of threads about people's engine managment screwing up or just becoming real quirky in the winter.
Well, i'm glad to say I have experienced no problems with RIPP's blackbox. In fact, it drives exactly the same as it did in summer (besides the engine itself needing to warm up a little bit). I've driven it through 2 snow storms in Kansas already, and pretty much every other day (and it can get cold here) and I've never had problems with quirky idles, stalling, rpms jumping, etc etc. Hell, I don't even have any trouble starting the car, it drives and behaves exactly the same as stock.
I think this is really because the blackbox is self learning, so it compensates accordingly instead of having a static fuel map to work from year round. I've driven my car in as many climates as possible, ranging from sea level with high humidity, to up in the mountains, to the dry plains of kansas, and the blackbox has learned each climate and adjusts itself, no resetting the ecu or stalling out at all. I've driven to the east coast to the midwest, and I'm going to be making the same trip this winter, which speaks volumes for the reliability of this kit.
Just thought I'd let you guys know (especially the canadian guys, as they seem to have the most trouble with pretuned boxes) that cold weather or any weather, is a non-issue for the blackbox and RIPP's SDS. There is no simpler way to put it other than: the use of superior technology amounts to better usability, drivability, and reliability.
If you guys have any questions, let me know.
Dec 11, 2005, 11:38 AM
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hey man, not trying to start a war or anything, and I didn't want to hijack any of the other threads, but guys in cold climates are worried about the engine management with the turbo kits, so I wanted to let them know how the SDS is hanging.
Dec 11, 2005, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by akasirlancerlot
i understand. im glad its working nicely.. hey can u pm me with ur thoughts on the benefits of sc over tcing... i want your perspective.
Dec 11, 2005, 05:22 PM
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Dec 11, 2005, 05:30 PM
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yeah, but those sclc kids are sneaky. no offense, but i just know no matter what i said would be taken out of context and used against the war on "green" LOL
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Dec 11, 2005, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by GreenPsycho
hey man, not trying to start a war or anything, and I didn't want to hijack any of the other threads, but guys in cold climates are worried about the engine management with the turbo kits, so I wanted to let them know how the SDS is hanging.
Glad the black box is working out for you.
WADAD
what on earth has you driving all over the world like that?
Dec 11, 2005, 06:04 PM
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i dunno, i like to get around. i guess school and jobs play a big part in it, technically i live in louisiana, go to school in kansas, work in connecticut LOL. I'll settle down someday perhaps
Dec 11, 2005, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by GreenPsycho
...I thought I would throw in my experience with RIPP SDS and their blackbox...
...Winter isn't exactly easy to cope with (engine tuning wise) because depending on where you live, its going to get very dry and very cold, the air is denser, and your ECU has to compensate for it...
...the use of superior technology amounts to better usability, drivability, and reliability...
If you guys have any questions, let me know.
...Winter isn't exactly easy to cope with (engine tuning wise) because depending on where you live, its going to get very dry and very cold, the air is denser, and your ECU has to compensate for it...
...the use of superior technology amounts to better usability, drivability, and reliability...
If you guys have any questions, let me know.
-What exact experience do you have with RIPP SDS blackbox? Did you see the map? Do you know what it controls? How do you know it compensates for cold weather?
-Why do you think winter isn't easy to cope with engine tuning? Does air fuel ratio changes? I always tought a colder/denser air would give you more room to play with, why do you think it's bad for ECU to compensate for it, I thought your blackbox would be responsible for it?
-Superior technology? Belt driven compressor + piggyback (black box) + fuel managment = superior technology??? Please be more clear.
-Drivability? A lot of people think SDS people have a lot of traction problems in the winter, do you? What's better about drivability then N/A or FI?
I know it's a lot but I hope you will be able to provide clear and detailed answers to my questions. There is no catch and I hope you will not find this offensive.
Dec 11, 2005, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by GreenPsycho
LOL, why do I suspect a trap? Hmmmmm
well my friend i am in sclc and i am a dick face ill be the first to tell you but i want to understand the the process of the kit and in your opinion the pros and cons.. as well as ur thoughts on the service at ripp... i will most likely go turbo, whether it be rpw or rrm but im open.
no trap here, unless you make things get out of hand. Like ive said i have no problems with you personally i just happen to be good friends with the rrm guys, they take care of sclc and are a great company. I don't know too much about ripp and i would like to know more now.
common greenie.
Dec 12, 2005, 12:12 AM
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Originally Posted by gregivq
Here are my questions (I'm not looking for any war, or catches, just answer it):
-What exact experience do you have with RIPP SDS blackbox? Did you see the map? Do you know what it controls? How do you know it compensates for cold weather?
I have a little experience with the blackbox. I helped RIPP wire it up one day while I was down there, I took it off nextgen's car, i've read about it and I know what ross told me. to be honest, i think ross is the only one with enough knowledge about it to talk about the blackbox in great detail, but i'll give it a shot. I did see the map, in fact its a neat little piece of software ross was using, pretty straight forward. I didn't understand too much of it cause he was moving pretty quickly, but he showed me how he street tune.
it basically controls the fuel, but not just the injectors, because of RIPP's supplimental injection system, it controls the atomizing injector along with the inline fuel pump. On top of that, it senses boost, and at 6-7 pounds (if your stg2) it will kick in the boost cooler to spray the methanol. As for how it compensates for cold weather, it functions alot like your stock ecu cause it has the ability to learn certain conditions (humidty, pressure ie altitude, temperature, and adjust accordingly. I'm not sure how it does this, but it uses all the signals the stock ecu does (not just maf, but o2, etc). I've been told it can even self tune for crappy gas like 89 and what not just in case. Like i said, its not a fixed, static map that "this much fuel must be added in at this rpm" but its more dynamic and flexible than that, just like your stock ecu. there are certain perameters it should remain in no matter the weather, and it does everything in its power to do so
-Why do you think winter isn't easy to cope with engine tuning? Does air fuel ratio changes? I always tought a colder/denser air would give you more room to play with, why do you think it's bad for ECU to compensate for it, I thought your blackbox would be responsible for it?
Winter changes alot and if you notice, its different everyday in winter. When its snowing it can be really humid (duh) but other days its remarkable dry. But its not just the changing humidity levels and of course cold air, but the density of the air. Cold air is denser than hot air, which means you are cramming alot more oxygen into your engine than your normally would be on a dry summer day. I remember nextgen telling me he was boosting 11psi during days in the fall/winter, but at nights he would be pushing 15psi or so, just because of the colder denser air. Now there is alot more to it (and more scientific than what I described) but its just hard to compensate for.
Yes, the stock ecu does learn winter conditions and adjusts accordingly so the car runs, that is why we can drive in winter, unlike many rx8's (ZING!). That is what the stock ecu was designed to do, and thats why the blackbox is so effective is because it behaves, learns, and acts like the stock ecu, so it too can learn and adjust. However, you get into problems with other "simpler" piggybacks that have a hard time adjusting to the colder air. just take a look around, there are tons of threads on this over the past couple years and it is a fairly big problem with both n/a and FI piggyback engine management units
-Superior technology? Belt driven compressor + piggyback (black box) + fuel managment = superior technology??? Please be more clear.
I was referring to the blackbox in particular as being superior technology. Its not a normal piggyback by any means, it can offer alot more (see above for self learning, etc). It can even control "other" systems not sold with the sds. I remember reading a thread about how RIPP hooked up a nitrous system to one of its shop cars and had it hooked into the black box. Basically, once it hit a certain boost level, the blackbox would turn on the nitrous for an extra kick in the pants along with controlling the meth injection. That simply isn't something a simple piggyback can do. The only step up from the BB would be a standalone, a huge step which some of us aren't willing to take yet.
-Drivability? A lot of people think SDS people have a lot of traction problems in the winter, do you? What's better about drivability then N/A or FI?
I don't know of anyone that would think the sds has traction problems in the winter. Hell, I think me, nextgen, and blazin are the only ones that could vouch for SDS in snowy/icy conditions. I know I don't have less traction than when I was n/a, but I don't think I have more either, its pretty much the same because of the gradual boost and power curve.
Unlike a turbo, where it spools up and spews its load @ 3k rpm or whatever, the SDS builds boost and power gradually, so there is no sudden power surge or boost in accelaration. That right there would make winter driving pretty dangerous and unsafe if you ask me, cause that sudden surge in torque is going to break tires lose and cause issues. But overall, I don't think FI in winter driving conditions is worse or better, you just have to be smart about it. obviously, if its real icy out, don't be boosting if your turbo. just drive slow and safe and keep the rpms low
I know it's a lot but I hope you will be able to provide clear and detailed answers to my questions. There is no catch and I hope you will not find this offensive.
-What exact experience do you have with RIPP SDS blackbox? Did you see the map? Do you know what it controls? How do you know it compensates for cold weather?
I have a little experience with the blackbox. I helped RIPP wire it up one day while I was down there, I took it off nextgen's car, i've read about it and I know what ross told me. to be honest, i think ross is the only one with enough knowledge about it to talk about the blackbox in great detail, but i'll give it a shot. I did see the map, in fact its a neat little piece of software ross was using, pretty straight forward. I didn't understand too much of it cause he was moving pretty quickly, but he showed me how he street tune.
it basically controls the fuel, but not just the injectors, because of RIPP's supplimental injection system, it controls the atomizing injector along with the inline fuel pump. On top of that, it senses boost, and at 6-7 pounds (if your stg2) it will kick in the boost cooler to spray the methanol. As for how it compensates for cold weather, it functions alot like your stock ecu cause it has the ability to learn certain conditions (humidty, pressure ie altitude, temperature, and adjust accordingly. I'm not sure how it does this, but it uses all the signals the stock ecu does (not just maf, but o2, etc). I've been told it can even self tune for crappy gas like 89 and what not just in case. Like i said, its not a fixed, static map that "this much fuel must be added in at this rpm" but its more dynamic and flexible than that, just like your stock ecu. there are certain perameters it should remain in no matter the weather, and it does everything in its power to do so
-Why do you think winter isn't easy to cope with engine tuning? Does air fuel ratio changes? I always tought a colder/denser air would give you more room to play with, why do you think it's bad for ECU to compensate for it, I thought your blackbox would be responsible for it?
Winter changes alot and if you notice, its different everyday in winter. When its snowing it can be really humid (duh) but other days its remarkable dry. But its not just the changing humidity levels and of course cold air, but the density of the air. Cold air is denser than hot air, which means you are cramming alot more oxygen into your engine than your normally would be on a dry summer day. I remember nextgen telling me he was boosting 11psi during days in the fall/winter, but at nights he would be pushing 15psi or so, just because of the colder denser air. Now there is alot more to it (and more scientific than what I described) but its just hard to compensate for.
Yes, the stock ecu does learn winter conditions and adjusts accordingly so the car runs, that is why we can drive in winter, unlike many rx8's (ZING!). That is what the stock ecu was designed to do, and thats why the blackbox is so effective is because it behaves, learns, and acts like the stock ecu, so it too can learn and adjust. However, you get into problems with other "simpler" piggybacks that have a hard time adjusting to the colder air. just take a look around, there are tons of threads on this over the past couple years and it is a fairly big problem with both n/a and FI piggyback engine management units
-Superior technology? Belt driven compressor + piggyback (black box) + fuel managment = superior technology??? Please be more clear.
I was referring to the blackbox in particular as being superior technology. Its not a normal piggyback by any means, it can offer alot more (see above for self learning, etc). It can even control "other" systems not sold with the sds. I remember reading a thread about how RIPP hooked up a nitrous system to one of its shop cars and had it hooked into the black box. Basically, once it hit a certain boost level, the blackbox would turn on the nitrous for an extra kick in the pants along with controlling the meth injection. That simply isn't something a simple piggyback can do. The only step up from the BB would be a standalone, a huge step which some of us aren't willing to take yet.
-Drivability? A lot of people think SDS people have a lot of traction problems in the winter, do you? What's better about drivability then N/A or FI?
I don't know of anyone that would think the sds has traction problems in the winter. Hell, I think me, nextgen, and blazin are the only ones that could vouch for SDS in snowy/icy conditions. I know I don't have less traction than when I was n/a, but I don't think I have more either, its pretty much the same because of the gradual boost and power curve.
Unlike a turbo, where it spools up and spews its load @ 3k rpm or whatever, the SDS builds boost and power gradually, so there is no sudden power surge or boost in accelaration. That right there would make winter driving pretty dangerous and unsafe if you ask me, cause that sudden surge in torque is going to break tires lose and cause issues. But overall, I don't think FI in winter driving conditions is worse or better, you just have to be smart about it. obviously, if its real icy out, don't be boosting if your turbo. just drive slow and safe and keep the rpms low
I know it's a lot but I hope you will be able to provide clear and detailed answers to my questions. There is no catch and I hope you will not find this offensive.
Dec 12, 2005, 12:13 AM
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Originally Posted by akasirlancerlot
"i sense a plot to destroy te jedi"
well my friend i am in sclc and i am a dick face ill be the first to tell you but i want to understand the the process of the kit and in your opinion the pros and cons.. as well as ur thoughts on the service at ripp... i will most likely go turbo, whether it be rpw or rrm but im open.
no trap here, unless you make things get out of hand. Like ive said i have no problems with you personally i just happen to be good friends with the rrm guys, they take care of sclc and are a great company. I don't know too much about ripp and i would like to know more now. common greenie.
well my friend i am in sclc and i am a dick face ill be the first to tell you but i want to understand the the process of the kit and in your opinion the pros and cons.. as well as ur thoughts on the service at ripp... i will most likely go turbo, whether it be rpw or rrm but im open.
no trap here, unless you make things get out of hand. Like ive said i have no problems with you personally i just happen to be good friends with the rrm guys, they take care of sclc and are a great company. I don't know too much about ripp and i would like to know more now.
common greenie.
Dec 12, 2005, 02:37 AM
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I just wanted to say that is was greenie's posts on this forum on Supercharging that had me sittin on the fence for a long time(SCvTC). Thanks a bunch dude!
Still went with turbo, but he made me think real hard!
Good luck on all the trips, thats what having a good car is all about
Still went with turbo, but he made me think real hard!
Good luck on all the trips, thats what having a good car is all about
Dec 12, 2005, 06:59 AM
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Originally Posted by N20Lancer
I just wanted to say that is was greenie's posts on this forum on Supercharging that had me sittin on the fence for a long time(SCvTC). Thanks a bunch dude!
Still went with turbo, but he made me think real hard!
Good luck on all the trips, thats what having a good car is all about
Still went with turbo, but he made me think real hard!
Good luck on all the trips, thats what having a good car is all about
You know.
If I had a Lancer.
And could afford boost.
And stuff........