yup. emanage is optional. that is what's included in rrm stage 1 and some of their customers have had it with no problems and no type of afc for at least a year already. if all your parts are mechanically sound, then i don't see why it wouldn't work for you either. larger injectors or an adjustable boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator require an afc of some sort. emanage will help lean out if you just happen to have the basics and are running rich. it will not help run richer on stock injectors.

 

ok so to have a complete turbo kit i would need the following parts. piping depends on if i go Intercooled

Optional parts
E-manage system
IC

Basic kit
Turbo w internal wastgate
Piping (up pipe to turbo, down pipe to Exhaust, Turbo to IC, IC to Intake, Turbo to Filter)
vortech superFMU
walbro 255 Fuel Pump
BOV
wastegate

 

you would need a way of adjusting boost either by wastegate or BOV. i would think that an internal wastegate has a preset boost setting. either get an external adjustable wastegate or a new solenoid for the internal one, the latter being the recommended. i was talking with my roommate and he believes you can get a BOV to leak boost after a certain amount, but i'm not sure. otherwise, i don't think you're missing anything.

 

would the lancer be ok to use the 16g turbo off the evo or is that to big. I have located on and i guess i could just swap out the wastegate actu. to lower the PSI down to 5 or 6

 

I'll have to disagree with a few things in here... But first of all disregard my comments if you are just looking to throw in a turbo, use minimal boost, and just run more or less decent but not to potential.

1) E-manage is about 300 bucks... you can spend another 100 or 200 on harnesses, and you do need a laptop. So all told maxed out with full extra injector set control as well as ignition timing control minus the laptop you are looking at about 600 bucks.

2) Wideband IS a necessity if you are going to work on the fuel system or any part of tuning the car. A standard O2 sensor is not accurate in the least much of anything outside of 14-15 AFR.

3) Perfect AFR is 12.5. It's the physical/chemical peak of power output for internal combustion engines running standard gasolines (regardless of octane)

4) The trick to getting SAFC to work is to get around the dynamic abilities of the ECU. If you force the computer into limp mode (aka cut a temp sensor, or pull your first O2 sensor and put your wideband in there and not wire it to the ECU) and does not run in closed loop you will be able to adjust your settings all day long.

5) FMU's are typically not the best way to go, but are typically simpler and easier to get dialed in initally. They unfortunately typically lack the adjustability.. often you are fixed into a 12:1 or so forth ratio versus boost, and that can get you more or less nowhere.

6) In all honesty if you can tune to an even 12.5 fuel ratio under throttle you don't need a dyno to tune. Yes you can probaly eek out a couple horsepower here or there... but if you hit 12.5 you'll more or less max out the power of the engine. Then what the dyno is necessary for is adjusting timing and getting that dialed into what is peak for the car without risking any form of detonation.

7) It's better to overbuild and oversetup the fuel system so that you run rich. It is almost ALWAYS easier to lean out a fuel system than it is to try to get it to run richer. So overkill the fuel system and get yourself almost stumbling rich.. Then work back from there. Not to mention how much safer that is.

But basically... you need to have the piping, the turbo, wastegate, and BOV, and then a controllable solid fuel system with solid feedback that you can RELY on like a decent wideband.. which actually only costs about 300 bucks for the sensor and the readout, but can be in excess of 600 bucks if you don't look around enough. All Widebands are more or less compatible with all setups.. but wideband is IMPERATIVE to knowing what is going on with your car.

 

you're absolutely correct... if you plan to tune yourself or in any way be involved with the progress of your car. my suggestions were for what seemed to be a basic "Set it and forget it" low boost setup. the thread sort of looks like it was moving towards what are essential for a turbo kit. i'd personally do tuning myself and would buy a lot more than that.

 

well my plan is to start out a set it forget it and then i am planning the wideband 02 and the e-manage with larger injectors. then i will go butt dyno the car and get it right

 

plus the Super FMU allow for some tuning. that should be a good start i am only looking for around 200hp all in all i should still be able to get it going for less the 2500.

 

here's what i would get: (aside from piping and manifold)

T28 or T25 turbo
eclipse 1G BOV
external wastegate
electronic boost controller
greddy emanage (or AEM EMS if i had the $$$)
300-350cc injectors
boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator
walbro 255 or denso 260 out of a supra TT
wideband o2 with datalogging capabilities
upgraded plugs(hotter or colder? can't remember)

and then gauges:
boost
oil pressure (opt.)
water temp (opt.)

and thats what i would start out with.

 

I'm not familiar with the Super FMU... so I should familiarize myself with that... from what I've seen... rhyzin is always dead nuts on... and has the hands on with it too... sadly most of mine is helping my brother and knowing lots of theory and technical knowledge...

But yep.. agree with rhyzin.. this thread is in good hands..

and i'm pretty sure it's that you go to colder plugs.. but don't quote me on that .

 

so tell me what im missing/needs upgrading for this setup.

t25
1g bov
2g fuel pump
rising rate fpr
stock injectors(i think i'd need to upgrade these)
s-afc(using ur method of cutting temp sensor or o2 sensor...)
boost guage
exhaust gas temp guage
custom piping

would i need the EGT guage if i have an s-afc? obviously just using the EGT Guage to 'tune'. and would the s-afc allow me to tune settings? or if i were to get like the "Auterra PDA DynoScan Tool" to monitor these things?

and would the s-afc work if i DONT have a wideband? or could i hook the wideband up to the s-afc? sorry...completely lost on the 'electronics' of boosting...lol

would that allow me to boost at 5-6 psi? and could i add an intercooler no sweat?? like...without having to add more...just throw it in there and re-pipe it all?

if im missing something PLEASE tell me...i just really want to run 5 psi, maybe 6, but i think at 6 i'd need bigger injectors....where can i get cheap injectors anyways? i heard someone say a company trades you injectors or they bore em out to 300cc?

thanks....trying to learn all i can before this summer

P.S. or u could just Post what all i'd need to run 5-6 psi, w/out tuning or anything fancy...just the 'set it and forget it' kind of deal....so i can safely run 5-6 psi all day

 

http://www.auterraweb.com/auterra/supsen.html

this obdii scanner reads a lot of info...and even has 'live graphing' to show you everything.

now my question is...does this show everything i'd need...or should i still get like a wideband o2 or an s-afc?

 

an EGT isn't necessary if you've got something to monitor AF. its a thermometer that tells whether your engine is running in a safe temp range. i believe you shouldn't go higher than 1500 degrees F.

an safc's purpose is to change fuel settings by fooling what the ECU thinks as the volume of air entering the engine. a system like this is essential for tuning if you're gonna use an upgraded pump and upgraded injectors. this is not needed if using the vortech fmu and pump upgrade. the only downside to using the 2G eclipse pump with the vortech fmu is whether or not the pump would be able to supply enough fuel at higher fuel pressures as it's only a 120lph pump as opposed to the 255lph pumps used in the already made kits. i have no info yet on whether or not anyone has tried it and if there are any issues. the 2G turbo eclipses have 450cc (or 440cc?) injectors which paired with the pump would suffice but not sure if it would be enough if paired with 240-300cc injectors to make the same kind of horsepower on our engine. it would be interesting to know though. it's also my opinion that using the stock injectors with the fmu could be close to reaching the injectors full load. based on rceng.com injector worksheet, the 240's should either be maxed out before making the claimed 180whp or the fuel system is running a high amount of pressure. but since i haven't heard any injectors getting stuck open, i suppose it works and is, so far, reliable.

i'm a bit torn about the wideband. since you're gonna only boost 5-6 psi and with the right fuel system, there shouldn't be too many problems about fuel delivery. there have been DSMers who tune by the pda Pocketlogger and says it works fine enough. the auterraweb shouldn't be any different. then there are some DSMers who say that upgrading to a wideband is like night and day and that the narrowband isn't as accurate enough. you can't argue that the wideband isn't accurate enough, it's just whether or not the narrowband is.

the wideband, the EGT, and the safc are all separate of each other and do not rely on each other to work. BUT they all do work together. and what you're missing are 310+cc injectors if planning to tune your safc. the IC can go in with repiping. that's all. you might have to get a different compressor housing for your turbo though. depends on the setup. if you look at the rrm intercooled and nonintercooled setup, one compressor housing output faces the passenger side, and the IC'ed one faces the drivers side. the housings shouldn't be expensive and takes maybe 6 bolts to take off and replace.

stock injectors, fuel pump, FMU = almost no tuning (but check with someone with the right tools if everything is sound)
upgrade injectors, FPR, & pump, safc = lots of tuning

 

The Evo's 16G was meant to be pushed beyond 300 HP. When you drop it to a measly 5 psi, you're severely under using an expensive TC for no reason.

Use a T25 as a starter at 5-6 psi. A T28 at that low is a waste too . . . it's like asking a S15 silvia to drop its psi to 6 from normally 10-12 psi.

 

safe operating temps can go up to 8.4-8.5 x 100 but thats celsius i believe, 9x100 would be running real hot, im not to hot on conversions