Rear Bump Steer Correction Kit
Mar 27, 2008, 12:50 PM
#47
Well, I finally got back out on track in my evo w/ this rear bump steer kit installed. I made no other suspension changes from my previous trip. I was able to brake as hard as I could and the back end stayed planted. The only time I felt a little wiggle was braking from 110 to 60 on an uphill slope (Turn 9 at T-hill), but it was way less than before.
As far as handling characteristics, I was fighting the car a lot less in corners. The back end just felt more stable, so it allowed me to corner faster more comfortably. It's definitely a worthwhile mod.
My alignment settings have been:
Camber: -3.0° Front, -1.5° Rear
0 toe all around
As far as handling characteristics, I was fighting the car a lot less in corners. The back end just felt more stable, so it allowed me to corner faster more comfortably. It's definitely a worthwhile mod.
My alignment settings have been:
Camber: -3.0° Front, -1.5° Rear
0 toe all around
Mar 28, 2008, 03:17 PM
#49
I just picked up my Whiteline front roll center adjustment kit and will be installing it this weekend. My car sits pretty low and I'm sure my front roll center is way off. I hoping installing this will reduce the amount of understeer I currently have.
Mar 28, 2008, 03:20 PM
#50
Took me longer to get the ball joints out than anything. Your best bet is to go to NAPA and pick up an M14 x 1.5 nut and thread it onto the ball jount stud to where the nut and stud face are flush, then hammer the crap out of it until it pops out. I used the stock nut so that I wouldnt damage the stud and I ended up damaging the nut. Pressing the old bushings out and the new ones in took me only 30 minutes. By the way, thanks for the tip on noticing which side of the arm is chamfered to know which side to insert the bushing from, very helpful.
BTW, the front roll kit is great. I noticed much flatter cornering.
BTW, the front roll kit is great. I noticed much flatter cornering.
Sep 7, 2009, 06:52 PM
#51
Just thought I'd add some info, since I just finished my KCA388 bumpsteer kit install.
Actually, your best bet for removing the ball joints is to use the right tool... it's called a pitman arm puller, and it's available dirt cheap at Harbor Freight for less than 10 bucks:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...temnumber=1752
I have the whiteline kit.
The first side (driver's side) I did took a little time because I was confused at the fact that it wouldn't simply slide in by hand as the original bushing did. Eventually I figured out that it wasn't the yellow bushing but the metal insert that was causing the super tight fit because when trying to wiggle the bushing into place horizontally the metal insert's position moved from it's 6 oclock position 9 oclock position before I got the hole even lined up to put the bolt through it.
So I used the shop press to try and flatten out the ridges that were engraved into the metal cylinder ends, tried to use extra grease on the bushing, none of it helped. I even double checked the part number, and sure as **** it said KCA388 EVO 7-9.
Since the original bushing end cap was toast from the press, I had to finish the install, and used a small lightweight rubber mallet to get it into place from the bottom up (vertically). That's when I noticed the fittament was so tight that the ridges on the metal insert had actually scored the metal/paint to show bare aluminum. At that point though what can you do, ya know? So I fit the outer pillowball joint and tightened everything down.
On the passenger side, I took the original bushing which wasn't damaged while pressing out (because I used a smaller socket) and compared the width with the metal insert width. They visually seemed to be the same length, Whiteline's engraved ridges seem to make the insert less than a mm of difference longer. Very very very close. Some would probably say they were the same length but obviously they weren't.
This side went in a little quicker/easier though having used the same (final) technique devised from the other side. I knew I'd have to use the rubber mallet and come in from the bottom up to keep the orientation of the metal insert about right.
...just wanted to see if other's had the same experience in the slightest. So no one else had scored paint or perhaps had to use a little "coaxing" to get the completed bushing in it's rightful spot, huh?
I had the same difficulty reinstalling the OEM arm with the Whiteline bushings/steel inserts - rubber mallets/hammer definitely required. However, I found that on my car, slipping them in horizontally (i.e., pushing inwards towards the center of the car) worked much better than trying to hammer them up from the bottom - the opposite of what worked for Vankuen.
I made sure the bushing hadn't rotated in the process, and that the offset hole was still pointing down.
Another note: on the issue of lubrication, I lubed the outside "channel" of the bushing and the inner diameter of the hole in the arm before pressing them, because I thought that's where the movement was supposed to be, and because it'd ease the installation of the bushings and prevent squeaking once they're installed.
I emailed Whiteline to inquire about where the grease was supposed to go, and how the bump steer kit is supposed to work - in other words, what's supposed to move/rotate and what's designed to stay in place.
My email to Whiteline:
I've got the KCA395 roll center kit installed already on my '06 Evo9, and I'm currently putting the KCA388 bushing kit into my car's "assist link" arms.... hoping this change will help keep the rear of my Evo from dancing around when braking hard at the track from over 100 mph.
I used the included dark grease to lube up the bushing liberally - the "channel" within the urethane bushing, to the metal hole of the aluminum arm.
Once the urethane bushing was pressed in, I also used the grease to lube the textured, inner surface of the bushing for the metal eccentric.
I set the bolt hole in the eccentric to "down" as shown in the instruction sheet to minimize bump steer. Then, as I was adjusting the position of the eccentric before I pressed it all the way in, I noticed the yellow bushing was rotating in the aluminum arm.
Is this how the Whiteline bump steer kit is supposed to work? I.e., the metal eccentric is supposed to be held in place by being squeezed by the OEM fixing bolt/adjuster, the bushing should also stay stationary, and the aluminum arm is supposed to rotate around the bushing? I'm assuming that's why the ends of the metal eccentric sleeve has knurled texture on them, so the fixing bolt can clamp it firmly in place?
If this is the case, it's OK if the urethane bushing can rotate inside the arm when I grip the edges of the bushing with pliers firmly, right? I would assume this just means I did a good job of lubricating the arm to the bushing with grease, which ensures that it won't squeak/bind up.
Please confirm that I didn't do something really wrong before I re-install the suspension arms in my Evo - i.e., overdo the grease job - and that the yellow bushing is actually NOT supposed to be able to move in the aluminum assist arm at all after it's pressed in.
The response I got (from John Leighton):
We actually do not recommend greasing the outer surface of the bush because this will help generate more heat when the whole bush is turning. If you just use soapy water to help install the bush then use the grease for the inner ID and face only. Once in the car, the crush tube will be clamped and the bush and arm will move as one around the crush tube.
Regards
John Leighton
Redranger
NOLATHANE / WHITELINE
This is not how my bushings are moving in my Evo - when I move the arm, the metal insert stays clamped in place, while the yellow urethane bushing stays with it and rotates within the aluminum arm.
Oh well, too late to do anything about it now - I pressed out the metal inserts, then tried to remove the bushings from the arms, so I could clean out the grease, but it looked like doing so might tear the outer edges of the urethane bushings off, so I just left them alone.
I think Whiteline needs to revise their instruction sheet and actually tell us how they want us to lubricate/install their bushings, seeing as how the "Fitting Instructions" sheet included with the KCA388 kit make no mention of lubrication at all, and the "General Fitting Instructions" on the back of the package top say "As a general rule coat any bush surface that contacts with metal parts," hence my use of the supplied grease on the outer diameter of the urethane bushing.
Took me longer to get the ball joints out than anything. Your best bet is to go to NAPA and pick up an M14 x 1.5 nut and thread it onto the ball jount stud to where the nut and stud face are flush, then hammer the crap out of it until it pops out. I used the stock nut so that I wouldnt damage the stud and I ended up damaging the nut.
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...temnumber=1752
I have the whiteline kit.
The first side (driver's side) I did took a little time because I was confused at the fact that it wouldn't simply slide in by hand as the original bushing did. Eventually I figured out that it wasn't the yellow bushing but the metal insert that was causing the super tight fit because when trying to wiggle the bushing into place horizontally the metal insert's position moved from it's 6 oclock position 9 oclock position before I got the hole even lined up to put the bolt through it.
So I used the shop press to try and flatten out the ridges that were engraved into the metal cylinder ends, tried to use extra grease on the bushing, none of it helped. I even double checked the part number, and sure as **** it said KCA388 EVO 7-9.
Since the original bushing end cap was toast from the press, I had to finish the install, and used a small lightweight rubber mallet to get it into place from the bottom up (vertically). That's when I noticed the fittament was so tight that the ridges on the metal insert had actually scored the metal/paint to show bare aluminum. At that point though what can you do, ya know? So I fit the outer pillowball joint and tightened everything down.
On the passenger side, I took the original bushing which wasn't damaged while pressing out (because I used a smaller socket) and compared the width with the metal insert width. They visually seemed to be the same length, Whiteline's engraved ridges seem to make the insert less than a mm of difference longer. Very very very close. Some would probably say they were the same length but obviously they weren't.
This side went in a little quicker/easier though having used the same (final) technique devised from the other side. I knew I'd have to use the rubber mallet and come in from the bottom up to keep the orientation of the metal insert about right.
...just wanted to see if other's had the same experience in the slightest. So no one else had scored paint or perhaps had to use a little "coaxing" to get the completed bushing in it's rightful spot, huh?
I made sure the bushing hadn't rotated in the process, and that the offset hole was still pointing down.
Another note: on the issue of lubrication, I lubed the outside "channel" of the bushing and the inner diameter of the hole in the arm before pressing them, because I thought that's where the movement was supposed to be, and because it'd ease the installation of the bushings and prevent squeaking once they're installed.
I emailed Whiteline to inquire about where the grease was supposed to go, and how the bump steer kit is supposed to work - in other words, what's supposed to move/rotate and what's designed to stay in place.
My email to Whiteline:
I've got the KCA395 roll center kit installed already on my '06 Evo9, and I'm currently putting the KCA388 bushing kit into my car's "assist link" arms.... hoping this change will help keep the rear of my Evo from dancing around when braking hard at the track from over 100 mph.
I used the included dark grease to lube up the bushing liberally - the "channel" within the urethane bushing, to the metal hole of the aluminum arm.
Once the urethane bushing was pressed in, I also used the grease to lube the textured, inner surface of the bushing for the metal eccentric.
I set the bolt hole in the eccentric to "down" as shown in the instruction sheet to minimize bump steer. Then, as I was adjusting the position of the eccentric before I pressed it all the way in, I noticed the yellow bushing was rotating in the aluminum arm.
Is this how the Whiteline bump steer kit is supposed to work? I.e., the metal eccentric is supposed to be held in place by being squeezed by the OEM fixing bolt/adjuster, the bushing should also stay stationary, and the aluminum arm is supposed to rotate around the bushing? I'm assuming that's why the ends of the metal eccentric sleeve has knurled texture on them, so the fixing bolt can clamp it firmly in place?
If this is the case, it's OK if the urethane bushing can rotate inside the arm when I grip the edges of the bushing with pliers firmly, right? I would assume this just means I did a good job of lubricating the arm to the bushing with grease, which ensures that it won't squeak/bind up.
Please confirm that I didn't do something really wrong before I re-install the suspension arms in my Evo - i.e., overdo the grease job - and that the yellow bushing is actually NOT supposed to be able to move in the aluminum assist arm at all after it's pressed in.
The response I got (from John Leighton):
We actually do not recommend greasing the outer surface of the bush because this will help generate more heat when the whole bush is turning. If you just use soapy water to help install the bush then use the grease for the inner ID and face only. Once in the car, the crush tube will be clamped and the bush and arm will move as one around the crush tube.
Regards
John Leighton
Redranger
NOLATHANE / WHITELINE
This is not how my bushings are moving in my Evo - when I move the arm, the metal insert stays clamped in place, while the yellow urethane bushing stays with it and rotates within the aluminum arm.
Oh well, too late to do anything about it now - I pressed out the metal inserts, then tried to remove the bushings from the arms, so I could clean out the grease, but it looked like doing so might tear the outer edges of the urethane bushings off, so I just left them alone.
I think Whiteline needs to revise their instruction sheet and actually tell us how they want us to lubricate/install their bushings, seeing as how the "Fitting Instructions" sheet included with the KCA388 kit make no mention of lubrication at all, and the "General Fitting Instructions" on the back of the package top say "As a general rule coat any bush surface that contacts with metal parts," hence my use of the supplied grease on the outer diameter of the urethane bushing.
Sep 7, 2009, 08:48 PM
#53
No idea; the car's still immobile in the garage (TB and IM are out for porting) and I won't get out to the track again for a few weeks.
Based on what I've read from people here, it should help quite a bit to stabilize the rear end under high-speed braking. I just hope the bump steer kit doesn't also induce a noticeable amount of understeer in fast autox transitions. If it does, maybe dialing in some more rear bar will counteract that undesired side effect.
Based on what I've read from people here, it should help quite a bit to stabilize the rear end under high-speed braking. I just hope the bump steer kit doesn't also induce a noticeable amount of understeer in fast autox transitions. If it does, maybe dialing in some more rear bar will counteract that undesired side effect.
Oct 10, 2009, 07:57 PM
#54
No idea; the car's still immobile in the garage (TB and IM are out for porting) and I won't get out to the track again for a few weeks.
Based on what I've read from people here, it should help quite a bit to stabilize the rear end under high-speed braking. I just hope the bump steer kit doesn't also induce a noticeable amount of understeer in fast autox transitions. If it does, maybe dialing in some more rear bar will counteract that undesired side effect.
Based on what I've read from people here, it should help quite a bit to stabilize the rear end under high-speed braking. I just hope the bump steer kit doesn't also induce a noticeable amount of understeer in fast autox transitions. If it does, maybe dialing in some more rear bar will counteract that undesired side effect.
By changing out the OEM rear swaybar for a Progress 25mm unit, set middle/middle, I didn't lose any turn-in or steady-state cornering ability by adding the Whiteline rear bump steer bushings.
Jan 12, 2014, 08:12 PM
#58
I posted some pics when I installed my whiteline bumpsteer bushings a while ago. Pretty straight forward. I have a pic as well of how the bushing should be centered and how it should look on the arm, along with some helpful hints to make the job easier.
Dec 29, 2015, 08:50 PM
#59
Almost a 2 year bump here. Bushings installed today as well with some trailing arm bushings. My alignment before for the rear was -1.3 camber and 0 toe. I'm on FA500 coils at an ideal ride height. Again everything was installed correctly. At the alignment shop and trying to Zero out the toe and can only max it out with -.7x of toe(Toe Out). Anyone have any suggestions of why this is happening or what I can do to fix it? As of now we raised the camber to -2.1 to get the toe to 0. I would like to get my camber back to -1.3-1.5 WITHOUT raising the ride height.
Last edited by amn_suazo; Dec 30, 2015 at 07:17 AM.
Dec 30, 2015, 06:00 AM
#60
Almost a 2 year bump here. Bushings installed today as well with some trailing arm bushings. My alignment before for the rear was -1.3 camber and 0 toe. I'm on FA500 coils at an ideal ride height. Again everything was installed correctly. At the alignment shop and trying to Zero out the toe and can only max it out with -.7x of toe. Anyone have any suggestions of why this is happening or what I can do to fix it? As of now we raised the camber to -2.1 to get the toe to 0. I would like to get my camber back to -1.3-1.5 WITHOUT raising the ride height.