EvolutionM.net Tuner Time Attack Challenge
Jul 9, 2004, 07:44 PM
#47
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Great! Good to hear the interest! Some of these cars that are entering (not on the forum) are beyond belief! (Makes Norris Designs look like a mini cooper 
)
AMS, you want in? Just say so!
This is going to be a tuner only day on the race track. If you plan on entering, we want only experienced or professional drivers. The majority that have entered are professionals or very experienced.
We want this to be open as a giant evolution meet also!
)AMS, you want in? Just say so!
This is going to be a tuner only day on the race track. If you plan on entering, we want only experienced or professional drivers. The majority that have entered are professionals or very experienced.
We want this to be open as a giant evolution meet also!
Jul 12, 2004, 02:46 PM
#49
Originally Posted by metaphysical
This is going to be a tuner only day on the race track.
Originally Posted by metaphysical
Vehicle Rules:
NO RACE CARS
Originally Posted by metaphysical
Cars must be street legal (Minus exhaust emissions systems)
Originally Posted by metaphysical
Minimum weight modifications
We'll have a boat load of customer cars to run in this, every west coast EVO track day is dominated by our cars. Just wondering if our shop car is legal for this.
Mike W
Jul 13, 2004, 09:58 AM
#50
Evolving Member
One possible suggestion for the rule set is to use the SCCA Solo 2 Street Modified (SM) rules. What you have listed already pretty much falls in line with those and it would be one less thing to worry about. If there is something in the SM rules you don't like, you can always write an exception to the offending part...
JW
JW
Jul 13, 2004, 11:26 AM
#51
I think those rules will have to be modified as we're not a sanctioning body that would be able to enforce much of that or define it clearly enough for the competitors to know what is legal.
In the end, this will be a matter of tuners showing up with their vehicles ready to set a fastest lap time in a time trial format.
As for defining a tuner, the goal is to have an "official" tuner car show up to compete... preferably a shop car. If need be, we can restrict the tuner portion to shop cars to keep things in-line with the goal. My thought is to have a privateer session in addition because there are a number of guys who want to compete and should have a medium to do so. The times can be compared by class (tuner/privateer) and overall.
Nothing is 100% final yet, so let's keep the discussion and feedback coming!
Mark
In the end, this will be a matter of tuners showing up with their vehicles ready to set a fastest lap time in a time trial format.
As for defining a tuner, the goal is to have an "official" tuner car show up to compete... preferably a shop car. If need be, we can restrict the tuner portion to shop cars to keep things in-line with the goal. My thought is to have a privateer session in addition because there are a number of guys who want to compete and should have a medium to do so. The times can be compared by class (tuner/privateer) and overall.
Nothing is 100% final yet, so let's keep the discussion and feedback coming!
Mark
Jul 13, 2004, 11:44 AM
#52
Evolving Member
Originally Posted by KK
I think those rules will have to be modified as we're not a sanctioning body that would be able to enforce much of that or define it clearly enough for the competitors to know what is legal.
Another issue to consider too is the variation in driving talent. Any of us who have done timed events know (though may not want to believe
) that different drivers, even at the high end of the sport, will deliver significantly different results out of the same machinery. It would be nice if that could be eliminated through the use of a single unbiased driver of adequate skill (not me!). I understand if the tuners would be apprehensive about handing over the keys to a stranger, but it would provide for more meaningful results...JW
Jul 13, 2004, 11:49 AM
#53
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The problem with using a single driver is two-fold. The driver learns things each lap, and as such it is impossible to drive each car fairly. The other is that cars are set up a certain way for the driver that normally runs the car. Different drivers are really fast with certain setups and really slow with most other setups.
So basically it sounds like a good idea to have a single driver, but in reality that hurts more cars than it helps. Perhaps one idea is to have a hot-shoe driver available, and then competitors can elect to have he/she drive their car if they feel that person can do a better job, but having a single driver be mandatory for all competitors will be a disaster for sure.
So basically it sounds like a good idea to have a single driver, but in reality that hurts more cars than it helps. Perhaps one idea is to have a hot-shoe driver available, and then competitors can elect to have he/she drive their car if they feel that person can do a better job, but having a single driver be mandatory for all competitors will be a disaster for sure.
Last edited by Blak94GSX; Jul 13, 2004 at 11:51 AM.
Jul 13, 2004, 11:51 AM
#54
Originally Posted by Blak94GSX
Perhaps one idea is to have a hot-shoe driver available, and then competitors can elect to have he/she drive their car if they feel that person can do a better job, but having a single driver be mandatory for all competitors will be a disaster for sure.
Mark
Jul 13, 2004, 12:05 PM
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Sorry I have been so busy with work (and driving my car too). I talked to John Mueller yesterday about suggestions.
I'll make a longer post tonight.
I'll make a longer post tonight.
Jul 13, 2004, 06:11 PM
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Ok,
About the rules. No race cars means, no gutted no license plate cars. We understand if you rarely drive your shop car on the street and if it's ungodly uncomfortable and has a full cage that's alright also.
As for costs. KK is talking to speed ventures (and maybe some other avenues since we talked). Now, timing and track expenses are expensive. Thus amoritizing the costs is a high priority, because we don't want tuners to spend $500 to enter + their vehicles costs.
Timing, John brought up some great points. I think, John thinks, and hopefully some of you will agree a multiple lap average time is the best way to score these cars. If you have a one best lap event, then you run into GT35R's running full bost at 10/10ths for one lap. And some of the teams may have enough money to chance a $3000 dollar shortblock, whereas others don't have the desire to do that. Also, keeping the costs low for the tuners is important, and I'm looking over my gas and tire rules. Should we allow Hoosiers and C16? Because teams may wrap up $2500 in gas and tires in a day.
Coverage, we need to get this into as many published venues as possible. Because of the costs associated with entering a competitive car we need to give them as much bang for their buck as possible.
And privateer entrys and public entrys. KK is looking into public participation on one day with professional instruction, this will be seperate from the tuner shootout. Now, the shootout is open to privateers. Privateer vehicles must be competitive. Meaning, your car won't be eligible unless you can supply a professional driver (or VERY experienced) and a very potent car (450whp, full suspension, etc.).
And we want to make this the largest Evolution meet in the USA, possibly the world. So expect vendors, car show, etc.
About the rules. No race cars means, no gutted no license plate cars. We understand if you rarely drive your shop car on the street and if it's ungodly uncomfortable and has a full cage that's alright also.
As for costs. KK is talking to speed ventures (and maybe some other avenues since we talked). Now, timing and track expenses are expensive. Thus amoritizing the costs is a high priority, because we don't want tuners to spend $500 to enter + their vehicles costs.
Timing, John brought up some great points. I think, John thinks, and hopefully some of you will agree a multiple lap average time is the best way to score these cars. If you have a one best lap event, then you run into GT35R's running full bost at 10/10ths for one lap. And some of the teams may have enough money to chance a $3000 dollar shortblock, whereas others don't have the desire to do that. Also, keeping the costs low for the tuners is important, and I'm looking over my gas and tire rules. Should we allow Hoosiers and C16? Because teams may wrap up $2500 in gas and tires in a day.
Coverage, we need to get this into as many published venues as possible. Because of the costs associated with entering a competitive car we need to give them as much bang for their buck as possible.
And privateer entrys and public entrys. KK is looking into public participation on one day with professional instruction, this will be seperate from the tuner shootout. Now, the shootout is open to privateers. Privateer vehicles must be competitive. Meaning, your car won't be eligible unless you can supply a professional driver (or VERY experienced) and a very potent car (450whp, full suspension, etc.).
And we want to make this the largest Evolution meet in the USA, possibly the world.
So expect vendors, car show, etc.
Jul 13, 2004, 06:24 PM
#58
Originally Posted by metaphysical
Ok,
About the rules. No race cars means, no gutted no license plate cars. We understand if you rarely drive your shop car on the street and if it's ungodly uncomfortable and has a full cage that's alright also.
About the rules. No race cars means, no gutted no license plate cars. We understand if you rarely drive your shop car on the street and if it's ungodly uncomfortable and has a full cage that's alright also.
Mike W
Last edited by Mike W; Jul 13, 2004 at 06:27 PM.
Jul 13, 2004, 06:28 PM
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Well, here's another question, how many of the shop cars entered are stripped? I mean, I don't know how much of a difference it makes, because there are two cars with WRC brakes and several with external resovoir Ohlins entered. So, maybe we should allow lightened cars?
And Mike are you still in the shop, I need to pay for my JIC suspension I ordered from John?
And Mike are you still in the shop, I need to pay for my JIC suspension I ordered from John?
