View Poll Results: Guess the Vishnu Shop Car's Dyno WHP at XS Engineering 8/5/04
400 to 450 whp
27
23.89%
451 to 500 whp
28
24.78%
501 to 550 whp
30
26.55%
551 to 600 whp
28
24.78%
Voters: 113. You may not vote on this poll
Vishnu shop car dynoed at XS Engineering
Originally Posted by sparcoevo
I'm sorry, as I promised myself I wouldn't get sucked into this (and I hope that it doesn't start a flame war), but someone just pointed out this thread to me, and I find the contradictions and abundance of incomplete information amusing, yet frustrating. There is no way anyone can assume anything from comparing peak dyno numbers. It is clear that a "one shot" dyno pull like the one performed at XS by Shiv will do wonders for a company's marketing program, but as Shiv will readily admit (and has....see above) this is NOT a roadracing tune on his car, so knocking 100whp off that peak number will put you right next to all the other roadracing EVOs out there. What I find amusing, is that Shiv is a proclaimed road racer and preaches the inadequacies of the drag strip for proving anything about a tuner's capabilities, yet shows up at XS with a drag tune so he can post a big number and then brag about how much more power he made against a car that is tuned completely differently with a different purpose in mind.
I'm not a tuner. I have nothing to gain from tuning Evos. I support all the tuners out there and applaud them for their devotion to this community. However, the members of this community would be well served to investigate and learn as much as possible about the claims and HP numbers being tossed around so freely on this website. Shiv should be credited for his performances at the C&D Shootout and One Lap of America, but I had to finally chime in with my "$0.02" when comparisons are made between apples and oranges.
I'm not a tuner. I have nothing to gain from tuning Evos. I support all the tuners out there and applaud them for their devotion to this community. However, the members of this community would be well served to investigate and learn as much as possible about the claims and HP numbers being tossed around so freely on this website. Shiv should be credited for his performances at the C&D Shootout and One Lap of America, but I had to finally chime in with my "$0.02" when comparisons are made between apples and oranges.
Last edited by n00dle; Aug 12, 2004 at 02:33 PM.
In addition, I would think that Shiv's numbers were not necessarily showing a "drag strip tune". The car was set up for the Car and Driver shootout and those number are just what that turbo produces. He even said that it was not really suited for track use and he would rather opt for the 3071. That dyno seems to me to strictly demonstrate the potentials of that turbo with the right setup, not that Shiv is trying to put on over on people..
Sorry for the rant, I just cant see how Sparco came to those conclusions based on the posts and responses in this thread and others..
Terry S
Sorry for the rant, I just cant see how Sparco came to those conclusions based on the posts and responses in this thread and others..
Terry S
So is a race in place for the Sparco Evo and Vishnu evo, I would think both cars are fast and would be fun to see them going head to head. Also, to keep an apples to apples comparison, Shiv should bolt the 3037 back on in order to keep things fair.
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Originally Posted by gnulooks
So is a race in place for the Sparco Evo and Vishnu evo, I would think both cars are fast and would be fun to see them going head to head. Also, to keep an apples to apples comparison, Shiv should bolt the 3037 back on in order to keep things fair.
Wait if we have to downgrade to be fair why would we race to see which car is better/faster?
On a more serious note unlike sparco we are tuners with power packages and our constituents care about our tuning prowess how much power the XEDE tuned cars can make and weather we like it or not what 1320 times our road raced minded power packages make. We cant help that. We arent selling out by posting one power pull and for the life of me I cant understand why Sparco would care/call us out/ feel compelled enough to denounce our behavior of posting a power pull while taking a break from our Road racing or magazine tests.
Whatever, didnt mean to perturb anyone or god forbid market our product without a new paintjob. We fully respect the Sparco crew, products, car and it has certainly pruven itself time again. We have never had anything but praise for their effort and commitnment and of course the performance of the package- Hell anyone that has seen my PC here at Vishnu has seen the Sparco car with two wheels in the air as my background
Crud Shiv didnt log out- DAVID
Originally Posted by n00dle
Noted, but that goes for everyone that got on the rollers at the event. We (the enthusiasts) that showed up to witness the dyno pulls knew little about each car or what type of fuels they were running, let alone whether or not what they were telling everyone was the truth. There was no pre-requisite of the type of tune one had to have before getting on the rollers. I view dyno pulls more of a number bragging rights if anything at all. Run what you brung. At that point no one cares what type of tune the car has. If it runs just get on the rollers and see what it'll do, period. Many of us have a good idea of the potential each tuner and/or their car has. There were also cars that didn't do aswell as most anticipated, but that was anticipated aswell. Shiv posted his results. If there's another tuner that thinks he can do better go to XS and hop on the rollers and prove it, then come back and tell us about it. XS noted that Shiv's car was most they'd seen on their dyno. That should be enough incentive to beat it.
I'm proud of the tune on our car and have no desire to pursue a magical hp number. Likewise, I am impressed with the number Shiv put down with his car, and respect his abilities as a tuner. If you read my post again, you will see that it was an effort (maybe a misunderstood effort) to point out that there are many many variables behind every dyno number and without all the information available, you will not be able to decipher what that number means to you, the enthusiast.
But, yes, according to your logic, Shiv is the winner.
Originally Posted by gnulooks
So is a race in place for the Sparco Evo and Vishnu evo, I would think both cars are fast and would be fun to see them going head to head. Also, to keep an apples to apples comparison, Shiv should bolt the 3037 back on in order to keep things fair.
Originally Posted by sparcoevo
Using your logic, tuners should focus on achieving peak hp numbers for the "wow" factor, and your request for someone to try to "do better" contradicts every Tuner's assertion that the dyno should be used as a tuning tool, and not a method of claiming hp superiority.
My request to try to do better is for those that are challenged. If one is not, then no need to do it. It is obvious that you were disturbed about something to have been sucked into posting. The thread would have gone it's own merry way and eventually die an early death, but you've given it new life.
I'm proud of the tune on our car and have no desire to pursue a magical hp number. Likewise, I am impressed with the number Shiv put down with his car, and respect his abilities as a tuner. If you read my post again, you will see that it was an effort (maybe a misunderstood effort) to point out that there are many many variables behind every dyno number and without all the information available, you will not be able to decipher what that number means to you, the enthusiast.
But, yes, according to your logic, Shiv is the winner.
Originally Posted by sparcoevo
I respect their position as one of the premier tuners in the country, and welcome an opportunity to compete head to head on a real racetrack (not a strip of asphalt that is 1320ft long), as I'm sure they would, too. From what I've been told, that opportunity might exist in the Fall at Streets of Willow or Buttonwillow. Right now, their car is the benchmark for performance on a road course and i would like to see if we can keep up.
I can't wait for one lap because it won't happen until next year. Also, a lot of those tracks don't allow spectators to participate in viewing the event. I think Streets of Willow will be cool because a lot of Evo owners will not only show up to watch, but they get to participate and learn how to drive their cars fast. Is summer over yet?
An event at Streets of Willow would be great. One Lap is available to others who want a shot, but can't make it to other events before then to compete with Vishnu. A years notice in advance should suffice for these people. They know Vishnu will be there. All they have to do is show up if they can step up. If not, sit back down. You have 1 year in advance to think about it.
Last edited by n00dle; Aug 12, 2004 at 03:32 PM.
Originally Posted by sparcoevo
NO, I don't think they should have to downgrade anything. I think if Vishnu has the superior package, then they should be allowed to run it. I respect their position as one of the premier tuners in the country, and welcome an opportunity to compete head to head on a real racetrack (not a strip of asphalt that is 1320ft long), as I'm sure they would, too. From what I've been told, that opportunity might exist in the Fall at Streets of Willow or Buttonwillow. Right now, their car is the benchmark for performance on a road course and i would like to see if we can keep up.
We all respect and love the Sparco EVO. It’s fast and nice and over all clean like a brand new car
. I know that it has the heart of a real track racing car like Vishnu’s car. I think that both of you guys should call SCC and schedule couple days for competition, head to head. Evil vs Angel 
. Both cars are great and I have no idea why Sparco EVO is attacking Shiv as he always loved and said nothing but good about the Sparco EVO
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I may be mistaken and I am not Smogrunner(one of Shivs internet bouncers) but I believe one of Shiv's motives was more to prove a point about his moon dyno numbers that he gets no repect for. Yes he uses his dyno as a tool to tune but other tuners post big #s and it makes Evo owners wonder how his tunes really stack up. It was proven at XS by Shiv and Smogrunner. Smoggy's 1+ put down the most of the ten customers cars that were chosen in a raffle and if Shiv's beast would of been their he would of put down the most of all cars that dynoed period. So Shiv has a project to tune a mag car and decides to go on the dyno to see where he stands. Now he is even hated more in Cali because his car kicked A$$. Sometimes I feel like a Jew during Hitlers regime because I am a Vishnu customer. Almost got into at the track with a Dsmer for it one time. Shiv is a kick A$$ tuner period when it comes to making good reliable power. Give him credit and leave it at that. Sparco your Evo is aesthetically a master piece. I wouldn't want to race that let alone drive it if i owned it because it is so pretty. It also put down good power and I am sure it is a kick A$$ track car. Aesthetically Shiv's car is ghettofabulous. I like the tape on the wing that holds the aluminum piece on to help downforce at high speeds the most. Was probably good for 20whp at least.
Originally Posted by David@Vishnu
Let me put it this way. On a cold night, with no passengers, the car has been known to scare the shat out of me 
shiv, under dave's account-- he never logs out when he uses my computer!!
shiv, under dave's account-- he never logs out when he uses my computer!!
