signalauto27

iTrader: (5)

What's the difference between this setup and the one that you helped make for Perrin?

Oh, is the DDS3 housing new? It looks a little different.

Thanks Richard.

EvoTio

iTrader: (10)

Very well said Abner, I couldn't have said it any better myself. Some people will never understand what it takes to bring a top notch product to the consumers. This aint no bargain basement special, it's a quality water/alcohol injection system!!!

mrfred

iTrader: (50)

Does this system use a circulating water system?

Any chance that this system could be set up to be inactive below a certain boost pressure (say 3 psi) to conserve water/alcohol?

Ichigo

iTrader: (3)

+1

Good stuff. I'm looking to get this system for my new turbine kit.

badhabit90

iTrader: (13)

nnnniiiiiiccccceeeeee

1NastyEvo

iTrader: (10)

Awesome. Can't wait for some testing.

SlowCar

iTrader: (4)

They have been around a long time...........if its not ready for the public, it will not be released

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

The perrin system is designed to address a certain category of modified cars. It handles stock engine to modifed power output of 300-500 bhp. The unit is totally self contained, plug and play. It has a very advanced failsafe system inbuild, tracks the water flow continuously, drop boost or switch map etc.

The Aquamist HFS range is designed for power output between 300-1000BHP, this is due to the huge pump and very accurate water to fuel ratio tracking. As the flow is controlled by a PWM valve, it matched the delivery characteristics of a fuel injector perfectly.

The perrin dash display is different form the DDS3, but has all the functions pre-trimmed for users can get the system installed and working pretty quicky.

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

I understand your concern, unlike other add-ons, WI injectiion system can be transferred to your next car so your investment is for long term - you only need to buy it once, so pick the best one if possible.

The HFS-5 is as complete and we can make it, except for the water tank - we give you everything else.

Water tank supplier:
http://fluids.flambeau.com/

WhiteEvo05

iTrader: (12)

This is what I have been wanting...never could understand why everyone varied pump speed with a fixed orifice nozzle...Flintstones Tech 101.

I run a ChipTorque Xede and this would be perfect...the Xede has an Auxiliary injector control function built in to it...Oh, the mental woody! The ability to fully map the injector duty cycle based on boost and load. With lean-run protection nested in the mapping as well, another level of failsafe based on wideband feedback to induce a boost cut to wastegate actuator pressure if anything happens to the WI system and readings go lean.

A couple of questions though...

With this system do you also monitor "rail" pressure as this would make a good backup to flow-sensor?

Is this an "open center" injection system or a blind injection system...I mean does it circulate back to tank or is the "rail" dead headed at the injector(s)? Does the water/meth/alky heat up with being under pressure all the time if this is a blind system?

Does the pump run all the time? Or does it come on, pressurise the system, and go into stand-by wating for the proper events to trigger injection?

Filter? A trash screen to the injector would be good...Canton-Mecca makes a superb 1 micron filter with low restriction that would be good on the suction side, ensuring a clean system.

This system looks alot like what I have been kicking around in my head for the last couple of months. Outstanding! This system gets my vote when I step up to WI!



EDIT: Now that I look at the pic of the components again, I answered some of my questions...I see that the PWM valve is in line with one of the good 'ol nozzles. I would think that unless this is right next to the nozzle, you introduce a fair bit of latency to the system...I am still excited about this system, though. For me I would probably go to the length of making a one hole fuel rail (not hard at all) and using an actual fuel injector spec'd for whatever I'm injecting and the 125psi pressure. I would still like to hear from Richard L regarding some of the other questions.

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

Yes. The water pump has three internal bypass valves, placed between the inlet and outlet port. The valves begin to open at 125psi, holding the pressure steady. Depending on the inlet hose bore, the pressure can creep beyond 125psi during dead head conditions.

We put a small accumulator on the output port to store some pressurised water and at the same time, smoothing out the pressure peaks caused by the diaphragm's pumping action.

The pump is not running full time, it only run during injection. User determines when the system should start by trimming the trigger point, from signal of a MAP sensor, TPS or Fuel duty cycle %. The system can read any 0-5V "load" sensor.

In order to minimise the slow pressure ramp up of the pump, we allow a small delay after an injection event, This allows the accumulator be charged up, ready for the next injection event.

mrfred

iTrader: (50)

I hadn't thought about this before, but what is the timing and duration of the Aquamist injection pulses relative to the fuel injection pulses. Is the Aquamist firing out an injection pulse everytime one of the four fuel injectors fires (i.e. is it firing at 4x the rate of one fuel injector)? Seems like this would be necessary to keep the water/fuel ratio constant.

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

The aquamist mirrors the injector duty cycle at a ratio of 1:1.

It only follow only one of the four inejctors. On paper, it would appear top be a problem of gaps between pulses. In practice, the range of droplet sizes from the aquamist nozzle (40um to 80um) travels towards the TP, will accelerate at different rates, by the time it enters the manifold, it will become a continuous train of water droplets. If you are concerning about uneven cylinder distribution, put two jets at 6" apart, it will make the distribution even better.

Every fuel injection sequantial or single point, will cover a duty cycle of 0-100%. Although I mention the duty cyle ratio is 1:1 , but the flow ratio will be water jet size/4x fuel injector size.

WhiteEvo05

iTrader: (12)

So you can set a point for pump on and a point for injection begin, or is it just pump on with first injection event?

Richard L

iTrader: (5)

We don't measure fuel rail pressure, ideally we should. One can compensate the drop of flow by match the jet size to the full manifold pressure. It will result in the wfr (water/fuel ratio) slightly richer at low boost but the increase in richness will only be the sq-root of the delta P.

We can make a feed back loop using the flow sensor vs IDC but at present, we don't want to make the system too complicated. It is definately a very good point you raised.

The pump will only comes on during injection, three 125psi internal by-pass valves keep the water pressure stable.


Due to the slow spool up of the pump, we placed an small accumulator to compensate the pressure loss during pump spooling up. We achieve this by extending the pump's switch off period a few milliseconds after the inline valve is shut.


Do you have a link to their website? We can supply a stainless sintered filter with the jet, we only put those filter in the 0.3mm jet, mainly used for port injection. The filter mesh is 25um.




We will build on this system, but only on the controller front. The mechanical component is as far as we can push it, I cannot think of a anything else we can add to improving it.


It will be good to extend this system to port injection as well and inlet tract injection, so you get good charge air cooling as well as very even in-cylinder cooling