Well I finally finished the install on my DDS3 v.10

The v.10 is the newest version and offers some nice refinements.

In addition to installing a new dds3 kit, I also re-wires all the electronics in my car so that they get power and ground from a "universal rail". This way the ECU wires for power and ground are only tapped once. This also helps to eliminate any ground offsets to the electronic devices. Finally it makes working on and installing electronics in the future much easier. I used my old DDS3 v.8 junction board box to hold my little custom board for the power rails. I also including the circuitry for the alt map harness inside the old junction board case.

Here is the old case, old junction board, and new breadboard.


The little blue terminals act the same way as the screw terminals on the aquamist kits. Each side is connected as a separate rail. With the right being all power and the left all being ground.


Here is the new kit components. A new board, gauge, and a new flow sensor with user serviceable ends.


You will notice I also install a connector on the flow sensor, this is for easy service and replacement.


I wanted to use the existing circuitry on the new board for a test button. The board already has a jumper that you can short for a test. I used the connector of an old computer case to bridge this jumper and give me wires to connect to a momentary switch. I did have to drill a matching hole in the top of the case to fit the jumper.


New flow sensor installed in the wiper cowl.


All the wires installed in the new Junction Box


The box when closed


Finished, both boxes are Velcro mounted behind the glove box. All the wires are wrapped in spiral for the first 6 inches extending from the box. You want to leave enough slack in the wires to at least hold the box in you hand while sitting in the pass seat so you can tune it later.

I also used wire loom if the wires are run over a metal edge to make sure the wires are not stripped and shorted.





Summary -

It has been nearly a year since I drove my car on meth. I was out of the country for the first 6 months of this year, and then when I got back I worked on a couple other areas of the car before reinstalling the meth kit.

The car is now a little bit lighter and has a few more parts on it since I last drove it on meth. Anyway the result is simply ridiculous. I am running 31 psi on 100% meth and pump gas. It’s the first time in a while that I can remember the car being genuinely scary. From logs run through data log lab, I am guessing hp and tq to be at 450 and 470 respectively, in a car that weighs 3,000 with me in it. Flooring it in first gear is just silly, as soon as it spools the tires break loose and you are at redline. Amazingly enough, the same thing is pretty much true of second gear as well. In a completely straight line I can lay on the throttle at 3k once the turbo hits full boost, the tires spin like crazy and I am bouncing of the rev limiter. Third is the first gear where I have traction with full throttle in a straight line.

I never imagined traction to be a problem in a straight line with an AWD car. THANK YOU AQUAMIST AND THAT YOU RICHARD!!

 

This is a very good introduction to the v10. Less wires to connect. Thank you.

 

It is a very nice feature that the kit has fewer wires. Makes install and service easier. Now nearly all parts of the kit simply plug in.

I have also modified my kit so that the flow sensor can just unplug. I was also inspired by Jack to install a plug on my pump so that the tank and pump could also be removed easily. If I so desired I think I could swap out every single part of the kit in just a few min. It would be perfect for a rally car that needs serviceable and interchangeable parts.

 

Very nice Alex, that car has to be a blast to drive from what you describe and the last time I saw it. Its so temping to get a beater to use a daily and then put the SRT on a diet but yet do it clean like you did yours. Sorry for the off topic, whats the material use used again.

Richard, The V10 with the plug in is going to make the kits less intimidating to a lot of owners who like to do their own installs. Its also a BIG plus for those who can not do installs or can not afford the kit + labor for the tuners to install + possible time on the dyno...................a huge thumbs up for doing this as I think the tuners and the average installer users are going to REALLY benefit from your hard work on this.

As always, Richards innovation in getting W/A to be some thing to be proud of owning/showing off and using and the Aquamist quality is good for this part of the performance aftermarket......way to go Richard!

 

As always, great install and nice tricks shared by Dudical26 for the community.
I like the "scary" thing very much, thank you for giving us that kind of hopes!

 

Dudical!

Great install! Im doing the same for the flow sensor and HSV in the wiper cowl.
Always glad to see the perfections we can make to the install of these kits.

Congrats

Evan Smith

 

Are you reffering to the black cloth used for the back seats and door pannels?

LINK

 

Thanks for the compliments guys.

what other sort of things would you guys like to see further explained or tested or anything like that.

I am thinking I will do a writeup with step by step for exactly how to set the failsafe window.

Any other ideas of things that you would like to see more off?

 

That's a great offer.... I know it's gonna be time for you but I think it could be valuable to have a comparison on the same set between W/meth vs W/alky, with variation from 50-50% to 0-100%...
Different external factors like price or toxicity get in the move when people make this kind of choice, may be a detailed and constructive analyze could help a lot of us...
I let it to your kindness.
Thanx again anyway for your sharing spirit!
C>

 

I don't think I will mess around with alky (I am assuming you mean denatured alcohol) but I will give it a try with water and with meth and with 25/75, 50/50 and 75/25

I need to find a place where I can just do power pulls all day long without having to worry about the cops. Maybe the track but its always so busy. I really need a runway, lol.

The car is running pretty well right now so that should give me some time to test out different things.

If I am going to test water/meth @ 100/0, 25/75, 50/50, 75/25, 0/100 what should I test for.

- I can see which makes more power obviosly. (Making note of max boost run on each mix)
- I can see how flamable each mixture is.
- I can list freezing temps (just some math no testing)
- I can test to see if they all flow the same out of the nozzle or if one mixtures flows more as I think the nozzle flow rates were tested with water

If I get really crazy maybe I should test with Nitro a bit.

Any other factors to test across different mixtures?

 

It will be hard to find the benifits of all the different mixtures in one day. It took me a year to see the true benifit water at a 50/50 mix had over 100% meth. It just takes longer to tune to see. Not to mention you have to change jet sizes and restrictor sizes and adjust the DDS3 gauge ect ect. But not to say you shouldnt do it. Keep us updated.

Good Luck

Evan Smith

 

what jet size changes do you think would be needed?

Also what intricacies are there to tuning 50/50 compared to meth.

 

Nothing I know you can’t handle or figure out

What jet sizes are you currently running? Where are they located? You know how every evo tunes a little different? What they can handle for timing ect ect? Same goes for injection, you have to find YOUR particular cars liking of 50/50 to make more power than 100% meth. So there’s no true answer for you, your car and set up might like a 20% injection to fuel ratio or a 30% to fuel ratio. I have seen some cars take up to 59% injection to fuel ratio to see the best power from it!!! It just all depends on you, the time needed to find it, and what your car wants.

You need almost, but not always twice the amount of 100% meth as a 50/50 mix to see the same "cooling" effect. Also how the jets are placed can cause a slight effect on the size needed as well. Further away from the intake manifold would require a larger jet as more will be evaporating from the high charge temps.

Tuning 50/50 isn’t like 100% meth, in that 100% meth is like tuning a evo with a big intercooler and 105 octane. Its pretty basic, turn the boost up and the timing lean it out a bit to make up for the extra fuel and your making power. Easy...

H2O you need to first turn the boost up to what you want. Then with water you have to add 1-3 degrees of timing to make up for the loss of burn. Next you need to lean it out more so than normally used to, Evo IX's tend to like 12.5 AFRS at a 50/50 mix towards peak TQ. EGT gauges come in handy here, to show the benefit of the H2O. (No way should this tune be set up for road racing, perfect for street and drag) Then add timing, pump it up...

After many jet changes and many holes in my UPIC I agree with Richard in the fact that 50/50 is the way to go! Not only are your pistons running 40-50 degrees cooler than with 100% meth, you can make as much or more with 50/50! Plus its not nearly as corrosive and the tank last longer too!

There is a sticky at the top of the water injection forum on this site, Injection mixtures 101. Has some other info too.
GL

Evan Smith

 

I think if there are that many factors which can effect the tune of 100 vs 50/50 then it is necessary to further discus theory of 100 v 50/50 so that we can come up with some theoretical and empirical data which supports the idea that 50/50 can make more power. I am gong to sleep now, I'll write another post tomorrow morning to brainstorm some theory

 

Here's a post made by Richard on the SRT-4 forums awhile ago

"Water and methanol injection does the same job in different ways, they both perform in-cylinder cooling and knock suppression well. Since water has a higher latent heat value than methanol, you need to inject twice the amount of methanol by mass to extract the same amount of heat during combustion. This is why all pure alcohol injection systems require a bigger jet, you need to inject 2.5 times by volume more than water. This makes little difference in practice except you need to find a bigger container.

Effect on knock suppression is totally different:
Water suppresses knock by quenching peak flame front temperatures hence regulating the frame propagation speed ? (too fast burn promotes knock). In-perfect charge distribution produces lean and rich pockets. Lean pockets burn at a higher temperature (oxygen-rich = faster) compared to fuel-rich pockets (excess CO slows down burn speed).

Alcohol suppresses detonation by increasing the knock threshold value of a given fuel grade. Since large amount of alcohol is required to control in-cylinder temperatures, air/fuel ratio will be affected significantly. Some fuel has to be removed to avoid over-rich mixture.

Power producing potentials:
In theory, more power will be produced if more charge is jammed into the combustion chamber, resulting in higher cylinder pressure and temperature. In practice, the associated components such as pistons, turbo turbine, etc has a finite operating temperature constraint. This is normally reflected by the EGT. The general accepted EGT figure is about 900C.

Power is basically a force exerted onto the piston per unit of time. Force (pressure) is generated with heated air in a confined space. If cylinder pressure can continue to increase without temperature rise, we have the ultimate power plant. Water injection and alcohol injection will be a good tool to perform this work, lets examine this in more details how each concept can help achieving this.

POWER TUNING:
(Assuming we have a powerful ignition system, a strong engine and unlimited supply of air and fuel).

For water: the task is relatively simple. First generate as much heat as possible by adding more boost and fuel. Water is then injected to absorb the excess heat until EGT is within a permitted safe level. Overall BMEP (Brake Mean Effective Pressure) is now increased due to the vaporized water. The amount of BMEP increase will depend on the mechanical strength of the engine structure. Water?s ability to push the power capability is almost unlimited.

For methanol: First consider using methanol as a fuel instead of Gasoline. Methanol?s ability to increase power is confined to the knock threshold, and available heat to increase the BMEP of an engine. Methanol has only about half of the energy content of gasoline, so twice as much methanol has to be injected to produce the same power. As twice the amount of liquid has to be injected, the cooling effect is huge, resulting in over-cooled combustion chamber, limiting the BMEP. A 100% methanol engine has to use multi-spark ignition system to ensure the mixture is constantly being re-ignited due to the cold combustion chamber. Within those constraints, there is still huge potential of power increase.

A good compromise to inject a percentage of injected into a gasoline engine. This will ensure good inlet and in-cylinder cooling effect, but how much? From reading many results form various forums, it appeared to be between 10-30% to fuel. Unfortunately, the results were not consistent, some got excellent power increase, some experienced engine knock, some misfires and some with very low EGT. Why?

4-5 years ago, AI system was very basic, at a certain manifold pressure, the pump starts and deliver a fixed amount of alcohol into the engine. In those days, results have always been very consistent and yield excellent power increase. But for the past few years, the results have been a mix bag. I could only put this down on the availability of the 2-dimensional AI controller. They are termed as an electronic progressive AI controller. Method of delivery is very similar to the mechanical rising-rate fuel pressure regulator. The flow is governed by the pump speed, the controller reads the manifold pressure via a MAP sensor, translates to a PWM drive signal to the delivery pump.

Lucky for some, the availability of stand-alone, piggyback type of engine controllers give user a high degree of control, changing fuel and ignition timing is a merely rapping a few keys on the laptop. In my view, I think this is the reason for the inconsistent result ? user?s interpretation of quite a complex ratio of methanol and fuel. Taking fuel out of the factory ECU to accommodate a methanol delivery system that has no reference to RPM, is a tall order. There are a few guys on this forum have managed it, I take my hat off to them.

My personal view on this relatively new concept requires a great deal of patience, dyno result means very little compared to logged data. Dyno-graphs always cause argument. I would really hope to see more logged graphs with AFR, Methanol flow rate, and EGT. If possibly the log should include a second to fourth gear run-up so we can spot the afr change due to Methanol. For those who has just embarked on the WAI, tune with 100% water - W50:M50 - 100% methanol and lastly 100% for ultimate power.

Need to clarify, get to experiment with water first and then add alcohol to until you are running 100% methanol. Lastly, you need to go a bit mad with crazy power, 100% water will be best."