Exhale pipe installed
Originally posted by ricetezza
including their future additions to the exhaust system will the total horsepower of the exhaust system breach 25whp?
including their future additions to the exhaust system will the total horsepower of the exhaust system breach 25whp?
I don't see how the exhaust upgrades could give more than 15 or so HP..... I just don't think there is that much power in the exhaust. Maybe I'm wrong, but even a full 3" turbo back is not going to give such a large HP increase....
Actually theres quite a bit if you are looking at gains made by a full hi-flow turbo-back exhaust system on a stock Evo, particularly if that system uses a test pipe to replace the cat. Unfortunately each person has to decide if they are willing to alter the emissions system on their car by removing the cat.
Even retaining the cat , or replacing it with a hiflo race cat, I have seen posts claiming up to 25 whp improvement, and recently I think someone was even claiming 30whp for a TB with test pipe!!!!!.
Realistically 18-22whp seems more likely for most 3" TB systems retaining the cat, and up to 25 whp for TB with test pipe. And of course theres the big controversy over DP size as well.
At the end of the day most systems will share comparable power gains component for component. The differences will be sound quality and tone characteristics, materials and construction quality, and fit and finish. Theres also the warranty factor on the parts, and although most may stand behind their work, will they put it in writing?
I am eager to see the release of the "other" Works exhaust components which will compliment the exhale pipe. Understanding Works philosophy I expect the sum of the parts to form a modular system that can be bolted-in (or out) to replace factory components in whole, or as an entire system. Beyond that I would also expect the solution to be innovative, and not just a carbon copy of the competition. Thats already evident with the Exhale pipe so hopefully we will see some interesting parts continuing to come from our friends at Works!
N10S
Even retaining the cat , or replacing it with a hiflo race cat, I have seen posts claiming up to 25 whp improvement, and recently I think someone was even claiming 30whp for a TB with test pipe!!!!!.
Realistically 18-22whp seems more likely for most 3" TB systems retaining the cat, and up to 25 whp for TB with test pipe. And of course theres the big controversy over DP size as well.
At the end of the day most systems will share comparable power gains component for component. The differences will be sound quality and tone characteristics, materials and construction quality, and fit and finish. Theres also the warranty factor on the parts, and although most may stand behind their work, will they put it in writing?
I am eager to see the release of the "other" Works exhaust components which will compliment the exhale pipe. Understanding Works philosophy I expect the sum of the parts to form a modular system that can be bolted-in (or out) to replace factory components in whole, or as an entire system. Beyond that I would also expect the solution to be innovative, and not just a carbon copy of the competition. Thats already evident with the Exhale pipe so hopefully we will see some interesting parts continuing to come from our friends at Works!
N10S
Last edited by N10S; Sep 7, 2003 at 09:40 PM.
Originally posted by N10S
Actually theres quite a bit if you are looking at gains made by a full hi-flow turbo-back exhaust system on a stock Evo,
Even retaining the cat , or replacing it with a hiflo race cat, I have seen posts claiming up to 25 whp improvement, and recently I think someone was even claiming 30whp for a TB with test pipe!!!!!.
Actually theres quite a bit if you are looking at gains made by a full hi-flow turbo-back exhaust system on a stock Evo,
Even retaining the cat , or replacing it with a hiflo race cat, I have seen posts claiming up to 25 whp improvement, and recently I think someone was even claiming 30whp for a TB with test pipe!!!!!.
Realistically 18-22whp seems more likely for most 3" TB systems retaining the cat, and up to 25 whp for TB with test pipe. And of course theres the big controversy over DP size as well.
I'd say between 10 and 20 would be a more realistic expectation. I've done the exhaust upgrade mods before in many cars and based on 1/4 mile test runs I've not seen very subtantial increases in power. Believe it or not, sometimes there are power losses due to the loss of low end torque caused by larger than necessary pipes, specially in NA cars.
In supercharged and particularly in turbo charged cars, improving flow will always result in power increases but it will also change the power band curve. Sometimes this will make the car seem weaker at certain speeds or RPMs. I'm sure that in some cases there will be very high gains in power from an optimal exhaust improvement. However, in real life I'd not expect much more than a 5% increase in power from an exhaust upgrade.
[B]
I agree. Its also very difficult to understand where one mod adds power within the full scope of the rpm range, particularly when you have multiple mods creating a cumulative affect.
I do believe it, because as a previous E36 M3/4 owner, I have read articles which provided Dyno shootouts of cat-back exhausts.
Some made less hp/tq than the stock system, and none made more than 2-4whp if I remember correctly. Needless to sayI kept my $1200 in my pocket!
High performance NA cars are a blast to drive and own, but anyone thinking that they will get great returns on a cat-back system (particularly an M3 that already has a great stock exhaust) are kidding themselves. Fortunately for us, turbo cars are a different animal entirely!
N10S
Yeah, I've seen those too but with all due respect I take all those claims with a pound of salt
Believe it or not, sometimes there are power losses due to the loss of low end torque caused by larger than necessary pipes, specially in NA cars.
Some made less hp/tq than the stock system, and none made more than 2-4whp if I remember correctly. Needless to sayI kept my $1200 in my pocket!
High performance NA cars are a blast to drive and own, but anyone thinking that they will get great returns on a cat-back system (particularly an M3 that already has a great stock exhaust) are kidding themselves. Fortunately for us, turbo cars are a different animal entirely!
N10S
Last edited by N10S; Sep 8, 2003 at 07:55 AM.
Originally posted by N10S
[B]
I agree. Its also very difficult to understand where one mod adds power within the full scope of the rpm range, particularly when you have multiple mods creating a cumulative affect.
I do believe it, because as a previous E36 M3/4 owner, I have read articles which provided Dyno shootouts of cat-back exhausts.
Some made less hp/tq than the stock system, and none made more than 2-4whp if I remember correctly. Needless to sayI kept my $1200 in my pocket!
High performance NA cars are a blast to drive and own, but anyone thinking that they will get great returns on a cat-back system (particularly an M3 that already has a great stock exhaust) are kidding themselves. Fortunately for us, turbo cars are a different animal entirely!
N10S
[B]
I agree. Its also very difficult to understand where one mod adds power within the full scope of the rpm range, particularly when you have multiple mods creating a cumulative affect.
I do believe it, because as a previous E36 M3/4 owner, I have read articles which provided Dyno shootouts of cat-back exhausts.
Some made less hp/tq than the stock system, and none made more than 2-4whp if I remember correctly. Needless to sayI kept my $1200 in my pocket!
High performance NA cars are a blast to drive and own, but anyone thinking that they will get great returns on a cat-back system (particularly an M3 that already has a great stock exhaust) are kidding themselves. Fortunately for us, turbo cars are a different animal entirely!
N10S
Originally posted by caymandiver75
Yup I too was a previous M3/4 owner and I was a sucker and bought a 650 dollar exhaust for a gain of 3 hp! haha I mostly did it for the weight savings and the sound, which was amazing. Had the active autowerks gen III exhaust.
Yup I too was a previous M3/4 owner and I was a sucker and bought a 650 dollar exhaust for a gain of 3 hp! haha I mostly did it for the weight savings and the sound, which was amazing. Had the active autowerks gen III exhaust.
Not too many engines sound as sweet as the e36 I-6 M engine winding out to redline eh? The new M3 sounds ok, but tends to be more shrill and metallic sounding, almost as if it were ready to blow at higher rpms!
N10S
Yeah the exhaust on the M3 was music to the ears. I have heard the E46 M3 and they just don't compare. Your description was exactly what I think of it too.
Last edited by caymandiver75; Oct 9, 2003 at 09:15 AM.
Originally posted by N10S
Sorry to hi-jack my own post, but.....
Not too many engines sound as sweet as the e36 I-6 M engine winding out to redline eh? The new M3 sounds ok, but tends to be more shrill and metallic sounding, almost as if it were ready to blow at higher rpms!
N10S
Sorry to hi-jack my own post, but.....
Not too many engines sound as sweet as the e36 I-6 M engine winding out to redline eh? The new M3 sounds ok, but tends to be more shrill and metallic sounding, almost as if it were ready to blow at higher rpms!
N10S
Originally posted by m3jstock
How loud is the Exhale on the freeway when cruising at 75 mph. The EVO is my street car (I also have a 1989 M3 race car #236 JP:-) and I want it to remain quiet.
How loud is the Exhale on the freeway when cruising at 75 mph. The EVO is my street car (I also have a 1989 M3 race car #236 JP:-) and I want it to remain quiet.
-- DavidV
Gents, I was on the freeway yesterday up to the city and back and all I can say about the sound of the Exhale is it reminds me of a well tuned sports car, not a ricer. I cruise close to 4k (when its safe to do so) and the exhaust note is sharp and clear not droning like a B-17.
We’ll see what happens when we add the resonator less 70mm IP in a couple weeks.
Rick
We’ll see what happens when we add the resonator less 70mm IP in a couple weeks.
Rick
I just ordered my exhale,,, its back ordered and cant wait for it. if Anyone has the exhale and is getting the works downpipe, or has a down pipe with the exhale, how much louder is it than with just the exhale on?
Thanks
Thanks