It is more dangerous than your stock 3 point seat belt.

 

Do tell, you must have some deeply profound knowledge contrary to physics:

http://www.umtri.umich.edu/content.php?id=936

 

Still not getting through. I give up. The harness looks great, I love it. Good luck and stay safe.

 

And what would the legal argument be? Do you have proof of damages? I'm sure Schroth has disclaimers.

The problem with how you have installed the harness is simple, what happens if the car rolls over and you're strapped in? The video you posted is only looking at a front end collision in a controlled situation. There are lots of other variables. What about the airbag? I've heard of people getting their face badly damaged by airbags when using a harness because the bag fully expands. What about a side impact? Your upper body is strapped in so what happens to your neck?

 

Airbags are an issue regardless of seat belt/harness (unless you remove them, full race car). People burn face/arms regardless of what type of seat belt (fact).
Helmet is for head.
HANS device is for necks, not harness belts.

Like I said, yes a roll bar would be optimal. But calling the harness "unsafe" is completely false.

 

Burn, yes, but what I'm talking about is the result of a setup that stops you from moving forward.

Thanks, I'm well aware how a helmet and HANS work since I own and use both. That doesn't explain how the setup you have is safe.

A harness, as you have it installed, is unsafe. It's not about what is optimal. You have no roll over protection. For autocross use, this isn't really an issue. For street driving or track driving, it's definitely a concern. I think a better option for people who do not want a roll bar is a CG Lock.

 

Or a harness bar with proper hardware. The harness bar is great, because you can perfectly mount a GoPro in between the seats. I like that.

 

Harness bars are a good way to mount a harness, but don't offer any additional roll over protection.

 

If anything I learned a few things with this Thread.
1. Great install of a product I was curious about
2. I didn't know about cg locks.

I was also looking at harness bars for track use but recently seen a few picture and forums showing crashes with cars that had them. It looked like the drivers would have been better off useing standard lap belt as they were either ejected from the car or back was broken due to the bar bending in the crash!

 

Found this:
http://www.marcanthonyross.com/2012/...the-right-way/

Biggest things I learned from reading it:

1. Harness need to be mounted to be level with the shoulders or you could break your back from compression.
2. A 4 point and 3 point harness have "submarine" issue where the driver can slip under the lap belt and fly into the firewall/steering column.
3. ?????
4. If you love your ***** don't buy a 5 point.
5. You can install a harness without a harness bar safely but it requires work.
6. A harness bar is all that is needed to safely install a harness but a cage is safer.
7. if you don't have racing seats don't bother, you need even tension on the belts.
8. harnesses have a good-thru date according to FIA, but don't go bad for street or light track use.
9. Be dumb so I can have your car parts when you crash.
10. 9 is a joke don't get mad, get glad!
11. Profit!

 

The reason that a 4 (or 5 or 6)-point harness setup (without an added roll bar or some sort of additional reinforcement of that nature) is considered less safe than a standard 3-point belt is most specifically discussed in rollover instances. The problem is that when a vehicle rolls over, there is high potential for crushing of the roof/pillars.

With a regular 3-point belt, there is an open shoulder that is not secured and this allows your body an avenue of travel so that your body has somewhere to go to avoid being completely flattened. See also: But all joking aside, it really does make sense if you think about it.

With a multi-point harness, your body is secured in place and if your car flips, you have nowhere to crumple to avoid being flattened like a pancake. That's why they're considered less safe without the addition of roll bars.

 

Safety isn't dictated how many points your harness has. The stock safety system is just that, a system. All the components are designed to work together. This means the airbags, the seat, the seat-belt and the structure of the car itself is designed to work with the way it is all set up. If you change out the seat belt, you've now compromised this system. A major risk is what happens during a roll over. The stock system is designed so that if the roof caves in, the stock seat can move, or your body can move, out of the way. With a 4-point, this can't happen. The seat is tethered in the upright position. 4-pt harnesses also run the risk of submarining, which means you fully or partially slide out the bottom of the harness.

 

A lot of organizations would not let you race with a harness as shown here. For autocross, it's fine since you're unlikely to roll over while autocrossing but track racing is a whole new ballgame.