94AWDcoupe

iTrader: (125)

My best run was 11.85 @ 116.39 60-foot of 1.721

Thing thats sucks is this was bouncing off the rev limiter in 4th. I even raised the limiter to 8200 and it still did not give me enough room.

I know with a slightly longer 4th or higher revs the car would be good for 11.7 or 11.6

I got a nice 60 foot of 1.687 one run but I tried shifting to fifth and it did not really work. Wound up running 11.9 @ 109

Maybe I can put a taller tire on it and then I will get some 11.7's or 11.6's for sure.

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No disrespect for the poster of this quote. There are hundreds of quotes like this all over this board. I am just using this as an example.



I am really tired of these type statements. It is really without knowledge to say your car will improve .1-.2 in the quarter by not having to shift to 5th. So here are some facts for you. At 120mph you are moving at 176ft per second. During a shift you loose acceration but not speed. What this means is instead of being able to accelerate to 177ft per second you stay at 176fps during your shift. So what does that do to your ET? Not much. Not worth crying about. But worth discussing just this once. In a drag race I have noticed how much distance my car looses during a shift. In a really close race where you are door to door it is really easy to tell how much distance your car looses during a shift. For me it is about 2 feet on a good shift and 6 feet on a really bad shift. Perfect example is I was racing a mustang and our cars were really close in performance. Door to door in fact. He couldn't pull on me and I couldn't pull on him. When it came time to shift to 5th I look at his car and see how much distance I loose. Since this is a mustang and his gears are spaced different during my whole shift the mustang is still accelerating. I loose 2ft during my shift to 5th. Are you with me so far? Shifting to 5th costs me 2ft. but at a time when the car is moving 176fps. That means my ET will suffer by having to drive an additional 2 ft at 176fps. or .011 seconds. So in reality your ET will plummet by .01 on a good shift and only .03 on a real granny shift . Is this really worth crying about? What really erks me about this is all the threads that people are considering dropping their rear end ratio to the 4.11 down from factory 4.53. What this does is make your car excellerate SLOWER in every gear. Your ET will suffer 1-2 tenths from doing this. Be smart people and do some basic math. Relax and shift to 5th.

mdog

Thank you! Who knows if it will fall on dear ears or not, but it needed to be logically stated as you have.

94AWDcoupe

iTrader: (125)

And some more basic math and actual experience on the subject. Adding a 4.11 diff to your car is like installing taller tires. Stock tire height is 25.4 inches. Multiply 25.4 by 4.53, then divide by 4.11. That is your new gear ratio. If you install a 27.99 inch tall tire on your car instead of swapping the diff you will get an idea of what a power robber the 4.11 diff will be.

About 6 years ago a friend of mine had an eclipse with basic upgrades that was running the factory 24.8 inch tires. His car ran consistant 12.3 in the quarter. One day I decided to show him one of the reasons my mirage with 4g63 drivetrain was so dang quick. I installed my 23.4 inch tires on his car. The first drive was mind boggling. Third gear felt almost as fast as the old second. The car went 11.8 at the track with no other changes.

Note that going from 23.4 to 24.8 tire is like dropping the gear ratio from 4.53 to 4.27. Now try to image one more time what a 4.11 diff is going to do for you , cause that is even lower than a drop to 4.27. I dont even want to know how much exceleration TREs 3.7 diff kills.

I hope this puts to rest your interest in installing a 4.11 in your car. It sure does for me.

Jooyoung99

iTrader: (1)

I never thought of that way. I always assumed that it would cost .5 second for additional shift. Thanks for the enlightment.

inco9nito99

iTrader: (90)

very intelligent..taller tyres for the E9's it is!

gamebred26

iTrader: (19)

well i just got the evo 8 4th gear installed cause i was having the same issue...hitting the rev limiter in 4th at the line so i know with a bigger turbo i would be screwed..

some say get taller tires but tires ain't cheap either...

i will let you know this weekend if my et changes at all...just from the gear swap..

crcain

Here is some graphs from vbox data from the MLR 30-130 days. Gives you an idea of speed lost during shifts. If you search MLR there is a lot of graphs to find like these:






Original thread here:

http://www.lancerregister.com/showth...ht=30-130+vbox

Joe's Evo X

iTrader: (4)

You guys are talking about the time it takes to shift into 5 gear, but know has brought up how much the Evo X bogs in 5th. I rather stay in 4 with longer gears where i am still in my power band, then shifting into 5th and having it bog on you

EatSleepBoost

iTrader: (9)

yea im at like 7300 at the end of the 1/4 in 4th. def need to change something

PeteyTurbo

iTrader: (9)

Whats not being brought up is the fact that the stock turbo is not making nearly as much power at 8000 rpm as it would be around 6500 with good gearing, not to mention the awkardness of the 5th gear engagement and damage you can cause by slamming it repeatedly down the 1320..Just thought I'd mix it up

Mr. Evo IX

iTrader: (5)

subscribed.

RyuEvoIX

iTrader: (10)

You still have plenty of room left before you need longer gearing. Im reving out to 8k rpms WITH taller tires in 4th gear at the end of the 1/4. Id get taller tires and more power mods before dropping the big coin to change out the gears if I were you.

Boltz.

iTrader: (42)

Wow, super old thread revival!

Hah, I didn't comment on it when I saw it over a year ago, but now I will.

Your math and logic is right on Jerry, I just don't understand why I've gone my fastest times bouncing fourth like 10 times as opposed to hitting fifth? I've tried it like 10 times either way and its always quicker staying in fourth upto 7800 with the stock turbo to boot!

I thought at first this may be because I am shifting into 5th right before the traps so I shifted earlier 7300-7400 ( which wasn't an optimal shift point in my car, even with the stock turbo and thats a fact) and the car still went slower. Maybe the difference with the sub-optimal shift point negated the benefit from continued acceleration, but I still trapped higher staying in 4th.

This may be and exception to the rule?

Just trying to add good discussion....

Boltz

4kinboost

iTrader: (10)

Question for you 6-speed guys....

If you are concerned about the high rpm's in 4th and wanting to stay out of fifth why fight it??

Go to a SHORTER tire like the 23.4 mentioned, shift EARLIER, stay in your power/tq band for more avg time down the 1/4 mile, and drop .2-.3 off the 60ft times.

Instant et-- and the rotational weight loss can't hurt either.


American muscle cars have gone steeper (numerically higher) in final drive ratio's for years. ALWAYS good for .3-.5 tenths. Why fight science?

PeteyTurbo

iTrader: (9)

But smaller sidewall=less foward grip, the sidewall is your best friend as far as 60 foot times are concerned..