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Is there a more accurate, readily available method to test it?
The vial only shows numbers within a range and with steps of 5 percent between the markings. You can only guess one measure of greater precision than given. So you can tell it is between 85 and 90 but you have to guess to give greater precision. Thus 87 or 88 would be a reasonable valid guess. You can not guess two measures of greater precision, i.e. 87.5, because science.
No shortage of E85 in MI...there is also an actual report that shows what blends are when in which areas of the country.
Three Vapor Classes have been
established that determine the
percentage of denatured ethanol and
hydrocarbon that need to be blended
to maintain “on-spec product”. Class 1
(85/15) is the summer blend; Class 2
(80/20) is the transition blend utilized
in the spring and fall; and Class 3
(75/25) is the winter blend. The
percentage of volatile hydrocarbons is
increased in the winter to aid in
colder weather “startability”.
Is there a more accurate, readily available method to test it?
Lol, yes Im sure there are more accurate ways to measure the content but in reality it doesnt matter. I have that same tester and have used it with success for years now. Whether the percentage is 87% or 85% or 81% really doesnt make much of a difference to me. I have it for the times that you test it to be 50% so I know to stay away.
And as far as that schedule is concerned, I've seen that before but I wonder how true that actually is? For example the past year I've been getting my e85 from the same station and its almost always a little over 80% I actually havent ever seen it down in the 70% ever in MA.
Now I found it once to be about 50% but that was a one off and a situation where the owner spiked it with pump fuel to drive down the cost at the time.
But on the flip side I used to travel a lot to Long Island (ex GF dont ask, lol!) and they had e85 stations all over the place. But come winter time and almost every station I went to was 70% vs the 85% months prior.
I've said this a million times and I'll keep saying it. If you wanna run e85 and dont have a flex fuel setup test the gas every single time you fill up before you fill up. All it takes is one bad fillup to cost you an engine. And if you're really luckily maybe you can crack the bell housing in the trans too for ultimate carnage!
Lol, yes Im sure there are more accurate ways to measure the content but in reality it doesnt matter. I have that same tester and have used it with success for years now. Whether the percentage is 87% or 85% or 81% really doesnt make much of a difference to me. I have it for the times that you test it to be 50% so I know to stay away.
And as far as that schedule is concerned, I've seen that before but I wonder how true that actually is? For example the past year I've been getting my e85 from the same station and its almost always a little over 80% I actually havent ever seen it down in the 70% ever in MA.
Now I found it once to be about 50% but that was a one off and a situation where the owner spiked it with pump fuel to drive down the cost at the time.
But on the flip side I used to travel a lot to Long Island (ex GF dont ask, lol!) and they had e85 stations all over the place. But come winter time and almost every station I went to was 70% vs the 85% months prior.
I've said this a million times and I'll keep saying it. If you wanna run e85 and dont have a flex fuel setup test the gas every single time you fill up before you fill up. All it takes is one bad fillup to cost you an engine. And if you're really luckily maybe you can crack the bell housing in the trans too for ultimate carnage!
+1 for testing it beforehand. I do not run full E85 in my tank, just in my fuel cell for port injection (direct injection stays w/ pump 93), so I only need to do it a few times a season to check to make sure it's really 85%.
Thanks for posting that schedule. I'll test it again during those transition months to see if it's true. I guess it's better to tune your car in the winter because the gas blend isn't as pure as the summer?
And as far as that schedule is concerned, I've seen that before but I wonder how true that actually is? For example the past year I've been getting my e85 from the same station and its almost always a little over 80% I actually havent ever seen it down in the 70% ever in MA.
yea, always been average E78 or above here in Northern California for the last six plus years, year round....
Thanks for posting that schedule. I'll test it again during those transition months to see if it's true. I guess it's better to tune your car in the winter because the gas blend isn't as pure as the summer?
I'm not so sure about that but there are a lot of factors to take into account. Lets think for a second about what we know. As the alcohol content goes up in the fuel the car will run leaner and leaner hence why we need to run larger injectors when swapping to e85.
Another thing that we know is the higher ethanol content allows for more boost and more timing due to the higher octane rating and the cooling properties of the alcohol hence why more power can be made on e85.
Now in reality the different in tunes from 75% ethanol to 85% ethanol isn't that drastic; Bryan commented on that earlier in this thread...
But at the end of the day its really going to depend on your specific tune and if its on kill mode for every last hp or if its conservative.
Leaner is meaner so if you were tuned on e85 running on the winter blend you'd think would be safer vs being tuned on the winter blend and running on 85%. But they each have their own shortcomings so to speak as I just mentioned.
That's my take on it but maybe someone more knowledgeable on this topic can chime in and provide a more sophisticated response.
No shortage of E85 in MI...there is also an actual report that shows what blends are when in which areas of the country.
Three Vapor Classes have been
established that determine the
percentage of denatured ethanol and
hydrocarbon that need to be blended
to maintain “on-spec product”. Class 1
(85/15) is the summer blend; Class 2
(80/20) is the transition blend utilized
in the spring and fall; and Class 3
(75/25) is the winter blend. The
percentage of volatile hydrocarbons is
increased in the winter to aid in
colder weather “startability”.
This is an older document. Ive seen it around. Did the website you get it off of show a date?
Yep that table has been around for years. Where I live, best I can tell, the stations that get their E85 from the fuel terminal have been selling winter blend E70 year around. Stations that have blender pumps switch back and forth from winter and summer blend with no intermediate blend. I suspect that the fuel terminals will at some point change to dispensing E50 year around instead of E70 since that is probably what the oil companies want. They may have switched already, I just don't go to the stations without blender pumps anymore. Blender pump stations stock E98 and set the blend at the pump. I'm pretty sure they get the E98 trucked in from ethanol plants.
The blender pump stations see all the tuner cars and people filling up large fuel cans. People coming in from all around to their stations. They know if they want this business they need to sell fuel with the highest ethanol content. They hear people ask "have you switched to the summer blend yet?" If you are unhappy with the ethanol content, be nice but let the station employees know it does matter to you.
I have 9 different tunes, one for each 10% change in ethanol. I can toggle thru them if my ethanol content gage changes after a fill up. With the car I have, I can run full boost (wastegates do not open at all) for anything E70 and above. With below E70 I have to set the ebc to limit boost, so I really try to keep my fuel above E70.
found some interesting stuff for California. E85 is taxed differently then regular gasoline. Here we have the "Motor Vehicle Fuel Tax" and the "Use Fuel Tax". The use fuel tax is half of what the Motor vehicle fuel tax is, and to qualify the blend can contain at maximum 15% gasoline. Further the gasoline used to blend the E85 will have the MVFT refunded only if it is used to blend a maximum of 15% gasoline fuel. All that being said it doesn't seem likely we will be seeing blends of greater then 15% gasoline here because of the tax structures/incentives in place.
Oct 25, 2016, 07:37 AM
