Mellon Tuning stock EVO 8 turbo vs BBK Full vs FP HTA Green 93 octane
Sep 26, 2009, 04:08 PM
#76
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that is just a little bit more considering the fuel used 
the stock 9 turbo is pretty darn good unit period. I could not gain as much as the others on this board with the bbk full, but that might be due to not optimized setup or due to the fact that I could hold boost till redline with the stock turbo with my AVCR...
I believe that the best setup (value for money wise) for me has been tbe, licp, o2, drop in + cosi cams. anything else added after that aps intercooler, FR manifold, bbk full, 680cc injectors (maxed out w/t bbk) & perrin intake gave very minor gains - similar to the car tested above. for a street car, the gains arent worth the cost imho....
the stock 9 turbo is pretty darn good unit period. I could not gain as much as the others on this board with the bbk full, but that might be due to not optimized setup or due to the fact that I could hold boost till redline with the stock turbo with my AVCR... I believe that the best setup (value for money wise) for me has been tbe, licp, o2, drop in + cosi cams. anything else added after that aps intercooler, FR manifold, bbk full, 680cc injectors (maxed out w/t bbk) & perrin intake gave very minor gains - similar to the car tested above. for a street car, the gains arent worth the cost imho....
Last edited by Bosshog; Sep 26, 2009 at 04:11 PM.
Sep 26, 2009, 04:20 PM
#77
that is just a little bit more considering the fuel used the stock 9 turbo is pretty darn good unit period. I could not gain as much as the others on this board with the bbk full, but that might be due to not optimized setup or due to the fact that I could hold boost till redline with the stock turbo with my AVCR...
I believe that the best setup (value for money wise) for me has been tbe, licp, o2, drop in + cosi cams. anything else added after that aps intercooler, FR manifold, bbk full, 680cc injectors (maxed out w/t bbk) & perrin intake gave very minor gains - similar to the car tested above. for a street car, the gains arent worth the cost imho....
the stock 9 turbo is pretty darn good unit period. I could not gain as much as the others on this board with the bbk full, but that might be due to not optimized setup or due to the fact that I could hold boost till redline with the stock turbo with my AVCR... I believe that the best setup (value for money wise) for me has been tbe, licp, o2, drop in + cosi cams. anything else added after that aps intercooler, FR manifold, bbk full, 680cc injectors (maxed out w/t bbk) & perrin intake gave very minor gains - similar to the car tested above. for a street car, the gains arent worth the cost imho....
you would be better off getting a evo 9 turbo for 400 shipped or so and going that route saving a ton of money. If you want more power fp red even more fp black and finally the big boys toys 35r and above.
Last edited by RockmanX; Sep 26, 2009 at 04:23 PM.
Sep 26, 2009, 04:22 PM
#78
I would still like to see another test of the HTA green, with a boost plot as well. So far, all we have are two results, with completely different numbers. This test by Mellon, with mediocre results and the test by liqquid, with extraordinary results. Without seeing the boost curve for Mellon's tune, it's hard to compare anything.
All I know is that the HTA Green has a 54lb/min compressor wheel, compared to the BBK's 47 lb/min wheel. That's roughly a 70HP difference between the two when maxed out. The stock turbo for comparison has about a 43 lb/min wheel.
So, the HTA, in theory (and from the numbers that Liqquid showed) should be able to outperform the BBK easily up top. But, if you aren't running the boost to do so, then you won't see any difference. That's why I asked Mellon what the boost at redline was. Heck, even the stock turbo will give great numbers if we are only shooting for 22-24 psi at redline, but that's maxed for a stock turbo, whereas the HTA green should be able to hold much more for roughly 100 more HP.
I'm maxing out my stock turbo on E-85 right now and I would like to upgrade, but I can't bring myself to upgrade to a turbo with just 3 lb/min more potential. I'm already getting ~400 awhp on the stock turbo, so if I were to upgrade I would want something to actually be an upgrade. That's where the HTA green *should* fit in, if maxed out. Then, a bit more, if you opt for the Red. But, my point is that we need to see the turbo maxed out to see what it can actually do. Running it at less than maximum will just have people saying that it's no better than a stock turbo or a BBK, etc.
Eric
All I know is that the HTA Green has a 54lb/min compressor wheel, compared to the BBK's 47 lb/min wheel. That's roughly a 70HP difference between the two when maxed out. The stock turbo for comparison has about a 43 lb/min wheel.
So, the HTA, in theory (and from the numbers that Liqquid showed) should be able to outperform the BBK easily up top. But, if you aren't running the boost to do so, then you won't see any difference. That's why I asked Mellon what the boost at redline was. Heck, even the stock turbo will give great numbers if we are only shooting for 22-24 psi at redline, but that's maxed for a stock turbo, whereas the HTA green should be able to hold much more for roughly 100 more HP.
I'm maxing out my stock turbo on E-85 right now and I would like to upgrade, but I can't bring myself to upgrade to a turbo with just 3 lb/min more potential. I'm already getting ~400 awhp on the stock turbo, so if I were to upgrade I would want something to actually be an upgrade. That's where the HTA green *should* fit in, if maxed out. Then, a bit more, if you opt for the Red. But, my point is that we need to see the turbo maxed out to see what it can actually do. Running it at less than maximum will just have people saying that it's no better than a stock turbo or a BBK, etc.
Eric
Last edited by l2r99gst; Sep 26, 2009 at 04:25 PM.
Sep 26, 2009, 04:37 PM
#79
I would still like to see another test of the HTA green, with a boost plot as well. So far, all we have are two results, with completely different numbers. This test by Mellon, with mediocre results and the test by liqquid, with extraordinary results. Without seeing the boost curve for Mellon's tune, it's hard to compare anything.
All I know is that the HTA Green has a 54lb/min compressor wheel, compared to the BBK's 47 lb/min wheel. That's roughly a 70HP difference between the two when maxed out. The stock turbo for comparison has about a 43 lb/min wheel.
So, the HTA, in theory (and from the numbers that Liqquid showed) should be able to outperform the BBK easily up top. But, if you aren't running the boost to do so, then you won't see any difference. That's why I asked Mellon what the boost at redline was. Heck, even the stock turbo will give great numbers if we are only shooting for 22-24 psi at redline, but that's maxed for a stock turbo, whereas the HTA green should be able to hold much more for roughly 100 more HP.
I'm maxing out my stock turbo on E-85 right now and I would like to upgrade, but I can't bring myself to upgrade to a turbo with just 3 lb/min more potential. I'm already getting ~400 awhp on the stock turbo, so if I were to upgrade I would want something to actually be an upgrade. That's where the HTA green *should* fit in, if maxed out. Then, a bit more, if you opt for the Red. But, my point is that we need to see the turbo maxed out to see what it can actually do. Running it at less than maximum will just have people saying that it's no better than a stock turbo or a BBK, etc.
Eric
All I know is that the HTA Green has a 54lb/min compressor wheel, compared to the BBK's 47 lb/min wheel. That's roughly a 70HP difference between the two when maxed out. The stock turbo for comparison has about a 43 lb/min wheel.
So, the HTA, in theory (and from the numbers that Liqquid showed) should be able to outperform the BBK easily up top. But, if you aren't running the boost to do so, then you won't see any difference. That's why I asked Mellon what the boost at redline was. Heck, even the stock turbo will give great numbers if we are only shooting for 22-24 psi at redline, but that's maxed for a stock turbo, whereas the HTA green should be able to hold much more for roughly 100 more HP.
I'm maxing out my stock turbo on E-85 right now and I would like to upgrade, but I can't bring myself to upgrade to a turbo with just 3 lb/min more potential. I'm already getting ~400 awhp on the stock turbo, so if I were to upgrade I would want something to actually be an upgrade. That's where the HTA green *should* fit in, if maxed out. Then, a bit more, if you opt for the Red. But, my point is that we need to see the turbo maxed out to see what it can actually do. Running it at less than maximum will just have people saying that it's no better than a stock turbo or a BBK, etc.
Eric
Then buy one and unlock the magic for us all the see LOL.
I think Ill be waiting for the BLACK!
Sep 26, 2009, 05:10 PM
#81
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lol go team! I had someone contact me today about tuning their black when it arrives, I'm looking forward to sharing that data.
my e85 HTA Green tune fell through today at MOD, he had some issues with getting the old bolts out. Hopefully we'll do it remotely when he gets it back together.
my e85 HTA Green tune fell through today at MOD, he had some issues with getting the old bolts out. Hopefully we'll do it remotely when he gets it back together.
Sep 26, 2009, 06:15 PM
#88
lol go team! I had someone contact me today about tuning their black when it arrives, I'm looking forward to sharing that data.
my e85 HTA Green tune fell through today at MOD, he had some issues with getting the old bolts out. Hopefully we'll do it remotely when he gets it back together.
my e85 HTA Green tune fell through today at MOD, he had some issues with getting the old bolts out. Hopefully we'll do it remotely when he gets it back together.
I see your coming soon list will it be you unlocking the magic. Whats ETA TILL YOU GET ONE!!!
Sep 26, 2009, 06:35 PM
#89
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was that me that contact you lol cause i have a uninstalled red now and most likely will own a black when it comes out doubt my car will be together by then unless the fp black gets delay till january. I kind of hope it does actually so i have it all together then go see you for a tune on the red and then go to db auto have them swap it all out and then retune that would be perfect
Sep 26, 2009, 06:41 PM
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that is just a little bit more considering the fuel used the stock 9 turbo is pretty darn good unit period. I could not gain as much as the others on this board with the bbk full, but that might be due to not optimized setup or due to the fact that I could hold boost till redline with the stock turbo with my AVCR...
I believe that the best setup (value for money wise) for me has been tbe, licp, o2, drop in + cosi cams. anything else added after that aps intercooler, FR manifold, bbk full, 680cc injectors (maxed out w/t bbk) & perrin intake gave very minor gains - similar to the car tested above. for a street car, the gains arent worth the cost imho....
the stock 9 turbo is pretty darn good unit period. I could not gain as much as the others on this board with the bbk full, but that might be due to not optimized setup or due to the fact that I could hold boost till redline with the stock turbo with my AVCR... I believe that the best setup (value for money wise) for me has been tbe, licp, o2, drop in + cosi cams. anything else added after that aps intercooler, FR manifold, bbk full, 680cc injectors (maxed out w/t bbk) & perrin intake gave very minor gains - similar to the car tested above. for a street car, the gains arent worth the cost imho....
more of an argument for why the stock 9 turbo is so effective. makes sense considering that folks have been trying to max out the stock 9 turbo since 2005.
consider this - boltz's run at 126.5 eclipses 19 out of 20 stock turbos on that list. #20 on that list traps at 117.1. #20 on that list is pretty fast for a stock turbo and decisively faster than your garden variety evo ix with bolt ons + tune. curious to see what a bbk would do with the same level commitment (for drag racing) that #1 on that list put into his stock IX turbo build.
we'll have to agree to disagree here. the bbk definitely represents more than "just alittle bit more".
(btw, can someone put a limit to how many times rockmanx can reply in the same day on the same thread, his posts are jibberish)