Mellon Tuning stock EVO 8 turbo vs BBK Full vs FP HTA Green 93 octane
Sep 26, 2009, 07:17 PM
#91
more of an argument for why the stock 9 turbo is so effective. makes sense considering that folks have been trying to max out the stock 9 turbo since 2005.
consider this - boltz's run at 126.5 eclipses 19 out of 20 stock turbos on that list. #20 on that list traps at 117.1. #20 on that list is pretty fast for a stock turbo and decisively faster than your garden variety evo ix with bolt ons + tune. curious to see what a bbk would do with the same level commitment (for drag racing) that #1 on that list put into his stock IX turbo build.
we'll have to agree to disagree here. the bbk definitely represents more than "just alittle bit more".
(btw, can someone put a limit to how many times rockmanx can reply in the same day on the same thread, his posts are jibberish)
consider this - boltz's run at 126.5 eclipses 19 out of 20 stock turbos on that list. #20 on that list traps at 117.1. #20 on that list is pretty fast for a stock turbo and decisively faster than your garden variety evo ix with bolt ons + tune. curious to see what a bbk would do with the same level commitment (for drag racing) that #1 on that list put into his stock IX turbo build.
we'll have to agree to disagree here. the bbk definitely represents more than "just alittle bit more".
(btw, can someone put a limit to how many times rockmanx can reply in the same day on the same thread, his posts are jibberish)
This is true, and I will admit that the IX turbo is one HELLUVA turbo. But make no mistake, if one can run a 12.00 on a stock turbo, he should be able run a 11.50 with a larger one. If the red or HTA green for that matter flows that much more than the stock turbo then in turn, it SHOULD give you a decent power increase. But it truly doesnt matter what kind of turbo you have unless you have a good tune. If there are guys running the same times with a stock turbo vs. a bbk or green, then the guy with the bbk or green has some problems. On paper, the power should be there, period.
Sep 27, 2009, 01:38 AM
#92
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boltz gained alot more than me with the BBK so it was a very good buy for him. Even for me, it was a better buy than APS 3.5" intercooler, UICP or FR Manifold wich gave me nothing measurable - at least with the BBK I got slighty more power up top with worse fuel (and 250rpm slower spool).
All I am saying is that your milage may vary - you cant just look at boltz's results and assume you will gain 60hp by just bolting on the turbo.... This guy only made about 20more hp with various mods including bbk. later the same story - ported head, a slightly larger turbo and another 20hp. was it worth it - only he can answer.
All I am saying is that your milage may vary - you cant just look at boltz's results and assume you will gain 60hp by just bolting on the turbo.... This guy only made about 20more hp with various mods including bbk. later the same story - ported head, a slightly larger turbo and another 20hp. was it worth it - only he can answer.
more of an argument for why the stock 9 turbo is so effective. makes sense considering that folks have been trying to max out the stock 9 turbo since 2005.
consider this - boltz's run at 126.5 eclipses 19 out of 20 stock turbos on that list. #20 on that list traps at 117.1. #20 on that list is pretty fast for a stock turbo and decisively faster than your garden variety evo ix with bolt ons + tune. curious to see what a bbk would do with the same level commitment (for drag racing) that #1 on that list put into his stock IX turbo build.
we'll have to agree to disagree here. the bbk definitely represents more than "just alittle bit more".
(btw, can someone put a limit to how many times rockmanx can reply in the same day on the same thread, his posts are jibberish)
consider this - boltz's run at 126.5 eclipses 19 out of 20 stock turbos on that list. #20 on that list traps at 117.1. #20 on that list is pretty fast for a stock turbo and decisively faster than your garden variety evo ix with bolt ons + tune. curious to see what a bbk would do with the same level commitment (for drag racing) that #1 on that list put into his stock IX turbo build.
we'll have to agree to disagree here. the bbk definitely represents more than "just alittle bit more".
(btw, can someone put a limit to how many times rockmanx can reply in the same day on the same thread, his posts are jibberish)
Sep 27, 2009, 11:08 AM
#95
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wild that you could get 32psi out of a stock IX at 6k...we're lucky to get 28psi at 300ft, of course that may just mean that your engine is bottle-necking and not necessarily indicative of better power.
Sep 27, 2009, 02:28 PM
#96
It's been mentioned a couple times as in progression of turboes to get. As others have said why get green or bbk might as well do 9 red 35r and I stated don't forget black. There are your cliff notes since you seem to have selective reading skills
back on topic
anymore greens coming in for tuning mellon?
Sep 27, 2009, 02:56 PM
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Nothing is scheduled right now. Customer with an HTA Green we were supposed to tune at MOD fell through due to his car not being ready. He has a stock shortblock so we'll probably run lower boost and timing per his request to keep the stock bottom end happy. Hope to follow up with him via an e-mail tune.
Sep 27, 2009, 04:29 PM
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It's been mentioned a couple times as in progression of turboes to get. As others have said why get green or bbk might as well do 9 red 35r and I stated don't forget black. There are your cliff notes since you seem to have selective reading skills
back on topic
anymore greens coming in for tuning mellon?
back on topic
anymore greens coming in for tuning mellon?
staying on topic would include talking about the difference between a bbk and a hta green that mellon was nice enough to share results with us. the so called fp black or even a 35r dont even belong in this thread, they arent even close to what is on the table, completely different class of turbos. there is a reason people buy bbks and greens and its simple, they dont want to have to run 32 or so pounds of boost on a stock turbo with meth or e85 to get the results they want. some of us including myself arent lucky enough to have e85 stations around where we live and using meth just adds another thing that could go wrong and more expense to daily driving the car.
the bbk and green offer a higher level of power on a more reliable setup that is effecient on pump gas and are crazy fast with good spool, for road racing, auto x, and evn a little drag racing if thats what you like. that is what this thread is about.
mellon- i read somewhere that you expected the green to crush or outperform the bbk in every aspect, has this testing changed your opinion on that or do you still feel the same way and why???
jeff
Sep 27, 2009, 04:32 PM
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I hoped for more from the HTA Green, the BBK Full seems to be every bit as capable at a glance. Maybe Eric will install the BBK Full in the future and have me tune it again now that it has the head work advantage.
Sep 27, 2009, 06:31 PM
#100
Ill leave it alone
yeah actually mellon tuning a turbo that isnt even out yet that you dont even own, isnt on topic. how bout when you actually purchase one and it is on your car we talk about it then. this forum is allready full enough of bench racing, and peole's fairy tail set ups.
staying on topic would include talking about the difference between a bbk and a hta green that mellon was nice enough to share results with us. the so called fp black or even a 35r dont even belong in this thread, they arent even close to what is on the table, completely different class of turbos. there is a reason people buy bbks and greens and its simple, they dont want to have to run 32 or so pounds of boost on a stock turbo with meth or e85 to get the results they want. some of us including myself arent lucky enough to have e85 stations around where we live and using meth just adds another thing that could go wrong and more expense to daily driving the car.
the bbk and green offer a higher level of power on a more reliable setup that is effecient on pump gas and are crazy fast with good spool, for road racing, auto x, and evn a little drag racing if thats what you like. that is what this thread is about.
mellon- i read somewhere that you expected the green to crush or outperform the bbk in every aspect, has this testing changed your opinion on that or do you still feel the same way and why???
jeff
staying on topic would include talking about the difference between a bbk and a hta green that mellon was nice enough to share results with us. the so called fp black or even a 35r dont even belong in this thread, they arent even close to what is on the table, completely different class of turbos. there is a reason people buy bbks and greens and its simple, they dont want to have to run 32 or so pounds of boost on a stock turbo with meth or e85 to get the results they want. some of us including myself arent lucky enough to have e85 stations around where we live and using meth just adds another thing that could go wrong and more expense to daily driving the car.
the bbk and green offer a higher level of power on a more reliable setup that is effecient on pump gas and are crazy fast with good spool, for road racing, auto x, and evn a little drag racing if thats what you like. that is what this thread is about.
mellon- i read somewhere that you expected the green to crush or outperform the bbk in every aspect, has this testing changed your opinion on that or do you still feel the same way and why???
jeff
Sep 30, 2009, 05:53 AM
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This is true, and I will admit that the IX turbo is one HELLUVA turbo. But make no mistake, if one can run a 12.00 on a stock turbo, he should be able run a 11.50 with a larger one. If the red or HTA green for that matter flows that much more than the stock turbo then in turn, it SHOULD give you a decent power increase. But it truly doesnt matter what kind of turbo you have unless you have a good tune. If there are guys running the same times with a stock turbo vs. a bbk or green, then the guy with the bbk or green has some problems. On paper, the power should be there, period.
This is true on E85, meth, or race gas but not so much on pump. I know many people run up over 30psi on the green but if FP and CBRD suggest 28psi is the choking point for these turbos and they will perform best at that on e85. My conclusion is that there are gains to be made with e85 or race gas "IF" these turbos hold boost better up top(which I'm sure they do) but not so much on pump. I would rather have the 300rpm quicker spool than the very few ponys up top on 93,IMHO.