More power for 2003 evo
Former Sponsor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 42
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From: Arlington Heights, IL
Originally Posted by Ted B
I don't have the boost chart handy, but both A/F and boost were logged, and AFAIK, there were no leaks. To the best of my recollection, the boost peaked at 23psi and tapered from there (as expected with the factory turbo).
The data I've seen for at least one car running ~350whp shows injector duty not reaching the practical limit (85%) until around that power level, with comparable A/F. Perhaps certain, lesser devices do not report accurately.
In any case, I do not recall noting to this point any engines with the factory turbo experiencing any fuel delivery problems with the factory injectors.
In any case, I do not recall noting to this point any engines with the factory turbo experiencing any fuel delivery problems with the factory injectors.
Intercooler aside injectors can make a big difference on a stock turbo'd car. I have seen three cases where a customer has brought the car in and was hitting fuel cut with the colder weather here. after putting in some larger 680 cc injectors and retuning the car the fuel cut problem went away. our stages were mapped out with true to life Dyno numbers. We would never recomend a part to a customer that was not necessary. Thats just bad buisness.
Eric
Eric
Originally Posted by AutoMotoSports
I have seen three cases where a customer has brought the car in and was hitting fuel cut with the colder weather here. after putting in some larger 680 cc injectors and retuning the car the fuel cut problem went away.
Yes I believe I have read many things about the power loss from using a aftermarket intake vs stock intake. Thats why my hks suction is just hanging aroud in my room. Maybe I should just sell it and just keep using my currently stock one with the k&n drop in?
So what do you recommend. A reflash then I go get the super-afc2, mbc or ebc, and get it tuned then?
So what do you recommend. A reflash then I go get the super-afc2, mbc or ebc, and get it tuned then?
Originally Posted by Ted B
Some of things I read in these threads are just ridiculous.
You don't need a larger IC...unless you are going to a bigger turbo.
You don't need larger injectors...unless you are going to a bigger turbo.
You don't need head studs...unless you're running higher (e.g. >24psi) boost pressures - and you won't be.
You don't need just about anything in Ang Wen Yan's post.
If you want more power and likewise want to keep it discreet, here's what you should consider...
3" turbo-back exhaust setup. The larger cat and cat-back alone are not enough to get everything you can from the exhaust. Whether you do it half-way or all the way should make no difference to the dealer, and since you cannot hide any of it, you may as well do ALL of it. I've not heard of a dealer attempting to negate warranty work on the count of an exhaust system.
The 255lph fuel pump is worthwhile, inexpensive, and fixes the only weak link in the fueling system. With this, your fueling system is good for a hypothetical 350whp or so.
Don't expect much from the aftermarket intake. The factory intake is not a restriction, and there are cars running 11sec E.T.'s with it.
The safc and MBC are ok if you like fiddling with it, but adhere to what Corey said above...without a means of recalibrating certain pertinent issues in the ECU, you will be limited. A reflash is invisible to the dealer, but not to the dyno.
Finally, another 'invisible' mod that is worthwhile would be HKS 264 cams. The car will idle like stock, but can pick up quite a bit of power with proper tuning (e.g. reflash).
You don't need a larger IC...unless you are going to a bigger turbo.
You don't need larger injectors...unless you are going to a bigger turbo.
You don't need head studs...unless you're running higher (e.g. >24psi) boost pressures - and you won't be.
You don't need just about anything in Ang Wen Yan's post.
If you want more power and likewise want to keep it discreet, here's what you should consider...
3" turbo-back exhaust setup. The larger cat and cat-back alone are not enough to get everything you can from the exhaust. Whether you do it half-way or all the way should make no difference to the dealer, and since you cannot hide any of it, you may as well do ALL of it. I've not heard of a dealer attempting to negate warranty work on the count of an exhaust system.
The 255lph fuel pump is worthwhile, inexpensive, and fixes the only weak link in the fueling system. With this, your fueling system is good for a hypothetical 350whp or so.
Don't expect much from the aftermarket intake. The factory intake is not a restriction, and there are cars running 11sec E.T.'s with it.
The safc and MBC are ok if you like fiddling with it, but adhere to what Corey said above...without a means of recalibrating certain pertinent issues in the ECU, you will be limited. A reflash is invisible to the dealer, but not to the dyno.
Finally, another 'invisible' mod that is worthwhile would be HKS 264 cams. The car will idle like stock, but can pick up quite a bit of power with proper tuning (e.g. reflash).
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From: Wilmington NC/ Carolina Beach
Corey said it best, throw in some injectors and you've got yourself a great machine. Plus you haven't spent that much money for the amount of power you'll get from those mods.
Former Sponsor
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 42
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From: Arlington Heights, IL
www.automotosports.com/images/EVOstageII_1.jpg
www.automotosports.com/images/EVOstageII_2.jpg
Read these 2 pages about our FMIC. It also proves that a bigger FMIC w/ the stock turbo can make more power.
www.automotosports.com/images/EVOstageII_2.jpg
Read these 2 pages about our FMIC. It also proves that a bigger FMIC w/ the stock turbo can make more power.
Originally Posted by Ted B
Yes, our Malaysian friend Ang Wen Yan's post reads like a Christmas wishlist gone insane. I suspect he was foaming at the mouth as he typed it.
Originally Posted by hkfeet
Yes I believe I have read many things about the power loss from using a aftermarket intake vs stock intake. Thats why my hks suction is just hanging aroud in my room. Maybe I should just sell it and just keep using my currently stock one with the k&n drop in?
So what do you recommend. A reflash then I go get the super-afc2, mbc or ebc, and get it tuned then?
So what do you recommend. A reflash then I go get the super-afc2, mbc or ebc, and get it tuned then?
If your long range plans are greater, it would be to your benefit to forget about the mbc and safc in favor of dyno tuning and something like an Xede, but that is up to your eventual goals.
As for the HKS intake, if it's an issue of money, you can do without it. Aftermarket intakes tend to be at least 85% bling factor.
Originally Posted by Ted B
The data I've seen for at least one car running ~350whp shows injector duty not reaching the practical limit (85%) until around that power level, with comparable A/F. Perhaps certain, lesser devices do not report accurately.
In any case, I do not recall noting to this point any engines with the factory turbo experiencing any fuel delivery problems with the factory injectors.
In any case, I do not recall noting to this point any engines with the factory turbo experiencing any fuel delivery problems with the factory injectors.
With my current aftermarket turbo tuned to 11.2-11.5 AFR, running 680cc/min injectors and a Walbro 225lph fuel pump, I'm seeing 70-75% IDCs. This car recently dyno'd 350WHP on a Dynojet. Take it for what it's worth.
I've argued this point before. I certainly don't feel like a fool advising someone to upgrade their injectors at the proposed mod levels, especially if this person even remotely contemplates taking their car to the track, dumping in some C16 or 100octane fuel and cranking the boost up to 23-24psi. Any margin of safety you once enjoyed with the stock injectors has now evaporated under these operating conditions.
Yea Im not into bling or rice. The stock intake looks good imo anyways. In fact I am going to look for a 02-03 lancer trunk at some junkyards today to replace my trunk. I know the wing is tradition, but I would like to take it off and see if I can get less attention with the car.
Originally Posted by propellerhead
I certainly don't feel like a fool advising someone to upgrade their injectors at the proposed mod levels...
Originally Posted by Ted B
Well, that's just it. In this case, we are talking about someone who is not even contemplating mods that approach this level, and therefore even if your data proves to be accurate, the argument is still relatively moot at this point in time.
I still stand by my statment that a turbo upgrade is not the only criteria for considering upgraded injectors. I'm not casting fear, uncertainty and doubt here. I'm just relaying my own personal observations in regards to IDCs. I have no stake in what he buys for upgrades.
