I really wish the dyno warriors could figure out the method to their own madness... unless those "many people" ran on the same dyno as soon as he backed off, that statement is utterly inconclusive. Even then, there are a hand full of variables that would keep even a back to back run on the same dyno from being an "apples to apples" comparison. You'd still be talking about two different cars... look at the variance in bone stock Evos from car to car! Too many (the majority it seems) worship at the alter of "numbers" mistaking them for "results".

 

The timing wasn't touched?

Your off the chart rich in boost?

Doesn't sound like your tuned for the alcohol at all.

 

I don't think the timing was changed from the non alky map for safety reasons. The fuel was leaned out alot though.

I think their sniffer was messed up because the car was street tuned to 10.1:1 afr with a motec wideband 30min. before those dyno pulls. I have a Zeitronix that says I'm running 10.2-10.5 afr now. I believe the Alky makes it look richer than it really is also.

 

I thought 330whp was average for cams and 93 octane on a dynojet? +25whp sounds ok for adding the alky. Supposedly the Ultimate dyno reads pretty low for a dynojet. The guys at the shop were pretty impressed with the numbers and they have dynoed alot of different EVO's. They showed me some plots from EVO's with upgraded turbos and I was making alot more power than them until 6k or so. My car has a very usable powerband which makes it tons of fun to drive.

Even if the numbers seem low to some, that was the amount of mods necessary to bring my car to this level. Just adding cams and alky made a BIG difference. Of course Al's reflash helped a bit too

For comparison, here is the old vs. new setup on the same dyno almost same conditions. Old setup was with a Works II flash and everything except the cams and alky.




So cams, alky and retune added almost 100ft/lbs of tq and dropped my e.t. by almost a second.

 

Unfortunately a stupid rich burn without enough timing results in low power.

But if covers Al's ***.

 

Low power? Over 350 ft/lbs. of tq hits pretty damn hard. Lower, yes. There is a guy with buschur stage4 that made over 400whp on alky, but he was tuned to 12:1. I think that he is probably more concerned with drag racing though. I'm not sure how aggressive you can go on the afr for a road race setup and I don't really want to be the one to find out. I've raced this car all weekend long, passing everybody in my group without a hicup. My EGT's are nice and low.

 

I heard 280's makes good numbers. I'm actually thinking of installing 280 to replace my 272's. Are you running stock ems?

 

That power is a tad low, but as Zeus said....not conclusive.

Also, leaning out your A/F 1 point doesn't give you gobs of power. He has a good tune for what he does, road racing. Already blowing air so freakin hot into his motor because the turbo is waay out of efficiency range at 22psi 7800 rpms. The alky does more for that than anything else....his fuel def doesn't need to be leaned out much for that application.

Now, by timing not being touched....do you mean stock timing? Or, did you have some timing pulled from the previous tune and he just left it that way? Because stock timing isn't unaggressive running 28psi falling to 22.....

 

Stock timing. Al said he could probably add a degree in, but the car felt so fast he didn't think it was necessary. I agreed.

 

Hey Lurks, to back this up, when MadMsheen dyno'd there, he was getting 297whp with AFRs below 10. He then went to Extreme and dyno'd 299 but with AFRS in the low 11s. It may have been slightly hotter, but this was within a month and with NOTHING changed or added. At most, his boost was a little higher, but that's it. We had intended on doing a LOT of fuel adjustment with an S-AFC on top of the flash, but when we dyno'd it, the AFRs were suddenly back to normal instead of off-the-charts low like at Ultimate. Perhaps you were experiencing the same thing? I think maybe their sniffer is messed up...

 

If they were dynojet a/f readouts, might as well throw it in the trash. A accurate a/f readout would come from a load-bearing dyno which a dynojet is not.

 

Good meeting you on saturday and watching some of the runs. I'll definitely hit you up in a couple weeks when I return from seeing Al in Pittsburgh.

Mike

 

I have to agree with Ct9a GSR on the point that hes making decent power for how rich of a tune that it. However if you're going to run boost that high conservativism seems kinda...negated. Haha, oh well, to be honest with you I'd lean it out a bit and squeeze some more out of there why not? A little leaner won't hurt and you'll have more fun, not even that much just like maybe .5 leaner.